LBS Truth-O-Meter: spoke issues

[Joeleo]

I am a big guy (245lbs) and ride a single speed. I popped a spoke on my rear wheel from mashing up hills, getting out of the saddle and swinging the bike side to side. I took the wheel to a trusted LBS and got the same story about probably breaking more spokes. The guy talked me into letting him build me up a 36 spoke rear wheel, old school with a free wheel. Surly hub, Velocity rim and DT Swiss spokes. It cost me some money but I am really happy with how it turned out. This wheel is bomb proof, no more broken spokes and I'm not worried about giving it all I've got on the hills. I don't regret this investment at all.

[halfspeed]

Machine built wheels tend to need a bit of finishing work when new. A good LBS does this as part of the bike assembly process. BD, on the other hand, just ships the bike the way it comes from Taiwan. That combined with a heavy rider on low spoke count wheels virtually guarantees this kind of issue. As others have noted, the wheels are likely unfixable now and inappropriate for the rider anyway.

[Seattle Forrest]

I've been the bearer of bad news to people whose tire has sawed halfway through their carbon chainstay by riding home with a broken spoke. It's a particular problem with low-spoke-count wheels, and some carbon frames don't have a lot of clearance to start with. So that would be something to keep a close eye on, if you've broken a spoke mid-ride.

Thanks for the warning!

How does the tire wear through the stay? I could see how a spoke that snapped at some point might be hanging precariously and smack into the chain or seat stay, and possibly crack or gouge it. Is it that the rim can bulge out without the spoke holding it in place? Or something else? (I've been doing long-ish rides far from home, and, if I wind up in this position, I want to know what to look for!)

[Drew Eckhardt]

I popped a spoke on my back wheel yesterday for the fourth time since I owned it (~1300 miles). When I had my last one repaired the dude at the bike shop said it might be time to think about a new wheel.

It's time to replace all of the spokes in the failing group(s) - rear drive side and/or rear non-drive side.

A whole new wheel may be less expensive than the labor to do that although if you don't stress relieve and achieve uniform high tension before riding it you may end up in the same place.

He effectively said all you're doing is wrestling a bent wheel back into shape, which is causing too much strain on the spokes. Is this BS?

Yes.

Maybe they threw some crap rims/spokes on there? They are stainless steel spokes. Rims: XRP COMP Vuelta, 6061T6 Double Wall aluminum with machined brake track.

They had a machine quickly tension your wheel because that costs less than a competent person.

[Pendergast]

According to this all of Vuelta's wheels are hand built. http://www.vueltausa.com/vuelta-bicycle-wheels.html

[hairnet]

I had the same wheels with my BD bike. They do need some destressing, truing, and tensioning out of the box. That probably was not done, as Mihlback said.

[eippo1]

Spoke replacement, even total is good money after bad. That is a low spoke wheel on a cheap rim. You'll be wasting money. Grab yourself a new 32 or 28 spoke wheel for the rear. Or perhaps get some Aksiums, they go on sale all the time

[mechBgon]

Thanks for the warning!

How does the tire wear through the stay? I could see how a spoke that snapped at some point might be hanging precariously and smack into the chain or seat stay, and possibly crack or gouge it. Is it that the rim can bulge out without the spoke holding it in place?

Precisely. The wheel goes out of true when a spoke breaks, and the tire may start hitting the frame. It might do it on every revolution, or it might do it just when you get out of the saddle and flex the wheel. So if a spoke breaks, take a minute to assess whether the tire's going to start gnawing through your frame at the chainstays or seatstays. If so, it's time to make The Call Of Shame or do some makeshift wheel truing.

[mlander]

Thanks again all! Due to your responses, decided on having the LBS build a "bomb-proof" 36 spoke rear for a little over $200. Hopefully that will be the end of it.

Let this be a lesson to heavier BD shoppers. (Still pleased with the purchase overall though.)

[eippo1]

Excellent. I'm sure that you'll find it to be an excellent riding wheel too. What rim are they using? Open pro?

[pallen]

Thanks again all! Due to your responses, decided on having the LBS build a "bomb-proof" 36 spoke rear for a little over $200. Hopefully that will be the end of it.

Let this be a lesson to heavier BD shoppers. (Still pleased with the purchase overall though.)

If they know what they are doing, that should be the end of your wheel worries.

[mlander]

Excellent. I'm sure that you'll find it to be an excellent riding wheel too. What rim are they using? Open pro?

Uhhhhh... One that the bike shop guy said was "really nice," lol. I don't know! But this LBS is rock solid and is one of the most respected in the city. So the dude's word was good enough for me.

PS - solid avatar. Brak is THE MAN.

[eippo1]

Cool, hope you enjoy it and it works out for you. Brak is the reason to watch Space Ghost.

[Trucker Dan]

If the bike is less than 12 months old, contact bikes direct. They may offer a warranty replacement. When I started having issues with the ritchy wheels on my moto they swapped wheelsets for free.

[punkncat]

Keeping in mind that there have been argument threads concerning both sides of this issue, I will weigh in (again) anyway. Sorry OP, not meant as a jab to you for asking a legit question.

The wheel you bought was likely made with the cheapest, thinnest spokes they could get by with. Perhaps it has been discussed already, I didn't read all the replies, but with four spokes breaking most any shop, any where is going to recommend that you consider a new wheel, or complete rebuild of the the existing wheel, according to just how out of true it was. Metals weaken when bent, so every time the wheel has been out of true, missing a spoke, taking on undue stresses causing as well as from the broken spoke, it is a pretty good indicator that the rim itself has been weakened and pulled out of round one way or the other (hop or warp). The safe bet, as well as economically smart choice, for the shop is to sell you another set of wheels.

Stopping to consider that for a moment: Unless you simply can't afford to upgrade, a decent set of wheels is one of the few things that make such a tremendous difference in the ride, feel, and weight of a bike. It is comparable (in many cases) to having a whole new bike.

Rebuilding the wheel with all new, higher quality spokes might be an option, but likely will cost nearly the price of a new wheel, possibly more.

The third option that you might consider is to look around for someone else selling some take-offs from a higher quality bike. You can easily end up with a better set of wheels than what you ride now, at a fraction of the cost of new and in many cases cheaper than replacing the one wheel you are looking at now.

[Paul Barnard]

Keeping in mind that there have been argument threads concerning both sides of this issue, I will weigh in (again) anyway. Sorry OP, not meant as a jab to you for asking a legit question.

The wheel you bought was likely made with the cheapest, thinnest spokes they could get by with. Perhaps it has been discussed already, I didn't read all the replies, but with four spokes breaking most any shop, any where is going to recommend that you consider a new wheel, or complete rebuild of the the existing wheel, according to just how out of true it was. Metals weaken when bent, so every time the wheel has been out of true, missing a spoke, taking on undue stresses causing as well as from the broken spoke, it is a pretty good indicator that the rim itself has been weakened and pulled out of round one way or the other (hop or warp). The safe bet, as well as economically smart choice, for the shop is to sell you another set of wheels.

Stopping to consider that for a moment: Unless you simply can't afford to upgrade, a decent set of wheels is one of the few things that make such a tremendous difference in the ride, feel, and weight of a bike. It is comparable (in many cases) to having a whole new bike.

Rebuilding the wheel with all new, higher quality spokes might be an option, but likely will cost nearly the price of a new wheel, possibly more.

The third option that you might consider is to look around for someone else selling some take-offs from a higher quality bike. You can easily end up with a better set of wheels than what you ride now, at a fraction of the cost of new and in many cases cheaper than replacing the one wheel you are looking at now.

And with that fine response you could close the thread. That says it all.

[Trucker Dan]

The wheel you bought was likely made with the cheapest, thinnest spokes they could get by with.

Thin spokes are the most expensive. Cheap spokes are thick. You can get strait 2.0 spokes for 1/5 the price of super thin dt revolutions. The thickness of spokes has very little to do with their strength.

[mlander]

If the bike is less than 12 months old, contact bikes direct. They may offer a warranty replacement. When I started having issues with the ritchy wheels on my moto they swapped wheelsets for free.

Damn didn't even think of this!

[mlander]

And with that fine response you could close the thread. That says it all.

+1, Thanks!

[Seattle Forrest]

Metals weaken when bent, so every time the wheel has been out of true, missing a spoke, taking on undue stresses causing as well as from the broken spoke, it is a pretty good indicator that the rim itself has been weakened and pulled out of round one way or the other (hop or warp). The safe bet, as well as economically smart choice, for the shop is to sell you another set of wheels.

Does this apply to carbon rims, out of curiosity?

[pallen]

Does this apply to carbon rims, out of curiosity?

Technically, metals harden when bent beyond their elastic limit (try to bend a paper clip in exactly the same place twice). They eventually harden to the point of becoming brittle and fail. I'm not sure how much this effect is seen in a wheel with a broken spoke. Mainly, I don't know if the wheel bends beyond its elastic limit. My guess would be no. There is a fatigue life in Al to consider, but I don't know if we're talking about enough bending back and forth for that to be a factor.

On carbon, its a non-issue. Virtually no fatigue limit and a very high elastic limit. Generally, carbon is fine or broken - not much in between.

[ultraman6970]

I was the OP i would look for a custom sets of wheels, 230 pounds is a lot of ass to put in the bike and many wheels in the market, specially the cheaper ones wont stand his weight, unless relaced with a descent rim and good spokes.

[mlander]

Okay, just to put a pretty bow on this thread and to assist future searchers with similiar issues: I got my 36 spoke wheel back yesterday. Aluminum Mavic rims (not sure exacty type), Tiagra hub. This is thing is GREAT. Couldn't be happier. Heavy maybe, but love the peace of mind and the plush ride. I am now a huge proponent of beefy wheels for beefy dudes. And this is all asuming the spoke popping issue will go away, but I am damn sure it will.

[escarpment]

You have a cheap wheel, at this point it is slightly warped. Its not the end of the world though and you can just keep riding that wheel into the ground, if the mechanic does a good job of truing the wheel you can probably get many more miles out if it but it is never going to be 100 percent.

Just save up for a new wheel and buy it when you can afford it, Good wheels make a difference.

[dtrain]

You have a cheap wheel, at this point it is slightly warped. Its not the end of the world though and you can just keep riding that wheel into the ground, if the mechanic does a good job of truing the wheel you can probably get many more miles out if it but it is never going to be 100 percent.

Just save up for a new wheel and buy it when you can afford it, Good wheels make a difference.

Thanks for reading posts #34 and #48...