kini62

I'm 52, 5'6" generally around 155-160lbs.

Thanks

Gene

HOWSER

Good compared to what? Figure your watts per kilo then refer to this chart.

https://www.livetrainrace.com/wordp/w...ight-chart.png

profjmb

Why watts per kilo vs plain watts? I understand that for climbing and accelerating weight matters, and so maybe for racing one wants to compute power/weight. But if one is interested in one's fitness, is there a linear relation between watts and weight?

dalava

Explain what you mean?

IronHorseRiderX

Think of watts for rider as of hp for car.
Watts/hp alone will not tell you how fast rider/car is - only combination of both will.
On side it's pure human physiology - bigger rider should produce more total watts (assuming same body fat %: more muscle mass = more power).
So if you measure your own performance (as OP intended) it's important to know which category you fit in hence the whole watt/kg scale.

kini62

First thanks.

Second, not compared to anything really, just wondering what a good number would be.

So based on the above chart and my guestimation from the chart provided with my trainer (Cycle ops SuperMagneto Pro) I'm around 3.6 watts/Kg for the 20 minute column. That's if the info on the trainer curve and rear wheel speed is fairly accurate.

So, not too bad IMO.

ovoleg

Everyone is different dude. My 5s is way higher than that chart @ 18.11 W/kg, but my 20min is only 4.05 W/kg. My 1min is closer to 10 W/kg.

What matters is what you wanna do with the numbers you have and which ones you want to improve. Not many people can top out in every single category. Most climbers I know have awesome 20min W/kg, but subpar 1min and 5s.

Raw numbers don't really matter as much as W/kg.

ovoleg

My outdoors 20min is 4.05 W/kg, but indoors its closer to 3.7. Grinding it all out for 20mins indoors sounds hard.

RPK79

12

profjmb

OK

There are at least two different questions that could be asked. First, what is a good FTP for one's age and weight in terms of predicting performance in a race? Second, what is a good FTP for one's age and weight in terms of health? It makes more sense to me that performance requires taking weight into account linearly (by dividing by weight) than that health does. But I don't know, which is why I'm asking. I think that some kind of percentile table is what I have in mind.

IronHorseRiderX

That table does not look right.
Here's what Andrew Coggan uses in his books Just How Good Are These Guys? | CyclingTips
Also note that 20min power is not FTP, FTP is 60min power.
There's formula to translate 20min to FTP but it is approximation.
You can visit TP forums at Forum Home - TrainingPeaks Forums 3.0 to find more details on that.
There's number of threads related to power vs age relation as well.

bikepro

the OP asked about Functional Threshold Power, which is not the same as Watts/Kg -- both are important but not the same thing. If you want to know your FTP, the best way to find out is to test yourself. There are various ways. Here's one:

How to Find Your Functional Threshold Power for cycling. Two Test to get started using FTP

IronHorseRiderX

Depending on the type of race knowing your FTP may or may not help much - for individual events it works well (climbs, TT) but for road races and crits it is not enough.
You will need to know your 5s, 1min and perhaps 5min power as well to make better predictions and of course power alone will not substitute riding skills/strategy/experience.

You may have Cat 3 FTP and still be casually dropped on descends or at the final sprints ridging with Cat 5 guys

Same goes for healthy weight vs power thing.
What is considered "healthy weight" is a broad term, common numbers anywhere from 15% body (fit average male) to low 5% (fit competitive athletes).
You can call any number between these two "healthy" but your pure cycling performance 15% vs 5% will be very much different.

Dunbar

Surprised that nobody else picked up on the bolded part. The answer is heck no, it's not accurate but it's fine training indoors and for tracking changes in power. The only way to know your true FTP is to test on something that accurately measures power.

Height/weight provide context. If Chris Froome had Nairo Quintana's FTP he wouldn't be getting paid to race bikes.

LucF

FWIW, I'm 54, 5'11", 185 lbs. I train regularly and ride long distances but I don't focus that much on performance. My FTP for 20 minutes is 225 watts, which would yield 209 watts for an hour using a .93 factor. I doubt, however, that I could sustain 209 watts for an hour. 200 would be more realistic for me and over many hours I'm happy with 175.

My watts/kg numbers put me in the bottom fifth of the charts in all columns but I still have a ball on the road and can climb pretty much everything, given enough time.

The numbers you aim for will depend on what your goals as a cyclist are. For me, it's doing long rides (100 to 1000 km), keeping it enjoyable, feeling reasonably strong and not hurting myself. Although I strive to constantly improve (too many years doing TQM in business, I guess) I'm quite happy with marginal improvements and don't care much for my position on charts.

chaadster

Profjmb's questions lead me to wonder a couple of things. First, how many cyclist to Coggan survey to construct the table, and how does that impact comparisons to data one might glean from the tens of thousands-- hundreds of, maybe even?-- Strava users? Within that framework, what does the Veloviewer Score tell us that the Coggan chart doesn't?

Secondly, as a percentage of total cycling population, do USAC licensed racers constitute .1%? More? Less? And what percentage pros? If, say, 94% of all cyclists test an FTP of sub 2.5w/kg, a 3w/kg FTP rider, while placing amongst the top 10% of all riders, still barely breaks Coggan's lowest tier, Untrained.

My point being that, while the Coggan chart may be useful for comparing one's self to pro cyclists, it doesn't say much about how you'll stack up on the road against those you're likely to ride with and run across.

carpediemracing 

I was curious about the wattage/speed on my CycleOps Fluid 2. I am pretty consistent with tire pressure, I use the same wheel/tire on the trainer (as on the road), and I ride the trainer a lot. I typically ride at lower wattages, 120-150w avg. I found that a 39x19 @ 90 rpm, about 14.1 mph, I do about 160w. In a 39x17 @ 90 rpm, about 15.2 mph, I do about 190w. It's obviously a very coarse type measurement but it gave me some idea of what to expect and what I did.

I've raced 30+ seasons. I'm basically a life time Cat 3. I could never climb with the others (Cat 4s, 3s, and M55 women non-racers on local shop rides… seriously), never really TT (best 40k was a 1:03:30 or 23.5 mph), but because I can sprint I've been competitive in select races. Also group riding on flat roads masks FTP, reducing it to a single value, which I'll explain in a bit.

I'm 5'7", 175 lbs, 46 (just about 47). I'm probably much fatter than you unless you're a really fat skinny person. I'm a regular fat person, realistically in the 23-25% body fat range.

My FTP is about 200-220, it was about 220 when I upgraded to Cat 2 in 2010 (I downgraded in 2011). It's closer to 200w now but I haven't done a proper test in a year or two. Based on my average power in races I think it's about 200w now. This puts me under 3.0 w/kg.

Incidentally I think I was in the 13-14% range when I upgraded to Cat 2, at 155 lbs. The reality is that 5% is highly unlikely for a normal person. 10% is getting down there. This is based on real measurements, not just skin fold etc.

I think for "performance riding" knowing your FTP relative to your drag is important. For example a shorter/smaller rider with a 300w FTP might be a better time trialer than a taller rider with a 400w FTP. I'm not very good FTP-wise but I'm short/efficient on the bike, meaning I have a reasonably aero position so I'm more optimized than not.

On the other hand I can mask my low FTP in flatter mass start races. I have a reasonable sprint (20s power) so I can get up short hills and I can finish a race well. However I can't play in breaks, I've stopped entering hilly road races (and crits), and I generally use races for hard training rides.

2010, FTP about 220w, weight about 155 lbs. Training, for that year, was 450 hours for the year, last year before we decided to try to start a family. This was the best race I got on video. I upgraded to Cat 2 in August of this year. I downgraded after a very sparse 2011, plus we were expecting when I downgraded.

2014, FTP about 200w, weight about 175 lbs. Training, at the time, about 1 hour a week. I've done about 1700 miles, about 110 hours this year so far. This was a good race for me this year, especially considering how little I've been training. We have a 2 1/2 year old now

My 2010 training isn't up on Strava but 2014 is up. All my rides from April 2012 until now are online. You can see what it takes to be competitive, sort of, in Cat 3s or M45s.

I hope this helps encourage you.

Makel

13

wphamilton

Maybe someone should do a Strava chart (with its estimated power numbers) to get an distribution for normal people. Normal Strava people anyway.

I have a hard time believing the "untrained" section of Coggan's table.

caloso

According to Coggan, I should be downgraded.

kini62

Thanks (I think ) for the replies. I don't race. I've done one road bike race in my life and that was this year as the bike person on an Olympic distance tri relay team. I'll probably do the same next year. My 40K time with a flat that took about 4 minutes to get fixed was 1:08 something. The course was out and back with about 400' of gain over miles 4-12 on the way out. And it was in a pouring rain. Other than that I ride for fitness and do 99% of my riding/training on my trainer. It was mostly a curiosity thing.

My only goals are to lose some weight for next years race and hopefully be faster.

ovoleg

We answered the OP. Raw Watts means nothing, its all about W/kg when looking at FTP. Guys that put down 250W FTP but weigh only 130 lbs will drop me anyday.

l2read.

Drew Eckhardt 

It depends on how much you'd weigh without any noticeable body fat. My 215 pound peak following a broken leg and current 167 pounds don't improve my potential beyond what I had at 145-150.

Drew Eckhardt 

Except on flat ground where it's about power to drag and down-hill where it's sectional density. 235W levitates 145 pounds up mountains but isn't good for much speed on flat ground when you're 5'10" with a freakishly long torso.

ovoleg

typically guys who weigh 130 lb dont' have freakishly long torsos.

You'd need lots and lots of watts to drop someone who has a 5.0 W/kg FTP on the flats, even if they weigh 130 lbs. Not many people I know look like Chris Froome, and his FTP is likely north of 6.0 W/kg.