ITCA & VERAGO Swiss steel frames ?

[human33]

Recently i brought two swiss bikes that i don't know much about
so i am looking for somebody who can write a few words regarding brands, frame quallity in general?

The first one is Itca, a very nice 531 frame that i couldn't find any info except that Alan Ilten is the track cyclist from Zurich who owns the company and was handbuilding bikes. Dropouts are shimano SF and campagnolo ...The bike got the punch at the front since fork neck is not straight. I dont know is there a chance for fixing. I tried to make it straight but you can see from the pics that is not 100%. Any advice??

Second is Verago handmade frame with no any steel sticker on it?? Just it says its swiss handbuilt. Dropouts are gipiemme. It camed with Wolber tubular rims, beautiful clement tubular tires and golden arrow groupset.

The bouth are 57 C-T

Any thoughts, info or suggestions are mora than welcome.

Greetings from Croatia!

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[zukahn1]

To start both look to be very nice frames that have some value. I'm know nothing of the brands but the first does appear to be genuine nicely 531 lugged frame likely from the 70's with original finish which gives some value siginificant value. While likely not as good of frame the second is very nice and does appear to have a complete 600 Arabesgue component group on it which if correct could add a lot of value. I hate to quess values on bikes like these but my ball park would be $300 each.

[human33]

To start both look to be very nice frames that have some value. I'm know nothing of the brands but the first does appear to be genuine nicely 531 lugged frame likely from the 70's with original finish which gives some value siginificant value. While likely not as good of frame the second is very nice and does appear to have a complete 600 Arabesgue component group on it which if correct could add a lot of value. I hate to quess values on bikes like these but my ball park would be $300 each.

It doesnt have complete 105 golden arrow group. But crankset , hubs, stem, fd rd, and brake levers are there