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  1. #26
    pan y agua merlinextraligh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norrick View Post
    I assume they didn't have clipless pedals back then? maybe those little shoe cages that they used to wear didn't do so much for the upstroke? just a guess, all that upper body motion to help the down stroke....
    This isn't it. They had toeclips with straps, and cleated shoes. That system locks your foot to the pedal as effectively as clipless pedals.
    It's not as comfortable as clipless, and harder to get out of. but it does just as good of job turning the pedals.

    Edit: Looigi beat me to it.
    You could fall off a cliff and die.
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  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
    FTFY.

    High cadence takes a load from the legs and puts it on the aerobic system. Works better with a turbocharged aerobic system.
    Basically what I was saying without naming names.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
    This isn't it. They had toeclips with straps, and cleated shoes. That system locks your foot to the pedal as effectively as clipless pedals.
    It's not as comfortable as clipless, and harder to get out of. but it does just as good of job turning the pedals.

    Edit: Looigi beat me to it.
    I believe alot of track cyclist still use strap retention too.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
    Basically what I was saying without naming names.
    Ahhh. So there really was no point in dragging Armstrong's name into this.

    Basically what I said.

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
    I believe alot of track cyclist still use strap retention too.
    I wouldn't doubt it. That "harder to get out of" point that Merlin makes is probably a benefit on the track - no accidental unclippings.

    I've had SPD-SLs come out once or twice when they shouldn't. I imagine that happening at high speed during a sprint on a fixed-gear bike would be a very painful disaster.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by achoo View Post
    Ahhh. So there really was no point in dragging Armstrong's name into this.

    Basically what I said.
    Except that he was the posterchild for high cadence and any science derived from his performances are definitely fruit of the poisonous tree.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
    Except that he was the posterchild for high cadence and any science derived from his performances are definitely fruit of the poisonous tree.

    Sorry, I was an avid rider back in the 80s during the LeMond era, and high cadence was certainly in vogue back then. I learned to switch from mashing to spinning, and I didn't do it from trial and error, I read about it and tried it. It worked just as well for getting a loaded touring bike up a hill as for chasing down that guy in front of you.

    So maybe he was a strong adovocate, but I would suggest many others before him created the science.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    A 42x21 was also considered a tiny gear back then.

    My 70's vintage road bike sports a 55-44 crankset and a straight block.
    And you left your loafers at home, in the bedroom. And ixnay on white shoes and shorts. Its not tennis.

    No kissy face after the race either, except with a leggy blonde.

    Koblet carried a comb in his jersey pocket to make himself presentable to the ladies at the end of a race.

    Manly men, doing manly things in a manly kind of way.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinextraligh View Post
    FTFY.

    High cadence takes a load from the legs and puts it on the aerobic system. Works better with a turbocharged aerobic system.
    This is a damn good point.

  10. #35
    Mr. Dopolina Bob Dopolina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamesRL View Post
    Sorry, I was an avid rider back in the 80s during the LeMond era, and high cadence was certainly in vogue back then. I learned to switch from mashing to spinning, and I didn't do it from trial and error, I read about it and tried it. It worked just as well for getting a loaded touring bike up a hill as for chasing down that guy in front of you.

    So maybe he was a strong adovocate, but I would suggest many others before him created the science.
    Hampsten, Bugno for instance.
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  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by never_recover View Post
    Actually it's right up there with long cranks and elliptical chainrings (they come and go in cycles)...
    I see what you did there

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Dopolina View Post
    Bugno for instance.
    Probably learned that from Conconi.

  13. #38
    Coffin Dodger Pirkaus's Avatar
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    Ask anyone with bad knees, spinning is no fad.
    Watts are watts, regardless of speed the the crank.
    The cardiovascular system recovers a lot faster than anaerobic muscles in your legs.
    Having an FTP in mid six range while mashing, would be difficult without "medicinal help"
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  14. #39
    Ding! Bandera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slackerprince View Post
    So much different than the fluid, spinning style of riders today.
    This is not a modern revelation.
    In the early 70's everyone in my club rode a ~70" fixed gear for winter training to develop a fluid efficient pedaling style.
    Our coach was a track rider from the pre-WWII era who put huge emphasis on getting the most out of a gear by being efficient.
    Juniors rode restricted gears to avoid injury and develop a high cadence style.
    Every rider was strongly encouraged to compete on the track, in time trials, road races and cyclo-cross to be a well rounded rider.

    Then Eddie B. and his cohort came on the scene. Seat height went up, stems got longer and a generation of select juniors went off to Colorado Springs and came back to produce results at the International level.

    That's the 70's right there.

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  15. #40
    Senior Member THSdrummer's Avatar
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    Someone mentioned the EPO of the 90's and 00's probably had something to do with it. I'm reading The Secret Race now, and came across a page where Michele Ferrari switched Tyler to a higher cadence - transferring the load to "the cardiovascular engine and the blood". No doubt, the increased oxygen carrying capacity from EPO in the 90's and early 00's helped switch to spinning. Spinning certainly still has its place. Less knee stress and an increased ability to sustain effort over long periods of time over mashing.
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  16. #41
    Super Moderator no1mad's Avatar
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    Had to do a bit of clean up. Keep it out the locker room, m'kay? Thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by Cyril View Post
    Ride what and in what manner pleases you. Those that mind don't matter, and those that matter don't mind. srsly.
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  17. #42
    Senior Member IthaDan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by no1mad View Post
    Had to do a bit of clean up. Keep it out the locker room, m'kay? Thanks
    You forgot post #14 . Seems to me if you're going to nuke and pave, you might as delete ALL the posts, lest it happen again.

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  18. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bandera View Post
    Every rider was strongly encouraged to compete on the track, in time trials, road races and cyclo-cross to be a well rounded rider.
    Pedaling style aside alot of modern riders could use some diversity in their training to help with what seems like some lack of handling skills.

  19. #44
    Redefining Lazy Slackerprince's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THSdrummer View Post
    Someone mentioned the EPO of the 90's and 00's probably had something to do with it. I'm reading The Secret Race now, and came across a page where Michele Ferrari switched Tyler to a higher cadence - transferring the load to "the cardiovascular engine and the blood". No doubt, the increased oxygen carrying capacity from EPO in the 90's and early 00's helped switch to spinning. Spinning certainly still has its place. Less knee stress and an increased ability to sustain effort over long periods of time over mashing.
    I read The Secret Race in two sittings. Great book. Hamilton and Coyle did a great job on it.

    S
    Shut up, everything

  20. #45
    Senior Member roadwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Looigi View Post
    They wore shoes with cleats that prevented the foot from being pulled out of the toe clip without first looseing the strap. Like these: Bicycle Shoe Cleats for Toeclip Pedals $29.95 at Yellow Jersey
    And when you crashed you did not come off the bike. Someone usually had to rescue you depending on what position you ended up in after all the fun was over.

    Smoother pedaling came with more gears.
    Last edited by roadwarrior; 03-28-14 at 10:32 AM.
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  21. #46
    Senior Member roadwarrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
    Except that he was the posterchild for high cadence and any science derived from his performances are definitely fruit of the poisonous tree.
    Actually, I think you could make the case that Indurain was that poste child, but the "99'ers" would not have known that. Which is fine, but there are a lot of people out there that think Lance invented the bicycle.
    "Nothing is so typical of middling minds than to harp on the intellectual deficiencies of the slightly less smart, but considerably more successful."
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  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadwarrior View Post
    Actually, I think you could make the case that Indurain was that poste child, but the "99'ers" would not have known that. Which is fine, but there are a lot of people out there that think Lance invented the bicycle.
    And Indurain did it for the same reason LA did. Very few people here in the states are as familiar with him though.

  23. #48
    Gammal cyklist Reynolds's Avatar
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    41 was the smaller chainring available at the time, IIRC. And the riders in that video don't seem to use larger than 23 at the back.
    The tifosi are a show on their own...

  24. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by roadwarrior View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by therhodeo View Post
    Except that he was the posterchild for high cadence and any science derived from his performances are definitely fruit of the poisonous tree.
    Actually, I think you could make the case that Indurain was that poste child, but the "99'ers" would not have known that. Which is fine, but there are a lot of people out there that think Lance invented the bicycle.
    What are 99ers?

  25. #50
    Senior Member Looigi's Avatar
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    Just imagine how good Merckx would have been if he knew how to pedal properly.
    Ride more. Fret less.

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