"Elbow Flick" when riding in a Paceline??

[RecceDG]

I've never seen the hip slap either. Our group uses the "after you" signal.

ess experienced riders signal too much. More experienced riders understand what is going on and require far fewer 'signals'.

I am sometimes amused when I ride with a 'club' (social ride) at how much chatter goes on and how many hand signals I see. It is useful for the group but more info than I need. I actually have to check myself and pass on signals I wouldn't normally bother with because I know riders behind me are expecting it. This varies from group to group and is often the most stressful part of the ride for me.

Oh man, this.

My usual group only signals for stuff that is life-threatening or has changed from the usual. Roadkill, for example, gets a point because it probably wasn't there last time. Big potholes will get a point. But that gravelly spot along Snake road? We all know it is there. No need to point it out.

I rode with a group in Fredericton who pointed everything. Leaf on road? Gum wrapper? Tree shadow? Point point point. The whole ride was "lookatthat!" Drove me crazy because I was condioned to treat points as being very serious, so the non stop pointing made me jumpy. And on my pulls, when I didn't point, the rest of the ride got cranky with me. They were a great group and very friendly, but the ride wound up being very stressful.

But nowhere NEAR as stressful as the Toronto Donut Ride, where nobody signals anything. 75 km of sauve qui peut. My SA during that ride sucked and it felt like we were always a heartbeat away from disaster.

DG

[datlas]

We all have our foibles.

Mine's being too much of an elitest dick but I've got signalling down pretty well.

Does this have something to do with almost being blown?!?

[topflightpro]

I'm assuming this was a genuine post and not sarcasm.

If the group you're with is riding a paceline, especially a fast paceline, don't do this.

Doing this leaves gaps in the paceline, and PO's the guys behind you who now have to accelerate & close that gap. You cost them unnecessary energy. Doing this screams "NEWBIE!" They won't want you riding with them for long.

The only acceptable moves if you're a weaker rider and might get blown, is to sit at the back or take shorter pulls.

I'll clarify, I'm referring to Hammer Rides with a race-like feel with attacks, chases, breaks, sprints... I am not referring to any sort of organized paceline.

[Bob Dopolina]

Does this have something to do with almost being blown?!?

Wow! You've taken this to a whole other level. I need to go get another beer!

[LowCel]

I'll clarify, I'm referring to Hammer Rides with a race-like feel with attacks, chases, breaks, sprints... I am not referring to any sort of organized paceline.

If I am forth in line in a fast pace line and the third person in line gets out of line and goes to the back I am not going to be happy and neither will anyone behind me. I will have to accelerate as will everyone behind me creating a yo-yo effect. This will also affect the guy that just gave up the pull because most likely by the time he gets to the back he will probably have to accelerate once the yo-yo effect gets to him. The good news is that the person that was in third will now get to the back and probably have to accelerate, and if karma works out he will be dropped.

[Bob Dopolina]

If I am forth in line in a fast pace line and the third person in line gets out of line and goes to the back I am not going to be happy and neither will anyone behind me. I will have to accelerate as will everyone behind me creating a yo-yo effect. This will also affect the guy that just gave up the pull because most likely by the time he gets to the back he will probably have to accelerate once the yo-yo effect gets to him. The good news is that the person that was in third will now get to the back and probably have to accelerate, and if karma works out he will be dropped.

Actually If I were in that position I'd be inclined to do a quick jump if possible and if conditions were right. Obviously at least one rider is red lined and it's a chance to thin the herd.

[LowCel]

Actually If I were in that position I'd be inclined to do a quick jump if possible and if conditions were right. Obviously at least one rider is red lined and it's a chance to thin the herd.

Yep, and hopefully the dumbass that was in third position and screwed everyone up.

[Bob Dopolina]

Yep, and hopefully the dumbass that was in third position and screwed everyone up.

He'd be the target.

[datlas]

Wow! You've taken this to a whole other level. I need to go get another beer!

I generally try to take these things to the lowest common denominator.

[ultraman6970]

Interesting experiences here... been there done that also. Not being mean but some riders just cant get obvious things from look at them, as the guy who drops the line just when in 3rd position, wasn't easier just wait to get to 2nd position and go back with the 1st guy both together???? people simply dont think on this little things... Just like the guys that goes super fast in curves with the wrong foot down??? Seen those Einsteins since i remember...

[LowCel]

Interesting experiences here... been there done that also. Not being mean but some riders just cant get obvious things from look at them, as the guy who drops the line just when in 3rd position, wasn't easier just wait to get to 2nd position and go back with the 1st guy both together???? people simply dont think on this little things... Just like the guys that goes super fast in curves with the wrong foot down??? Seen those Einsteins since i remember...

Keep in mind the worst offence of all, accelerating when the guy in front of you finishes his pull. That is always a nice slap in the face after a tough pull. If you aren't racing and don't want to drop the guy that just worked for you keep the pace the same until he is back in line.

[Bob Dopolina]

Keep in mind the worst offence of all, accelerating when the guy in front of you finishes his pull. That is always a nice slap in the face after a tough pull. If you aren't racing and don't want to drop the guy that just worked for you keep the pace the same until he is back in line.

I will pull out of a paceline, cause the rotation to fall apart and jump back on the wheel of guys who accelerate when they pull through so I can hammer them into the gutter after their next pull.

Accelerating when you pull through can only be one of two things: You are a newb or you are attacking the rider who just pulled. If I just pulled I will counter asap.

[soma5]

Don't forget the hip slap. That is one of the dumbest things I've seen.

I have never seen this, in decades of riding and racing. I suppose it must be a regional thing, but it makes no sense whatever to me to make that big a motion with your hand off the bars.

[LowCel]

I have never seen this, in decades of riding and racing. I suppose it must be a regional thing, but it makes no sense whatever to me to make that big a motion with your hand off the bars.

Just so you know, the people that do it will argue with you about how it's the best way and try to get you to convert. It is annoyingly entertaining.

[pallen]

Actually If I were in that position I'd be inclined to do a quick jump if possible and if conditions were right. Obviously at least one rider is red lined and it's a chance to thin the herd.

That only works if you arent also redlined

[Bob Dopolina]

Just so you know, the people that do it will argue with you about how it's the best way and try to get you to convert. It is annoyingly entertaining.

Do they also have those tall fiberglass flagpoles bolted to their bikes?

[LowCel]

Do they also have those tall fiberglass flagpoles bolted to their bikes?

No, Trek's.

[Bob Dopolina]

That only works if you arent also redlined

That would be among the 'conditions' I mentioned.

Being redlined and staring cross eyed at a gap truly sucks.

[Vlaam4ever]

That would be among the 'conditions' I mentioned.

Being redlined and staring cross eyed at a gap truly sucks.

Especially during the warm up before you get to the part where you really start working hard... I remember my first real training ride, I picked the wrong group to keep up with. It took me weeks of getting dropped to learn that these guys were real racers and I was not.

[DGlenday]

You don't TAKE the lead, you INHERIT it.

However - in some club rides, I get POd when some guy who fancies himself as a strong rider takes the lead and just sits there.

He starts slowing down because he's tired, but he won't roll off the lead. WTF to do then?

Sometimes I've just pushed past on the left, taking part of the bunch with me. The tough guy is almost always dropped.

[DGlenday]

I just pull over, if there is any doubt I point with a finger.

Most of the people I ride with either do nothing, or they use a finger point.

Just to clarify a point, it's obvious when you're riding but you flick the elbow/finger/whatever on the side you want the next rider to pull through. So if you're pulling off to the left, you flick the right side.

I see it even in some pro clips. It's like using a turn signal when you're driving and you want to turn. It can never hurt. It sometimesa helps.

Funny - in every paceline I've ridden in (in several states, and with people of skill levels from noob to racer) people do the opposite - they point in the direction they are going to pull off.

[Commodus]

I only point out the stuff that I'm riding very close to. Sometimes there's a bit of debris or a hole or whatever, but for some reason - traffic maybe - I can't just ride way around it.

My personal pet peeve is when you get into a group on some Fred event ride and they want to ride 'paceline-style' at like 25 km/h. I'm sorry guys, but I'm just not putting up with the hassle to 'draft' at that speed.

[gregf83]

However - in some club rides, I get POd when some guy who fancies himself as a strong rider takes the lead and just sits there.

He starts slowing down because he's tired, but he won't roll off the lead. WTF to do then?

Simple. Just maintain your speed and slowly go by on whatever side is appropriate. I do it if I'm behind someone and I notice my power dropping.

[thenomad]

Pet peeves of mine:
Fred-gapping - Call it being "Fred-Gapped" when someone in the middle of the pace line starts blowing up and lets a gap develop. Everyone is hammering and if you're behind him you suddenly realize he's lost the wheel and you have to jump him and catch the pack again. Frustrating! I think weekend only riders tend to not know their reserves and go go go then pop.

Signaling every darn thing - I'm used to riding alone and do enjoy a group ride for some cameraderie, pacing and conversation but it is annoying when there's a few loudmouths just yelling incessantly about every little thing! Geeze, takes the fun out of a nice ride in the countryside. I think some of them get enjoyment out of just maintaining rules and order, probably the grammar nozis on forums.

Surging at the front of the paceline. As was stated, maintain speed! This one ride I was on we were pace-lining back home and I took a pull at the front. Admittedly I stayed about a minute too long but kept the pace up, then Jan Hammer behind me decides its a good time to crank it up once I flick elbow and peel off. I make it to the back of the line and find its harder to get the wheel than I thought. Ok, couple bursts should get me there, nope, still tougher than I thought. I give it all I have and can't catch the wheel and when I look down we've gained 5-7 mph and everyones eyeballs are popping out. I couldn't catch the wheel and the effort drained me so I was shelled off the back. Found out the group blew apart in a few more miles.

Oh well. Not my best day but if I'd been on the wheel I would have recovered.

[LowCel]

Surging at the front of the paceline. As was stated, maintain speed! This one ride I was on we were pace-lining back home and I took a pull at the front. Admittedly I stayed about a minute too long but kept the pace up, then Jan Hammer behind me decides its a good time to crank it up once I flick elbow and peel off. I make it to the back of the line and find its harder to get the wheel than I thought. Ok, couple bursts should get me there, nope, still tougher than I thought. I give it all I have and can't catch the wheel and when I look down we've gained 5-7 mph and everyones eyeballs are popping out. I couldn't catch the wheel and the effort drained me so I was shelled off the back. Found out the group blew apart in a few more miles.

Oh well. Not my best day but if I'd been on the wheel I would have recovered.

One guy I used to ride / race / train with would do this every time he got to the front. After informing him several times about what he was doing and how it was hurting his teammates as much as the others I finally gave up. During group rides / training rides we just started letting him go off the front every time it was his pull. He eventually figured it out.