shoota 

Multiple slow leaks usually means something is amiss.

UnfilteredDregs

Tubeless is great... Sprung a leak last Wednesday (glass), stopped, removed the shard, and added about 15psi to get the tire back up to pressure. Continued riding.

Ripped a daylight hole in my sidewall another time...tire held at 40psi..a bit floppy, stopped for a half hour to let the sealant settle, got the tire to hold 60psi without blowing out the plug, enough to carefully ride home on and repaired my tire.

Yeah, I have to peel dried latex off my frame and such when it happens. Takes all of 5 minutes when I wash my bike... I add sealant every 2-3 months to each tire. When I change the tire the stuff I use cleans up easily, no fuss there.

Better ride quality, can run lower pressures, no snakebites, much greater resilience to typical punctures...worth it IMO.

Niloc

That's quite the recommendation! What set-up are you and @UnfilteredDregs riding? I'm going to be building a new wheelset and thinking I might as well go tubeless. Seems like there isn't one clear system out there though.

Psimet2001 

I am not a fan of tubeless. I have had to come to the rescue of too many tubeless riders too many times. With a tube and tire you always have a solution. Running tubeless and carrying a spare tube is the only way I would run tubeless.

1. OP - multiple flats are indicative of (in order of frequency) improper inflation, poor mounting technique, not checking for initial cause and correcting it, Worn out tire, environmental conditions (goathead thorns, etc). Figure out which problem is really yours and fix it. If you do I have frequently gone 1+ years riding without any flats at all.

2. I have a ton of information regarding best practices with regard to tire mounting, diagnosing causes of flats, etc in a really old thread I start way back : https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycli...s-tip-day.html.

In particular - https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycli...ml#post6577314

I just cruised that thread - I thought I had some tips in there about how to identify the cause based on what you saw in the tube but maybe it's not in there ...but looks like I am going to come up with some more...and bump that thread..

StanSeven

Rob,

Glad to still are able to contribute lately. I forgot all about that thread which is filled with great info. Hope you continue to add advice when you can

Panza

Beautiful thread you got there. Going through all the tips.

banerjek

5 flats in 4 months is absolutely nothing depending on roads.

Are you really getting blowouts -- i.e. sudden catastrophic failure with a loud BANG or BOOM? If so, you're definitely doing something wrong. My money would be pinch flats tearing out the side of your tube causing complete failure. Hitting potholes so hard is not helping. Go around them, bunny hop them, or whatever, but don't just hit them. Otherwise you'll wreck your wheels as well as your tires.

Blowouts at the frequency you've indicated suggest underinflated tires to me. I think it is unlikely that your problems are with tube installation. If that was the issue, the problems would manifest themselves more quickly.

I would not mess with tubeless, especially given the symptoms you've described so far. I don't think they'll help at all.

Panza

Theyre not blowouts, 4/5 were small silent deflates. I'm going to inspect the tubes closely now instead of throwing them out.

banerjek

How about the last one?

For the silent deflates, 4 in 4 months isn't that bad. Inspect the tires carefully running your finger along the tire with it turned inside out. Tiny bits of wire or chips of glass/rock can work their way through and this is totally normal. These guys that say they go forever without flats are riding clean roads. I've ridden bad roads and good roads. On good roads, I can go a year without flats. On bad roads, I get loads of flats with *any* tire, including the Marathon Plus which people hype as flat proof. That blue layer does provide a huge amount of protection, particularly against glass chips, but sufficiently bad roads will wreck any tire.

As a matter of fact, you should inspect your tires for tiny embedded chips regularly and pop them out with a blade. Otherwise, they'll work their way through and puncture the tubes.

Niloc

Interesting. I wouldn't assume that I was completely flat proof and I would still carry air and a spare inner tube. My understanding is that they are immune to pinch flats and able to seal up against a lot of pin hole type punctures, but you could still get unlucky. Is that the only reason you don't like them or are there others?

Panza

Ran over a large pothole which made a tear in the tube. I'm in the New England area where ice and snow has degraded the roadsides to fissures and craters. Hah.

As long as people think that 4 in 4 isn't bad, then I guess I should just stick with it. I've just heard too many good things about tubeless, even from people riding in my group with me.

zinjack

Just want to second gatorskins. 5 flats seem a bit much but I after I moved to an area with bad roads I asked for advice and bought gatorskins.
If you have a lot of pot holes you might want to take the time to learn to bunnyhop.

wphamilton

This may sound a little harsh but it's not meant to be. Given that you felt fortunate to have a mechanic handy to fix a flat, and didn't know how to tell for certain that you have a pinch flat from a pothole, and (to me) excessively concerned about the brand of the tubes, I suspect that there are still areas of improvement possible before going to tubeless. I would look at first, your technique in changing tires, second reconsider the tire size and pressure, and third look for more durable tires.

Psimet2001 

Its a good question. I don't know that I can articulate full reasons for why I feel that way. It's just that every person that I have known who has been racing with tubeless has eventually discarded them and gone back to regular setups saying it was much easier/reliable.

When it comes to cyclocross it's not even a question - tubular far exceeds tubeless performance and in that discipline I have seen a lot of racers completely lose their races 100% because tubeless failed on them during the race. I would argue that tubular is also by far much better for regular road racing as well - over tubeless. I have picked up racers off the deck who have blown/burped their tubeless setups while cornering in races.

I'm not saying tubeless doesn't solve flats - in theory it does, but it has this nasty tendency to fail in ways that traditional setups don't.

The tires are getting better and the rims are getting better, but in general...just use a tube and worry about other stuff.

Niloc

YEah I race 'cross and I'm considering finding an used tubular wheelset to run before next season. I don't race on the road and I can't see justifying the hassles of tubulars for group rides, centuries etc. I've heard good things about tubeless from folks around here saying that they give a lot of the advantages of tubulars without the hassle. I think the technology has come a long ways since people doing ghetto conversions of clinchers. Interesting that you mention safety, one of the selling points I was told was that tubeless are safer than clinchers b/c if you have a catastrophic blowout say on a descent, the tire will stay bead locked onto the wheel, potentially saving your bacon, like a tubular would. Supposedly tubeless can be run at lower pressures and offer a suppler ride more like a tubular, I'm sure you've heard the arguments before. Anyways since I'm going to the hassle of building a new wheelset I'm tempted - and you can always just run a clincher on them if you want.

gsa103

I wonder how many of the issues with tubeless are caused by conversion kits and poor setups?

In response to other questions about the spare tube and sealant. Sealant and carrying a spare tube are to some extent mutually exclusive. To put the tube in, you've got to remove all the goopy sealant mess then install a tube in a very difficult to mount tire. Its certainly possible, but you're not going to have a fun time with it.

I agree tubeless has a whole variety of new and unique failure modes...

dvdslw

Simply amazing!

hueyhoolihan

ya, inspiring and resourceful fella. bet he may even feel blessed that he has one working elbow. he makes good use of it.

Niloc

Is it necessary to run the goop? I.e. aside from sealing punctures does it prevent air from slowly percolating out of the tire? I'm talking about a true tubeless road set-up with a tubeless rim and tubeless tire with the square bead, not a clincher conversion. I really don't get many punctures in my home riding area. I could be tempted to run tubeless tires w/o goop and if I flat, either put goop in and inflate or put in a tube and fix the puncture later (if that's possible).

alexaschwanden

Bad luck happens to the best of us, don't worry about it.

gsa103

Sealant is not required. I'm currently running DA C24 tubeless with Schwalbe One tires and no sealant without any issues. The leakdown rate is similar to a standard inner tube. I'm running without sealant because I didn't like reports of sealant causing corrosion on the DA rims.

elcruxio

Mavic cxp33 rim and a stans conversion kit with hutchinson intensives. A beautiful setup but tire is a bit thin to my liking. The other one is going to be our touring wheelset with a mavic a319 rim and schwalbe one 28mm. I'm sealing those with tesa tape which should be the same stan uses. I guess gorilla tape would work as well.
Cyclocross tubeless has always been a bad idea from the start. Those failures should not be attributed to road tubeless. Apples and oranges. If someone has ever burped a tubeless road tire in a corner it's most likely a user error trying to use too low pressures. With those pressures a tubed system would likely roll over as well. It's not really about the lower pressure in tubeless. It's about ride quality and puncture resistance.

And of course one should carry a tube. Forgetting to take precautions is again not the fault of the system but fault of the user.

Simple. Pour sealant out, put tube in, inflate and ride on.

Can't really say anything the unique failure modes. They are pretty much the same as with tubes but you don't get the dangerous rapid decompression of a tubed tire.

Use sealant. It makes the system better and life easier. Inflating on roadside pretty much requires a tube or co2 and co2 doesn't work well with sealant. Just use it from the start and carry a tube and a patch kit as you normally would.

v70cat

Are you checking the tires in the morning with a gauge?

krobinson103

20000km a year over 4 different bikes. Some weeks I get three flats some months none. Oover a year I'll get at least 20. Ride enough distance its plain going to happen.

danmc

I think my #1 advice for noobs regarding tires is to practice changing your tire multiple times at home, while watching TV or listening to music while you have free time. And practice using the pump that you will be carrying with you. When I got my road bike a couple of years ago it was the first time I had Presta valves, and my first flat I didn't know how to use them! Took me about 30 minutes to figure out you had to unscrew it...I may be slow but I'm not stupid!Also, these mini-pumps can be a pain to use so get used to it at home rather than on the road...in the rain...while it's getting dark. I had a guy stop me on the MUP a couple of weeks ago needing a pump for his Schrader valved tube and I couldn't figure out how to convert my Road Morph G from the Schrader setting. Got home and saw that it was simple.

You don't want to be learning how to do these things for the first time out on a country road with a junkyard dog growling a few feet away and the sounds of "Dueling Banjos" playing in the background.