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Does Giant make frames for Trek and Specialized?

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Does Giant make frames for Trek and Specialized?

Old 09-04-05, 09:06 AM
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Does Giant make frames for Trek and Specialized?

There's a guy over on FatWallet claiming that you shouldn't buy a Trek or Specialized bike, but rather buy a Giant, because Giant makes the frames for those other two companies anyway and you get the same bike with less big-name markup.

I think he's full of it, but can't find any evidence on the net to definitively point him to. I always assumed the three were distinctly separate competitors...and watching the Lance Chronicles they showed the Trek folks making the carbon frames for the Postal/Discovery bikes...which tends to tell me they at least do their own carbon frames.

Anyone know with certainty one way or the other on this issue?
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Old 09-04-05, 09:17 AM
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All aluminum Trek is made in Taiwan. All Specialized is made in Taiwan. All Giant is made in Taiwan. Giant may build frames for anyone, but they all order their own geometry and specs, so it's not true that it would be the "same bike."
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Old 09-04-05, 09:42 AM
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Merida makes frames for Specialized

Trek outsources their alum low-mid ends outside america.
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Old 09-04-05, 09:52 AM
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I've heard that the aluminum Treks are manufactured at the Giant factory... don't know about Specialized. The high end Treks are made in in the U.S.
I think the same can be said for all U.S. brands (high end at home, others in Asia) - including Cannondale for 2006.
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Old 09-04-05, 09:53 AM
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I think Merida (a big Taiwanese bike company, similar to Giant) actually owns a big chunk of Specialized. All Specialized bikes are made at the Merida factories in Taiwan, except the cheapest ones may be outsourced to mainland China.

Last time I checked, Giant did make most (maybe all) aluminum bikes for Trek. Giant has factories in both Taiwan and mainland China. I think some of the cheapest Treks are made in mainland China. My Trek dealer claimed that Trek bike quality is higher than Giant, because Trek has their own quality control people on-site at the Giant factory. Who knows?
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Old 09-04-05, 09:59 AM
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Originally Posted by johnny99
I think Merida (a big Taiwanese bike company, similar to Giant) actually owns a big chunk of Specialized. All Specialized bikes are made at the Merida factories in Taiwan, except the cheapest ones may be outsourced to mainland China.

Last time I checked, Giant did make most (maybe all) aluminum bikes for Trek. Giant has factories in both Taiwan and mainland China. I think some of the cheapest Treks are made in mainland China. My Trek dealer claimed that Trek bike quality is higher than Giant, because Trek has their own quality control people on-site at the Giant factory. Who knows?
its Trek rep bs - they used to say Giant composite frames has clay inside (when Giant had more advanced monoscope construction and Trek is/was still using lugs with prefab tubing).

A comparison between Trek's 1000, 1200, all the way to 2200 alum frames.... with Giant's OCR and TCR alloy frames... and you'll see comparable and even Giant alum tubing fabrication suepriority with hydroforming.... Trek's alloy bikes just look like straight gauge tubing welded. Not that different from any other. (Not saying its bad - but it certain'y doesn't say superiority).
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Old 09-04-05, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by fhall1
I think he's full of it, but can't find any evidence on the net to definitively point him to.
You don't have to. That's not the way proof works.

The person making the claim is the one that needs to provide supporting evidence. I can say, "Cannondales are made in Tibet" and now you're tasked with doing all the work to prove it one way or the other, and all I've done is pull something out of my butt.

If your friend says all those bikes are made by Giant, you should ask to see some supporting evidence. More likely than not, he'll say something like, "I heard/read it somewhere", which is no better than saying the tooth fairy told him.
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Old 09-04-05, 10:37 AM
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Originally Posted by cydewaze
If your friend says all those bikes are made by Giant, you should ask to see some supporting evidence. More likely than not, he'll say something like, "I heard/read it somewhere", which is no better than saying the tooth fairy told him.
It is pretty easy to prove that Trek bikes are made in Taiwan. If they are sold in the USA, the dealer is required by law to slap "made in Taiwan" labels on the products. You can see lots of "made in Taiwan" or "made in China" labels on Trek bikes in your bike shops. Now, whether they are made by Giant or made by Merida is more complex. You dealer should know, but you may need to pester him a lot to get the truth out of him.
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Old 09-04-05, 10:47 AM
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i swear trek said all of their road bikes are made in america except the 1000. im going to try and find that it was on the trek website.
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Old 09-04-05, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by STEVO820
i swear trek said all of their road bikes are made in america except the 1000. im going to try and find that it was on the trek website.
well be gaurenteed that all of the CF frames are made in waterloo. Dont know about ther Zr frames or the Alu frames.
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Old 09-04-05, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by STEVO820
i swear trek said all of their road bikes are made in america except the 1000. im going to try and find that it was on the trek website.
That may have been true in the last century, but not in recent years. Just visit any Trek dealer. You'll see "made in Taiwan" or "made in China" labels on lots of different models. They may try to fool you with additional "designed in the USA" labels, but they are required by law to have a "made in" sticker as well.
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Old 09-04-05, 03:00 PM
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Originally Posted by fhall1
There's a guy over on FatWallet claiming that you shouldn't buy a Trek or Specialized bike, but rather buy a Giant, because Giant makes the frames for those other two companies anyway and you get the same bike with less big-name markup.

I think he's full of it, but can't find any evidence on the net to definitively point him to. I always assumed the three were distinctly separate competitors...and watching the Lance Chronicles they showed the Trek folks making the carbon frames for the Postal/Discovery bikes...which tends to tell me they at least do their own carbon frames.

Anyone know with certainty one way or the other on this issue?
Giant is a manufacturer who made frames for Schwinn back when it was un-american to buy non-US built bikes (70's and 80's) Schwinn was stuck building clunky and crude 38lb varsitys in their Chicago plant. These frames were built of flash welded low grade 1010 carbon steel. The last "10" meaning 10% carbon content.

Companies like Nishiki and Centurion were building bikes in Japan and later in Taiwan that were vastly lighter (25-30lbs) due to higher quality steel frames like 1020 and 4130 cro-moly loaded with alloy components from the likes of Suntour and Shimano.

Schwinn's forte was building tanks like the Stingray, Cruisers, Tandems and so on. The Chicago plant mostly built the durable heavyweights that schwinn was famous for, but they also built some lighter lug framed bikes like the Le-tour and the famed Paramount line.

To combat the Japanese and Tawain invasion of higher quality lighter weight bikes, they turned to GIANT in Taiwan. To keep the US public from shunning these bikes, they discretely badged these bikes "Schwinn Aprroved"

Back in the 80's a varsity cost just under 200 bucks and was the heaviest 10 speed in the lineup. Using Giant they brought in the "World Sport" which was a near duplicate of the "Nishiki Century" . Both frames were built by Giant and both even shared the same maroon paint job and nearly identical japanese components. These bikes were lighter , faster and better handling machines due to the higher quality frames and lighter components. This was the beginning of the end for the Varsity and alas, the storied and famed Schwinn Chicago plant.

When badly mismanaged Schwinn crashed and burned in bankruptcy proceedings in the early 90's the chicago plant was shuttered and all the frame building fixtures sold off.

Right around that time , Giant stepped into the independent bike dealer market and began selling the exact same lineup they built for Schwinn but instead re-labled with new stickers and badges that said "Giant" . The rumours at the time were that Giant had already committed to build these bikes for Schwinn, but Schwinn couldn't pay the bill and take delivery. The early Giant Dealers were simply Schwinn Dealers who had been left high and dry without product to sell when Schwinn crashed. Schwinn Dealers recognized the Giant product and new it's quality was up to their standards. For many dealers and Giant, this was a natural and successful alliance.

Over the last 3 decades bike manufacturing has followed the path of nearly all manufactured goods, they are are built wherever they can be built for the lowest cost. From the US , they shifted to Japan, to Taiwan and now China.

Viet Nam has been mentioned in recent years as another source of low cost frame building. Giant could build state of the art manufacturing facilities there and crank out frames for any of the major bike marketing companies be it Schwinn, Trek, Specialized , or anybody else.

Does Giant build bikes for other people ? you bet they do.
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Old 09-04-05, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Oakie
Giant is a manufacturer who made frames for Schwinn back when it was un-american to buy non-US built bikes (70's and 80's) Schwinn was stuck building clunky and crude 38lb varsitys in their Chicago plant. These frames were built of flash welded low grade 1010 carbon steel. The last "10" meaning 10% carbon content.

Companies like Nishiki and Centurion were building bikes in Japan and later in Taiwan that were vastly lighter (25-30lbs) due to higher quality steel frames like 1020 and 4130 cro-moly loaded with alloy components from the likes of Suntour and Shimano.

Schwinn's forte was building tanks like the Stingray, Cruisers, Tandems and so on. The Chicago plant mostly built the durable heavyweights that schwinn was famous for, but they also built some lighter lug framed bikes like the Le-tour and the famed Paramount line.

To combat the Japanese and Tawain invasion of higher quality lighter weight bikes, they turned to GIANT in Taiwan. To keep the US public from shunning these bikes, they discretely badged these bikes "Schwinn Aprroved"

Back in the 80's a varsity cost just under 200 bucks and was the heaviest 10 speed in the lineup. Using Giant they brought in the "World Sport" which was a near duplicate of the "Nishiki Century" . Both frames were built by Giant and both even shared the same maroon paint job and nearly identical japanese components. These bikes were lighter , faster and better handling machines due to the higher quality frames and lighter components. This was the beginning of the end for the Varsity and alas, the storied and famed Schwinn Chicago plant.

When badly mismanaged Schwinn crashed and burned in bankruptcy proceedings in the early 90's the chicago plant was shuttered and all the frame building fixtures sold off.

Right around that time , Giant stepped into the independent bike dealer market and began selling the exact same lineup they built for Schwinn but instead re-labled with new stickers and badges that said "Giant" . The rumours at the time were that Giant had already committed to build these bikes for Schwinn, but Schwinn couldn't pay the bill and take delivery. The early Giant Dealers were simply Schwinn Dealers who had been left high and dry without product to sell when Schwinn crashed. Schwinn Dealers recognized the Giant product and new it's quality was up to their standards. For many dealers and Giant, this was a natural and successful alliance.

Over the last 3 decades bike manufacturing has followed the path of nearly all manufactured goods, they are are built wherever they can be built for the lowest cost. From the US , they shifted to Japan, to Taiwan and now China.

Viet Nam has been mentioned in recent years as another source of low cost frame building. Giant could build state of the art manufacturing facilities there and crank out frames for any of the major bike marketing companies be it Schwinn, Trek, Specialized , or anybody else.

Does Giant build bikes for other people ? you bet they do.
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Old 09-04-05, 05:37 PM
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Giant is the only manufacturer that produces their carbon fiber from scratch giving them excellent quality control throughout the process. Most all other companies have to bring in raw materials from outside sources not always knowing the true quality of various materials.
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Old 09-04-05, 06:25 PM
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I don't know ***** from ***** but I have a Trek 1200 and i can't find any made in Taiwan stickers on it. My Trek 3700 Mtn bike did have a made in China sticker on it though.
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Old 09-04-05, 06:52 PM
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I read somewhere that Giant (a Taiwanese company, by the way) is the largest manufacturer of carbon fiber bicycle frames in the world. Nobody else is even close. I know they make frames for a multitude of American bicycle companies although I don't know which ones. I think the right answer was the one above that explained these frames could very well be made by Giant but have designs and geometries specified by the American bicycle company. So they wouldn't all be the same even though many of them came from the same manufacturer.

I saw a Giant OCR Comp 1 at the bike shop the other day and it is an impressive bike. Beautiful CF frame. Very nice machine. I don't need one since I already have a CF bike but I sure would be happy to ride one of those. I see nothing wrong with it at all and I certainly see no reason to denigrate it. No kidding, it's an impressive bike. Personally, I would probably buy it at it's price before a comparably equipped Trek or Specialized at their prices.
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Old 09-04-05, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by fmw
I read somewhere that Giant (a Taiwanese company, by the way) is the largest manufacturer of carbon fiber bicycle frames in the world. Nobody else is even close. I know they make frames for a multitude of American bicycle companies although I don't know which ones.
I have not heard of Giant making carbon frames for any American companies. If this is true, does anyone know which ones?
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Old 09-04-05, 07:14 PM
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giant used to build frames for specialized(my 1989 sirrus is probably giant made, as giant came out with their own road bike that was almost an exact duplicate a few years later. as were most of the allez and other specialized models from the mid-eighties on). but since merida bought a 50% share in specialized, i'd assume they are building most, if not all of the current specialized line.

trek, i have no idea, but i wouldn't doubt that giant builds many of their bikes as well.
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Old 09-04-05, 08:56 PM
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Originally Posted by johnny99
I think Merida (a big Taiwanese bike company, similar to Giant) My Trek dealer claimed that Trek bike quality is higher than Giant, because Trek has their own quality control people on-site at the Giant factory. Who knows?
Quality control reps from Trek are Chinese people! Thus the quality control would be tainted. Electronics company say the same thing yet the quality of electronic products get worse the further east you get away from Japan. How much is a company going to complain when they pay workers 23 cents an hour with no benefits or lawsuits to worry about? So what something has to be warrantied, they glady warranty something they sold for 10 times what it cost to make and ship.
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Old 09-04-05, 09:15 PM
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This is taken of the chainstay on my '04 Trek 2300



Now the question becomes, does 'HANDBUILT' mean 'assembled' from parts (including frame) made in other countries? The plot thickens....

..rickko..
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Old 09-04-05, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by froze
Quality control reps from Trek are Chinese people! Thus the quality control would be tainted. Electronics company say the same thing yet the quality of electronic products get worse the further east you get away from Japan. How much is a company going to complain when they pay workers 23 cents an hour with no benefits or lawsuits to worry about? So what something has to be warrantied, they glady warranty something they sold for 10 times what it cost to make and ship.
Taiwanese workers are not paid 23 cents per hour. Where did you hear that? Wages in Taiwan are not much lower than wages in the USA.
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Old 09-04-05, 09:20 PM
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Originally Posted by johnny99
Taiwanese workers are not paid 23 cents per hour. Where did you hear that? Wages in Taiwan are not much lower than wages in the USA.
I'm sorry, do you see the word Taiwan or Taiwanese anywhere in my post? NO, I said CHINESE! Last I checked the words Chinese and Taiwanese are not spelled the same or pronounced the same.
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Old 09-04-05, 10:02 PM
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Originally Posted by froze
Quality control reps from Trek are Chinese people! Thus the quality control would be tainted.
Hey maybe I should add that to my sig too.
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Old 09-04-05, 10:20 PM
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Originally Posted by froze
I'm sorry, do you see the word Taiwan or Taiwanese anywhere in my post? NO, I said CHINESE! Last I checked the words Chinese and Taiwanese are not spelled the same or pronounced the same.
You were responding to a post about Taiwanese companies and Taiwanese factories. And yes, the people in Taiwan do call themselves Chinese. The official name of Taiwan is "Republic of China".
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Old 09-04-05, 10:35 PM
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"All" bikes are "made" in one place - under your ass. If it doesn't work there, it doesn't matter much whether it was actually manufactured by Dario Pegoretti or a displaced Mongolian yak herder.
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