And part of your statement was about safety. Brifters do not improve safety. At all. It is an illusion at best. If brifters are the difference between staying balanced and crashing, then you are not fit to be riding in active traffic.
The brifters allow you to shift without moving your hands from the hoods. Can the DT shifters do that?
My wife's old bike has older Sora thumb shifters. They shift cleanly and reliably.
Shifting is all about maintenance. Poorly setup Dura-Ace can shift badly, well maintained 2300 should shift fine.
The lever throw is longer/stiffer than Ultegra, but functionally it still shifts crisply and runs quietly. The only part I hate is that the thumb buttons are in exactly the wrong place.
Also, let me get this straight the main argument against the brifters is that you can't up-shift in the drops. To which the solution is not being able to up or down-shift from the drops?
The downtube shifters on the mirage really aren't bad. I really like them because they are simple to adjust and maintain. I probably would have considered the super mirage if it were an option for me (sold out) when I ordered my mirage, but I am happy with my choice. Honestly, I would save the money on the shifters and use it on a different saddle unless you'd be able to swing the money for both.
I say downtube, in friction mode.
It just isn't that hard, working on your bike's drivetrain is super simple with downtubes, it's cleaner looking, and you can drop the entire cassette in one motion when you find you are going up a hill that is just way too hard for your knees.
I just hate sora and below brifters and am a little bummed my two bikes don't have downtube bosses.
But honestly, for 400 bucks I would be looking at a used bike and skip the entire bikes direct stuff.
Alot of good words spoken here on both sides of the coin. Indexed down-tubes shift very well, however, you are still reaching down/getting a hesitation prior to the shift. However, they are always lighter and easier to maintain / service. No real reason to complain about Sora anymore regarding reliability. It's solid, but like any shifter, only as good as the person setting up / maintaining the bike. No it's not fun shifting from the drops. But how much are you in the drops? I can't imagine Claris being much different. The question is, what would you prefer, or want to have. Me, for $50 would definitely to to the SIS system. However, I've been using it for quite a few years.Quote:
A lot of people seem to be making this mistake, so let me correct it: these are INDEXED downtube shifters. Not friction! Indexed. With clicks. 90% of what's challenging about DT shifters are eliminated with indexing. The disadvantages are reduced to having to take a hand off the bars (not a big deal most of the time) and the resulting delay between thinking about shifting and executing it.
I think this is kind of a toss-up. I really like indexed downtube shifters. A lot. But I think shifting in the drops is about equally difficult for both. You either reach your hand down to the downtube, or up to the top of the hood. The latter is probably a bit more awkward, but you have to move a hand either way. I do think downtube shifters are unfairly maligned by those with little experience with them, or by people thinking about crummy friction shifters, but I also think that integrated shifters are an improvement. I don't have a lot of experience with the non-group Shimano stuff, but I do know it's better than ever and also probably unfairly maligned by people who remember the early days of Sora and haven't used the cheap stuff since then. But it's hard for me to make an actual recommendation.
The Super Mirage also appears to have DT shifter braze-ons. For $50 more get the bike with brifters. If you don't like them, you can sell them and get DT shifters. The sunrace 8sp DT shifters are like $20.
A lot of snow still on the ground apparently. WOW!
Holy... Imagine if STI's/Ergos/SRAM stuff had never come along.
POOF! 90% of the Forum here would disappear.
Brifters are great if you are shifting a lot as is often the case riding with a group or racing.
Downtubes - You can rip through gears which is nice in some situations. Infinite trim on the front is nice too as is the friction option if things get a little funky. Cables are easier to replace on the road.
One definite advantage to downtubes for me is brake lever choice.
I would buy the downtube bike. While I also would personally rather have a good DT setup than a low end brifter setup, my judgement is that the Mirage comes in a much nicer color. The black fork is unfortunate, but it's still a great looking, classic bike.
You can always swap the DT's for some bar end shifters (barcons) that will let you keep your hands on the bars while shifting. You might be able to just buy the pods and reuse the DT's.
Functionally, I think the difference between barcons and brifters is negligible. Same with index versus friction.
I think it depends a lot on the environment. I have three daughters that ride, two in Portland OR and the other in a wide open rural area with amazing bike lanes everywhere. I am concerned with their safety, risk of injury, which is a matter of exposure and consequence. IMO for the two in Portland traffic brake/shifters materially reduce the exposure (hands on bars all the time) to a situation that results in a fall. IMO in a rural area with lanes and little traffic there is a reduced likelihood of serious consequence of a fall and a lower exposure so I would not be too worried about DT.
How in the world did this become "DT shifters are more dangerous than integrated levers"? And why do people talk about this like it is an absolute truth?
FWIW, I found DT shifters to be not terribly inconvenient, the only advantages really are the simple reliable mechanism, less weight and lower cost. Keeps the cables out of sight. Switching to Sora 3400 shifting is far more convenient including, for me, shifting from the drops. To be honest I'm sometimes tempted to switch the front shifter back to the downtube since I don't shift it that frequently.
Brifters aren't that cheap, worth a $50 difference for sure, but I'd look real close at the bikes since it's probably made up somewhere else. Carbon fork for example.