DaveQB

Hi,

I did a search but couldn't find a thread on shoes started in the last few years, so started a new one.

A mate of mine got me into road cycling about a year ago. Back then I thought I'd spent the least to get up and running as I didn't know how long I'd be doing it. Fast forward a year and I am thoroughly enjoying it.

I had bought myself a $40 pair of Bontragers that look identical to these but were sold to me as a plastic sole:


Bontrager Race DLX Road Shoes - bikeline.com

They look good and seem ok, but I my feet are going to sleep in them, particularly when I am pushing hard for awhile. It starts right where my cleats attach and spreads around the top of the foot.

I can also trigger this numbness by standing on a flat surface with them for a few minutes (say chatting or whatever).

So my question is, is there something I am doing wrong, or is it simply the limitations of the shoes?

I am using speedplay cleats if that makes a difference.

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

Silvercivic27

Try loosening up your shoe a little. Sometimes that helps.

DaveQB

Yes good one. I have found not doing up the two velcro straps too tight has helped stop it from happening all the time. Now it only happens when I am pushing hard for 30mins. I am wondering if the sole is flexing and thus not spreading the force over the whole foot, hence the ball of the foot going to sleep first and then spreading.
Or maybe I am totally off track. Don't know what I am talking about

coasting 

happens to me with narrower shoes. i need wide fitting shoes and shimano shoes seem to work for me.

Cookiemonsta

Your foot going to sleep means that the blood flow is cut of or reduced due to either the position of the foot or the tightness of the shoe.

One mistake people sometimes make is that they strap in their foot really tightly. Instead, try to keep the velcro and strap a little loose. Additionally, think about the position of your foot. You may want to change the position of the cleat a little as this might avoid the position in which your foot gets decreased bloodflow.

Because you say that it happens when standing on a flat surface, I personally suspect that the shoes are too tight near the top of your foot. When you stand on these with the cleats, the nose of the shoe points upward and there is more pressure on the top of your foot *( where the strap is).

Where the numbness starts is not necessarily where it originates from. Typically, it starts in the extremities even if that is not where the blood flow is cut off (you feel it because it is actually the farthest point from it).

johnny99

If the shoe is too narrow, even loosening it may not help.
If the shoe is the right width, sometimes a softer insole (like the cheap memory foam insoles sold in drug stores) can make a huge difference.
Poorly positioned cleats can also cause numbness (usually too far forward).

berner

I was having similar discomfort. Now I keep the lower straps loose. Also I've added metatarsal pads under the ball of the foot in the cycling shoes and my ski boots. Ski boots, like cycling shoes, are designed to have no extra space so sometimes are too tight.

DaveQB

Thanks coasting. Good point. Although I have been measured to have a narrow foot while growing up. Not sure if that has changed since then.


Thanks Cookiemonsta
Lots of good informaiton there. I was of the understanding that you want the shoe to be pretty tight so as to not lose power. Have I mis-understood that?

Interesting about the cleat positioning. I haven't played with that since I setup my speedplay. I tried to line up the cleats do the pedal would right right over the ball of the foot. Which direction should I be moving it?

Thanks johnny99
My mate did say awhile ago that insoles are a great benefit. I had forgotten about that. I'll add that to my shoping list


Thanks berner I will be buying some insoles. What are metatarsal pads exactly?

Cookiemonsta

I have never heard that you should have the shoes tight to not lose power. In fact, the most common thing people tell new cyclists is to go for the larger size when in doubt about which size to take. And the most common complaint I hear about cycling shoes is pain caused by shoes being either too small (length wise), too narrow, or too tight at a specific spot. Shoes were not designed to strap your feet in as tight as possible. In fact, a lot of models noticeably give the foot breathing room. Instead, what people look for in shoes is ventilation, weight, rigidity of the outsole and so on.

About the cleat positioning, this is something you just need to try for yourself. However, given my suspicion that blood is cut off near the top of the foot I would try to move them backward towards the heel (so your foot will be further forward when clipped in).

berner

https://www.google.com/search?q=meta...a&channel=fflb They are inexpensive and available mail order or at your nearest pharmacy. So inexpensive you can try them for little cost. If they don't work for you, nothing lost. They install under the ball of the foot.

Long Tom

Just another thought to add... for myself, foot numbness is exacerbated by mashing rather than spinning circles. Often paying attention to that during a ride will take care of it. It greatly reduces the compressive load on the bottom of the foot.

Darth Steele

I have spent the past year trying to solve this issue for myself. It doesn't happen to me anymore

without knowing any more information it sounds like you may have flat feet (same as me). Basically the metatarsal nerve is being squeezed which gives the sensation of your foot falling asleep.

Go into your LBS and have them to do a specialized foot test. Essentially you can stand on a mat and they can tell you which "insole/foot bed" that you need.



tips:
On down hills upclip a foot and let it dangle until the the foot returns to normal.
At rest stop take off your shoes, its ok to walk around in your socks.
at stop lights unclip both shoes
look up metatarsal exercises


I bought the specialized BG Footbed which has a built in metatarsal button. Which is basically a bump in the insole designed to spread the area where the metatarsal nerve is being squeezed. I also taped a penny under that area as well. It also turns out that my each foot required a different footbed. Also I bought Sidi Mega shoes (mega means wide)


look up "Metatarsal and Cycling" in google.

DaveQB

Thanks for the response.

I have heard it explained as such that with the easy to tighten and loose straps on today's shoes, you can tighten up your shoes for a climb and then ease them off once on the flat or descent. Any movement in the shoe means not all power is transferred to the pedal.

Cool. I will be trying this for this weekends riding. How much? 2-3mm?


Thanks for the response.

So they stick on to your foot? Do they move around on your foot during a longer ride?
Sounds interesting, but a little bit of a PITA. An insole in your shoe would be more seamless I would think, but I might give them a try.

Thanks for the response.

Do you mean being in a too hard of a gear or you mean a technique in pedalling?


Thanks for the response.

What is LBS? Sounds like a good idea to test my foot flatness or lack thereof to know what I am dealing with. My physio mate says human feet all flatten with time/age, just the rate varies from person to person.

Those BG Footbed look high tech. I'll look into them, thanks.


I spoke to the guy at my local bicycle shop and he is saying cleat position is the first thing to try. So I am going to try that for this weekend and go from there with all of the other ideas.

Thanks everyone for your responses, appreciate it.

joeyduck

I also find not tightening my straps too much helps. The weirdest correlation I have found is if I let my toe nails get too long they seem to fall asleep more often.

EastTNrider

New to cycling and having this problem BIG time! Would love to know if/when you find something that works! I've tried loosening my straps and try to lift my foot off the pedal inside the shoes and wiggle my toes on down hills when I'm not pedaling. That has definitely helped but haven't found a way to get rid of it yet

fimy

Same thing happening to me. Used to be mostly just in the left foot for whatever reason but on today's ride pretty much all my toes were numb by the end of the ride. Was going to try thicker socks, but insoles sound like a more effective route. Happens in my ski boots as well, probably a similar effect with the pressure on the ball of my foot.

3alarmer 

...I'm currently trying to work on a similar issue, already have Shimano shoes, and just bought some Specialized BG SL footbeds in the blue arch variety.
If they work miraculously, I'll let you know. If they don't, REI sells Superfeet, which work for some people, and that's my next stop.

With most people, it seems to be related to squeezing the long bones that lead out to your toes, and compression and irritation of the nerves that go through there.


So the usual first things to try are creating more space for your toes and forefoot, and maybe a support for the arch and a metatarsal button to counterflex at that point.


I've been ignoring it for about six months, hoping it would go away, because I never had the issue before, and nothing's changed but aging.
If you ignore it long enough, you can apparently do some damage that takes a while to reverse itself....thus time off the bike.

Some other things you can do are some yoga stuff to lengthen and strengthen the supporting tissues, and especially the one sometimes
called "shake hands with the feet", where you interlace your fingers in between your toes, pushing them all the way down between them,
and then use a circular motion to massage and twist your forefoot, ball of the foot, and arch. Do it when you're watching TV or something.

DaveQB

I wouldn't mind if it was only my toes nails going to sleep


I ended up moving my cleats down as far as they can go and trying to do what you stated there. It is certainly better, but not entirely gone. I have a mate who has just started joining in in our weekly cycle and he now has this problem too. I am wondering if it is related to shoes and just happening to find the right shoes for your specific anatomy of you feet.

I haven't tried insoles yet. Let me know how you go if you do.

Superfeet?

I have heard this, although I don't think mine last long enough to cause a long term issue. One of the guys I cycle with is a physio and he mentioned this but said it if 60+ mins of numbness consistently will cause an issue.

That sounds like an odd joke....but I am willing to try it!

Flyingblind9

I also second this. During my rides, even though I use a Shimano shoe with SPD SL cleats, I have to loosen it up as your feet will swell in size a bit as you get into your exercise routine. My toes would go numb, and if I waited long enough most of my foot as blood circulation was cut off. Periodically I might even unclip and shake my leg out as I'm riding because the pressure on the bottom of your foot after awhile can cause numbness.

bbattle

I have low arches and wide feet; I use the Superfeet black insoles in my cycling shoes. Go shoe shopping with a thick pair of socks on so when out cycling in thin socks your feet have some room. Your feet will swell during your rides.

LBS = local bike shop

Mashing is using too high(hard) a gear.
Spinning is using a lower gear(easier) gear at a higher cadence(rpm).

You should be able to wiggle your toes as you ride. It also helps to unclip and shake your feet. Another trick is to pull up on the pedals for a bit instead of pushing down.

Cleat position is very important and small changes can make a big difference. In addition to fore/aft changes, try moving the cleat sideways.

Darth Steele

you probably have flat feet and your metatarsal bone is pushing up against the nerve causing that "sleeping" sensation

lol, I have literally become an expert trying to solve this issues for myself. I use the specialized BG Foot bed with the metatarsal button.

- When you "mash" this problem becomes more pronounced. Spin at a higher cadence
- If possible on the descents un-clip and let your foot dangle. This will release the stress on the nerve.
- There are tons of metatarsal exercises out there, start doing them, I usually do them through out the day at work
- Make sure that your shoes are not too tight.
- At rest points take your shoes off, socks are cheap don't be afraid to walk around in just your socks are rest points.


And yes it still happens to me, especially when I am pushing very hard in group, but when I pull off of the front I try to move to a higher gear.

on the path

Not completely OT.. does anyone know which brands tend to generally be narrower? I've got narrow feet, bought Mavics as I was told they are a better fit for narrower feet. Any other brands come to mind? Thx..

rpecot

Wow. Same exact issue here. I found Shimano fits me well.

calliebear9

Does it happen when you do other things? Like run or walk fast or climb stairs- anything else using leg muscles? If so it could be exertional compartment syndrome. I have that in my calves. It is super annoying and painful. Basically the numbness starts in the feet and works it way up the calf the longer I exercise the muscles. I is worse running but I can pick it up now and then if I am climbing a hill on the bike. No shoe will fix that. So I hope it is your shoe that is the problem because that is a much easier fix than surgery.

EastTNrider

The only other time it happens to me is when I'm sitting straight legged in a kayak for extended periods of time, which may be the same issue I have when I'm riding