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Road Cycling “It is by riding a bicycle that you learn the contours of a country best, since you have to sweat up the hills and coast down them. Thus you remember them as they actually are, while in a motor car only a high hill impresses you, and you have no such accurate remembrance of country you have driven through as you gain by riding a bicycle.” -- Ernest Hemingway

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Old 06-03-14, 07:14 PM   #26
freedomrider1
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I like the set i have, back tire is showing quite a bit of ware , after 2300 miles.The front not so much.So i am going to replace the back and hope they both go at the same time.
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Old 06-03-14, 08:10 PM   #27
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Suppleness by itself is not a virtue. It has to be combined with decent/acceptable flat protection and ease of roll. The best tire I've ever rode on re suppleness are Vittoria Open Corsa Evo CX. The problem is that they don't last long, and worse, they cut too easily. I always patch the cuts with Shoe Goo and also silicone RTV gels.

So, suppleness, ease of roll, longevity and decent flat protection? Pick two. Or maybe three.

I currently ride on Michelin Krylion Carbon 23mm, Conti 4000S 23mm and 25mm, and Conti 4000S II 25mm. And they are all decent tires, but I am through riding 23mm tires, as 25mm tires just give me a better and more comfortable ride.
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Old 06-03-14, 08:14 PM   #28
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Suppleness by itself is not a virtue. It has to be combined with decent/acceptable flat protection and ease of roll. The best tire I've ever rode on re suppleness are Vittoria Open Corsa Evo CX. The problem is that they don't last long, and worse, they cut too easily. I always patch the cuts with Shoe Goo and also silicone RTV gels.

So, suppleness, ease of roll, longevity and decent flat protection? Pick two. Or maybe three.

I currently ride on Michelin Krylion Carbon 23mm, Conti 4000S 23mm and 25mm, and Conti 4000S II 25mm. And they are all decent tires, but I am through riding 23mm tires, as 25mm tires just give me a better and more comfortable ride.
I'm still riding on Krylion's. Decent tires.
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Old 06-03-14, 08:49 PM   #29
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i love PRO4 SC tires, but they are not durable. They are cheap, and they ride like butter, but they are not durable. I have accepted the qualities they have, and accepted the FACT that they aren't durable.

The ride is just too good to hate their weakness.
I totally agree. I don't have too much glass where I ride, but I noticed a significant uptick in the amount of nicks cut into the Pro4's compared to the GP4000's. Totally anecdotal, but it does seem that they're less durable.
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Old 06-03-14, 09:00 PM   #30
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they're good for wear but i like a more supple ride.
If you want supple then go for the Pro4. And have fun with all the cuts, punctures, and high wear rate.
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Old 06-03-14, 09:20 PM   #31
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The rub with TPI and casings is how it's counted and terminology.

Generally, a bike tire casing is made of two plies, arranged on a bias to one another so the threads cross perpendicularly (i.e. bias ply). Those two plies, therefore, are the casing, and a count of threads per inch would include the number of threads in both the upper and lower plies.

Now, it is known that Continental, for example, folds the casing back over itself so that at the tread center, there are actually three layers (original 110tpi casing layer plus the two overlapping ends of the 110tpi casing). This creates the carcass of what they call a 330tpi tire. Note the distinctions to be made between the terms ply, casing, layers and carcass.

Most companies would report the TPI of tire as the casing count (i.e. the thread count of both plies), regardless of how many layers of casing used to create the carcass. Generally it's just a single layer, two-ply casing, although Maxxis, for example, claim to use the count of a single ply (without specifying the number of layers used in the carcass.

Adding layers of multi-ply casing to make the carcass (and get extraordinary clincher TPI counts) does not enhance the suppleness of the tire, though it does help to increase resistance to puncture flats (all else being equal). If it were possible-- and it may be, for all I know-- a carcass of single layer of single ply 110tpi casing would be more flexible (i.e. supple) than a carcass of 3 layers of dual-ply 170tpi casing (or than 3 layers of single ply 110tpi casing for that matter).

Furthermore, would a single ply 170tpi casing carcass with a dual ply puncture resistant belt (TPI unspecified) be more supple than a carcass of 3 layers of 110tpi casing (TPI measurement method-- i.e. single or dual ply casing-- unspecified)? Probably, if we presume the layers of puncture belts are not vulcanized to each other. But that's just conjecture on my part.

Anyway, all of which is to explain why GP4kSIIs are not remarkably supple by most folks' measures as "330tpi" might suggest.
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Old 06-03-14, 09:35 PM   #32
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tried the 23mm and 25mm and they're ok but not great.

running a set of shwalbe durano s tires now and so far so good.

not sure about wear yet.

I run about 105/100psi. FWIW.
I have schwalbe one tires right now and I do like them better than gp4000s though not sure about durability at this point. I run 90/100 give or take and weigh 200lbs.
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Old 06-04-14, 12:10 PM   #33
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If you want supple then go for the Pro4. And have fun with all the cuts, punctures, and high wear rate.
That's what I do.
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Old 06-04-14, 12:50 PM   #34
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I have schwalbe one tires right now and I do like them better than gp4000s though not sure about durability at this point. I run 90/100 give or take and weigh 200lbs.
I've never ridden on the Conti 4ks, even though most people I know swear by them. I currently use the Schwalbe Ones as well. I got them as an upgrade to the stock Bontrager R1s thanks to suggestions on one of the many tire threads here (pun intended). I'm impressed with the upgrade over the stock wheels. Finally all the attributes people throw about like supple, hugging the road, climbing, etc, started to make sense. My aim was to purchase something that would be considered a step above the Conti GPs but close in price. Perhaps, you should give them a shot. Wiggle was my source for them.
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Old 06-04-14, 12:56 PM   #35
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The only thing I want to be supple is *****. As for bike tires, right now I like the 4000S.
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Old 06-05-14, 06:57 AM   #36
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It's interesting what some experience with certain tires. Like I said, I'm over 2K miles on my Pro 4 set and so far, not one failure. They aren't looking heavily worn either. I ride a ton of crappy rodas here in Illinois with a ton of the usual garbage like cracks, holes, chip-seal and the like. Not problems yet.

I read another post here about a fatal sidewall cut on a GP4000...just like mine. This is the primary reason why I won't go back to them anytime soon...
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Old 06-05-14, 07:02 AM   #37
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That'd probably be mine..

Is it just me or is the Conti GP4Ks way too puncture prone for everyday use?
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Old 06-05-14, 07:51 AM   #38
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If you want supple then go for the Pro4. And have fun with all the cuts, punctures, and high wear rate.
So wait, half this thread says the Pro4 is both supple *AND* long-wearing (without punctures) and you're saying the opposite??

No way.

Not here.

Not on the BF!?!

BTW, I'm surprised nobody mentioned the Vittoria Rubino Pro Slick. I ride with a guy who swears he gets 3,000 miles out of a set and will not use another tire until or unless they change them on him. (shrug)

Amazon.com : Vittoria Rubino Pro Slick 150tpi Fold Tire : Bike Tires : Sports & Outdoors
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Old 06-05-14, 08:16 AM   #39
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Well maybe they are using the Endurance Pro4, maybe I was just unlucky? These are all just opinions of course and as such they will vary. It's ok.
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Old 06-05-14, 09:38 AM   #40
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I totally agree. I don't have too much glass where I ride, but I noticed a significant uptick in the amount of nicks cut into the Pro4's compared to the GP4000's. Totally anecdotal, but it does seem that they're less durable.
I had a similar experience. I thought the Pro4s cut very easily. I really enjoyed them while they lasted, though.
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Old 06-05-14, 12:46 PM   #41
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Pro4's are good for GP4000S haters. Until they realize the grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence.
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Old 06-05-14, 03:23 PM   #42
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Heretic!!

You are probably over-inflating them btw.
+1
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Old 06-05-14, 04:09 PM   #43
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Pro4's are good for GP4000S haters. Until they realize the grass isn't always greener on the other side of the fence.
I don't hate GP4000s, they're just meh. I don't use Pro4s either, though.
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Old 06-05-14, 04:34 PM   #44
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I don't hate GP4000s, they're just meh. I don't use Pro4s either, though.
this
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Old 06-06-14, 11:37 AM   #45
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250 miles into the new set, fatal sidewall cut. Looked up these tires and it seems sidewall cuts are common.
That is exactly why I switched to Pro 4s.
I liked the Contis but out of 6 tires two had side wall problems in the first 100km.
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Old 06-06-14, 11:40 AM   #46
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Happy with my GP4000s after 1k miles. Had them on my previous wheels and now ridding my Reynolds with them...
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Old 06-06-14, 11:41 AM   #47
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I'm curious what you guys are running over to get sidewall cuts so frequently? I've taken my GP4000s on gravel/mud/dirt paths and haven't had any issues in 3000+ miles
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Old 06-06-14, 12:30 PM   #48
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I'm curious what you guys are running over to get sidewall cuts so frequently? I've taken my GP4000s on gravel/mud/dirt paths and haven't had any issues in 3000+ miles
Nothing out of the normal...I actually noticed the cut in mine last summer 30 miles into a 100K. The tube was bulging out of the slice and hadn't failed yet. Stopped at a friend's house and had to line the tire inside/out with duct tape to finish the ride.
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Old 06-06-14, 02:24 PM   #49
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Nothing out of the normal...I actually noticed the cut in mine last summer 30 miles into a 100K. The tube was bulging out of the slice and hadn't failed yet. Stopped at a friend's house and had to line the tire inside/out with duct tape to finish the ride.
It would be out of the normal for me and the cyclists I know. I've never had a sidewall cut in my entire life (at least since '86), but I'm mostly paved, a rural/urban mix, and our dirt roads are really dirt, like hardpack. Sometimes there's loose gravel, but it's just sitting on top, it's not like a gravel road where the rocks are the road bed and surface as I've seen in some places. Is it those kinds of gravel roads you ride that give cuts?
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Old 06-06-14, 02:35 PM   #50
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sidewall cuts are from not watching where you're going.
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