smontanaro 

Not sure where to go with this. I scanned the list of forums but found nothing about cycling technique. As I'm a (vintage) roadie, I figured I'd ask here. Feel free to shoo me off to another, more appropriate, forum.

I never raced, so was never coached. Now, in my early 60s, I'm trying to improve my cycling technique to stave off (as much as possible) the ravaging effects of age. This time of year, almost all my mileage is on my commute, about 25 miles round-trip, done three to five days a week. A good chunk of my commute (4.5 miles each way) is on Chicago's Lakefront Trail (LFT), which is currently almost empty. I can generally open things up without a lot of fear of being blind-sided by a four-year-old on training wheels, or a dog on a retractable leash and an inattentive owner. My daily ride is a mid-80s Trek 520 converted to fixed gear.

Though I've been focusing on it off-and-on for several months, spinning still seems to feel foreign if I concentrate on it for more than a short while (measured in tens of seconds), and I tend to tire out fairly quickly. So, I'm trying to get used to spinning more, smoothing things out, using my hamstrings more, that sort of thing. Everything I'm learning is by trial-and-error. In the past few days it finally dawned on me that if I push on the bars I can engage my hamstrings more, and if I pull, I can push harder with my quads. With the uncrowded LFT, I have the opportunity to do the occasional interval (town line sprint sort of thing). I'm looking for suggestions about drills or other tools I can use to improve my technique.

Carbonfiberboy 

First thing is that cycling is classified as a "non-technical sport," meaning that anyone can pedal and pedaling technique is not a critical component of cycling. That said, I also enjoy messing about with pedaling technique and think it helps my cycling.

Riding fixed is a little weird because the pedals push your feet around. So it's hard to get a feel for technique on the flat. To learn better to pedal circles on a fixie, I recommend climbing long hills, maybe 6%-8% for optimum results. Stay in the saddle and focus on keeping the upper body absolutely still, back straight, and neither pushing nor pulling on the bars any more than is absolutely necessary. Descending at high cadence, use the brake and focus on maintaining "forward" pressure on the pedals all the way around the circle. Never let the pedals push your feet. Do these things enough and pedaling on the flat will be much easier.

rpenmanparker 

You would be more successful spinning on a multi-gear bicycle which would allow you to select the gear that properly corresponds to spinning for the speeds that are possible and the terrain. On a single speed bike, ya just gotta do what ya gotta do.

obed7

i could be just talking out my...... but fixie and technique do not belong in the same sentence.
I have a spin rate in mind and change gears to maintain it... no such option of a fixie....

Leinster

Pro cyclists have in the past traditionally trained on fixies precisely to work on their technique. On a geared bike you can freewheel when your spinning gets too fast. No such option on a fixed gear.

OP, trial and error is probably the way to go for you right now, and it sounds like you're making progress. Spinning is hard, but is learnable, it'll just take time. The net is full of other useful skills; here's a youtube channel full of how-to's; https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...Mh0bpRqM4dtlDC

therhodeo

They also used to smoke which is equally ridiculous.

Leinster

Well there's a difference between old techniques that were wrong in the first place, and old techniques that have been overtaken by technology. One of the reasons for training on fixies was to build up the leg strength for climbing Alpine cols in a 42x22, but with compacts and 32t cassettes there's a lot less need for that now. The fact that it isn't as popular for training any more doesn't mean that riding a fixed gear on flat terrain won't help someone improve their leg speed, pedalling technique, or to keep the pedals moving forward at all times.

therhodeo

Them being popular doesn't make those things invalid but them being invalid makes the invalid.

obed7

that is not about technique, that is about building leg strength. Maybe you need to define what you mean by technique, I do not consider technique and strength to be the same thing. Not arguing that what you say did not happen, just saying it was not technique training.

chaadster

I like this critical questioning of conventional wisdom!

RollCNY

OP, it is hard to learn to spin fixed gear on flat ground unless you actually have the power to actually spin the gear ratio. People are correct that fixed gear is often used to teach form, but that is based on riding varied terrain that may take your cadence from 30 to 180 rpm in the course is a ride.

All the upper body pulling that you are doing is great sprint practice, but if you are using it to "spin", you are defeating the purpose of spinning. Spinning is all about less muscle load and more aerobic load.

So if you want to learn to spin on your current bike, put a cog on with 20-30% more teeth. You'll learn to spin quickly, and it will feel weird as hell before it ever begins to feel normal.

Carbonfiberboy 

AFAIK no current high level coaches have their riders on fixies for base training like they used to. Which has nothing to do with the OP or his question. Spinning is not technique. It's just pedaling faster with a lower pedal force. I've ridden with a national champion (woo, woo!) who normally pedals about a 60 cadence. It's hard to dismiss results. "Oh, he would have been faster if he'd geared down!" Right.

I don't think riding fixed prevents one from developing good technique. In some situations, it might make it easier because one is forced to pedal outside the normal envelope of a geared rider. That's why geared riders do high cadence and very low cadence pedaling drills. The trick is to ignore the fixed aspect and treat the bike as though it were a freewheel single speed. I used to be able to pull at 130 when I did single speed on group rides. IIRC that was about 25 or so. It's a fun thing to go out on a group ride with geared bikes, but put it in a ~70" gear and just stay with them. Big advantage over fixed is you get to stop pedaling on the descents which is pretty nuts anyway. Hey, that's why we have freewheels.

Fiery

How many riders who normally pedal about a 60 cadence do you see in a World Tour level peloton? Just because there is this one guy you know who is good at grinding doesn't mean that spinning is not better for most people.

kbarch

I think the point is: in any individual case it doesn't matter what's better for most people. As he was saying, there are no penalties or points awarded on the basis of technique or style in cycling. Which gets to the initial question. Where to discuss cycling technique? It doesn't matter. Wherever you want, people will be happy to "discuss" it with you.

gregf83 

As you get older you will naturally lose strength and power. Changing your pedalling technique is unlikely to compensate or make a meaningful difference.

On the other hand, strength training (on or off the bike) can be beneficial. Suggest you read something like Joe Friel's book (https://www.amazon.com/Cycling-Past-5...qid=1423311546) on training for old farts. Or you could start with one of his bog articles: Joe Friel - Aging and Performance

bruce19

IMO the first thing to do is to learn to pedal circles. And, nothing I know helps you do that better than rollers. If there is something better I'd be happy to know what it is.

chaadster

I'm one in a large category of very good riders who don't use rollers and think "pedaling circles" and other talk about pedaling technique is a bunch of baloney.

In my mind, there are just not that many ways to pedal, well, I mean that work, and one doesn't need to be many steps above cretin to figure it out.

bruce19

IMO and that of most coaches you are incorrect. Have you ever noticed that the pros tend to spin rather than pedal "squares?"

gregf83 

I'm not sure how you can observe that, but I think the point being made is that there are numerous research papers showing that elite cyclists do not apply uniform (or anything close) torque through the pedaling stroke. Peak force is applied around 3 o'clock as one would expect and it's about twice the average tangential force. On the upstroke most riders just unweight the pedals while applying little or no torque.

In any case, the discussion on spinning or pedaling circles, squares or triangles has little to do with the effects of aging and how one goes about mitigating the inevitable downward slope in performance.

rpenmanparker 

Training on rollers may be sufficient to developing good pedaling form (riding on rollers leaves one very little choice but to improve), but it is not necessary. In most cases one can also build form out on the road if one so desires. And there are actually two aspects of spinning, the form and the cadence. Whereas rollers may offer some advantage for improving form for those few who cannot accomplish it solely on the road, they contribute little extra to building cadence. In short, rollers are very cute, but they are not at all necessary to good bike riding.

chaadster

Pedaling squares?!?! That's a new one for me! And you think one can observe this?!?!

Alright, you're going to have explain that stuff...

big chainring 

Decades of training experience and knowledge flushed away by weekend athletes that have taken up cycling in the last few years. And by 'mericans, "cause we're going to do it our way".
Good luck with that.

Keep spinning at comfortable rates. Increase slowly. Concentrate on keeping your knees ankles feet in alignment. Be as fluid as you can. Keep the upper body still.
Bravo for commuting in Chicago in the winter.

My brother riding a Gloria track bike(circa 1950) with inch pitch gearing, 63" gear, could keep pace with our early season club rides when most of us were on geared bikes and using 80" gears. 40 years later he still can maintain high rpm's and is very fluid on the bike.

chaadster

You mean like slavery? Women voting? Using radioactive materials for luminescence in household items?

Fiery

My point is that, when it comes to technique, it is usually better to look up to the vast majority than to "this one guy that I know".

kbarch

Sure, if there is a question of what's likely to work, but I didn't think there was any doubt about that.

If one does want to develop technique, the key is physical self-awareness - the use of a cadence meter to monitor consistency and variation, group rides to observe, mimic, and be observed, etc.. Even if we agree that for the vast majority, peak efficiency falls somewhere between 80 and 100 rpm, whether ones ideal cadence is 80, 90 or 98.6 rpm one will have to discover for oneself, not by looking "up" to anyone else.

That said, a lot of folks I ride with recite the mantra of "constant effort." I admire their discipline, skill, and the seeming ease with which they regularly make long, high-speed rides. It can be rewarding, of course, but I don't feel compelled to constantly argue with the terrain and my derailleurs in order to maintain some level-effort cadence; it's not always fun and it's rarely necessary. I'm just as happy to challenge myself on a flat or take it easy up and down hills as vice versa. I'm thinking of getting a single-speed, just to mix things up (plus, some of them are the hottest looking bikes on the planet ).