Bob Dopolina 

Both Campagnolo and gruppo are Italian. That is what I call them. For Sram I say group. Shimano as well.

Do you have another name for Ferrari? Versace? Volkswagen? Ping Pong? Espresso?

Bah Humbug

Me three. Brifter brifter brifter.


Brifter.

Bah Humbug

No, but I call Ferraris and Volkswagens (and Hondas) "cars". Because I'm speaking (or writing) English. And the noun is determined by the language in use, not the language of the manufacturer.

canam73

I understand that. It is pretentious.

No, Bah Humbug explained why.

iamtim

Good god. I'm so glad to see that BF doesn't change much between months of absence.

But what brought me to this thread in the first place: not going 11 speed? Damn, I'm still on 9 speed, not even contemplating 10 speed for a while. Although I did have a 10 speed 'cross bike for a while.

...

Which, of course, brings no more value to this thread than does meta-discussion about words like "brifters".

Bob Dopolina 

Not proper nouns.

The English language is crammed full of foreign words that have been adopted for use in the English language. We do it all the time and will continue to do it as this is how our language evolved. Ignoring this fact is just silly.

And yes, we also make up words as well. That is one of the reasons English as a second language is so difficult. It keeps changing and doesn't have consistent roots which leads to all the funky spelling exceptions.

Call me pretentious if you like but I have lived outside of NA most of my adult life and there are all kinds of words I use that are not English because of my experiences and because those words best convey what I mean.

"Brifter" is not a more effective word, does nothing to improve communication or understanding and sounds lazy to my ears.

YMMV.

RJM

Dual control shifters would work too...but I like calling them Brifters. Kind of like calling bar end shifters "barcons." Everybody knows what you are saying and the word just fits. Shifter is vague and needs context to work as a descriptive term.

Bob Dopolina 

Valid point on barcons.

See post #25 . "Brifters" also requires further explanation.

bigfred 

I have levers in the garage that do nothing but brake a bike. They're called Brake Levers.
I also have levers that shift the gears of a bike. They're call Shifting Levers.
I also have some contraptions which shift gears without the use of levers at all. Shifters.
Then I have some mechanical devices that perform both the functions of braking and shifting in a single unit. Guess what they get called? Brifters!
It just makes sense.

Bob Dopolina 

I have never owned a set of "brifters" nor will I even use the term as a collective noun.

I do have some Ergo levers and even some old STI levers but no Dual Tap levers as I am not a fan. Does this also make sense and, in fact, is it even more succinct?

Bob Dopolina 

Only to the monolingual. Try to get out more.

Bob Dopolina 

I can't hear you! La, la la la la!

chaadster

More succinct, but less accurate. BigFred covered the same three you did, plus almost every other brake lever, shifter, and brifter ever put into production for the small word count penalty of two!

canam73

Well, your correct in that 'group' is based on the word gruppo, or whatever the Latin word is. But that doesn't give a legitimate reason to put a single, easily translated Italian word into an otherwise English conversation. Other than to be a pretentious cycling elitist.

A better comparison than your Ferrari or Versace would be saying "my freni are Record". Would you say that in a conversation in English?

Like you, I don't care for the term brifter. But it it is similar to barcon in that it only has one meaning in cycling: a dual control shifter brake lever. That cannot be said of shifters. And needing to say Ergo before whatever campy lever and STI before a specific shimano model? Really effing pretentious.

RollCNY

You don't have Dual Tap. You either have Double Tap (SRAM) or Dual Control (Shimano) levers. I agree with you on the anti-brifter platform. Outside of BF, I have never heard it. I believe that terms should be described by the name given by the manufacturer, lest chaos reign.

Bob Dopolina 

Incorrect. He used a collective noun that requires further explanation. Try buying shifter cables for your "brifters" and see what happens.

Bob Dopolina 

.

I stand corrected. I am fighting autocorrect every step of the way. Interesting that "brifters" keeps getting corrected.

canam73

That last I looked, every manufacturer had some BS tag given to every component they make. Why apply this separation to control levers and not to their brakes, rings and derailleurs? Would you say a bike has SRAM Pitstop brake cables and not just Sram cables? Why not? Campy and shimano don't have Pitstop cables.

bigfred 

All of them commercial trademarks of their respective companies. Would you require me to blow my nose in a Kleenex? Or, will a tissue suffice?

What of the instance where I am debating, discussing or enquiring of the qualities of the debated components without regard to manufacturer? Am I to be forever burdened with writing out, "Ergo Lever/STI/Double Tap" when I could simply use "brifter" to indentify all such components that perfrom both functions while elimating all those which serve a single function.

For instance, take these two thread titles: "Which is the most durable Ergo Lever/STI/Double Tap/MicroShift?" or "Which is the most durable brifter?"

To use the word "shifter" would not be correct in the least. It would include options that are not to be considered.
Nor would "levers" work. Again, too generic.
If the discussion is to be limited to components that perform these two primary purposes our choices are either "brifter" or "integrated shift & brake levers".

Sorry Bob, but at some point you'll have to bow to accept that "brifter" has entered into correct usage as much as some of your beloved foreign words have made their way into the dictionary and correct usage.

3alarmer 

.
.
...#briftertrash_are_all_wheelsuckers_anyway .

chaadster

You can always drill down if needed, right? I mean, saying Ergo levers doesn't do anything to differentiate between Athena Ergopower Powershift and older Athena Ergopower Ultrashift, for instance, does it?

Get on the brighter, er brifter, train, Bobbito.

Bob Dopolina 

We agree on barcon. That has been the generally accepted term from the beginning. "brifters" seems to be a 41 thing.

Having worked in a retail shop for many years I had to clarify these kinds of things almost every day with customers. Ergo or STI gave me important information and helped move the conversation along. "Brifters" would only lead me to asking more questions so I don't understand the reason for it even to exist.

Bob Dopolina 

I will never say the b word and you can't make me.

Now I'm off for a ride. It is a beautiful, sunny day.

bigfred 

And, in my example you are incorrect. When it is used in reference to a collection of or more than one manufacturer of such components it does not require further explanation.

If I were to be selling a box filled with a random collection of disfunction integrated brake & shifting levers and nothing but such components, from a variety of manufacturers, would there be a better or more succinct way of describing them than : "One box of random, broken, brifters."?

chaadster

BigFred, I think Bdop took is Bthings and went for a ride!