quoted to me by a lady in a small car today
03-05-12 | 08:33 PM
#76
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From: NW Texas
+1.
I have had to tell officers to re-check the traffic laws for the state as well as our town. Not the State Troopers, only the small town guys and gals.
All the small town ones go to a miniscule course which only teaches them how to qualify with a weapon and that's about it. No real studying of the laws they are about enforce once out on the road.
I have had to tell officers to re-check the traffic laws for the state as well as our town. Not the State Troopers, only the small town guys and gals.
All the small town ones go to a miniscule course which only teaches them how to qualify with a weapon and that's about it. No real studying of the laws they are about enforce once out on the road.
03-05-12 | 11:41 PM
#77
Hey guys,
CB Hi, You are required to get a license to operate things like cars and airplanes due to the skill set, abilities and knowledge required to operate them safely- it has absolutely nothing to do with how much damage they could do. I know voting is a privilege just ask any convicted felon who has done time for their crimes- no more voting.
CB Hi, You are required to get a license to operate things like cars and airplanes due to the skill set, abilities and knowledge required to operate them safely- it has absolutely nothing to do with how much damage they could do. I know voting is a privilege just ask any convicted felon who has done time for their crimes- no more voting.
But since you are so convinced in your position, please do cite the Supreme Court decision that declares voting a privilege rather than a right.
__________________
Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.
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03-06-12 | 01:12 AM
#78
Geck, wo ist mein Fahrrad
Joined: Feb 2012
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From: Front Range
And I do have the right to freely ride a bike on any public road. The privilege starts with a 51 cc motorized vehicle.
You wanna be lawyers should stop watching Matlock and start watching C-SPAN, riveting stuff.
otherwise I'm glad you enjoyed your snowy ride.
03-06-12 | 01:47 AM
#79
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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I don't blame you.
03-06-12 | 01:52 AM
#80
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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Still, she had no right to go through your pannier bags. Why didn't you take out your cell phone and call 911 and report her for going through your personal property?
03-06-12 | 01:55 AM
#81
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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I would never let anyone go through my things or even see my ID if there was no accident, and even then I'd wait for the cops. She assaulted you, you should have called 911 at that time and get that on record that you were being assaulted. It's very likely she would back off when you called 911 and if not, she would be the one in trouble.
03-06-12 | 01:57 AM
#82
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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03-06-12 | 02:14 AM
#83
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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I also had a couple in a car pull alongside of me and lecture me that I "belonged" on the newly widened MUP instead of riding on the road.
03-06-12 | 02:19 AM
#84
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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This is a bike forum and I'll probably get banned for playing the devil's advocate but here goes. While I'll agree that in most localities, bicycle riders do have the right to ride in the road. However, they do not have the right to impede traffic. In other words if the speed limit is posted as 35, you need to be going at least 30 or pull over and allow traffic to safely pass you. Farm trucks/ tractors, backhoes and equipment have the right to be in the road as well, but they have too pull over and allow faster moving traffic pass.
The irony in that case is that if Selz had been ticketed for not riding FRAP they wouldn't have stood a chance of winning on appeal. So ironically it worked out good in this case that the ticketing cop didn't know the law.
03-06-12 | 02:25 AM
#85
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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Yes, all motor vehicle operators have more important places to go than cyclists. My "grocery-getter" bike with child trailer rarely gets above 12 mph, so as soon as I get out of my driveway, I just "pull over" and stay there! That way I don't impede anybody in a car.
I've thought about waiting til 3am for the streets to be deserted, then I could ride to the store without having to pull over. But then the stores are closed!
I've thought about waiting til 3am for the streets to be deserted, then I could ride to the store without having to pull over. But then the stores are closed!
This past summer I had a JAM while I was heading out to The Pier rev his engine not once, but twice behind me. I guess he expected me to automatically "jump" out of his way as soon as I heard his "mighty" engine.
03-06-12 | 02:34 AM
#86
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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people always talk about cyclists impeding traffic like it's an everyday thing. It just doesn't happen that often. I can remember being impeded by a cyclist once. The cyclist was weaving and I was teaching my daughter to drive, so I told her not to pass. Complicating factor was that someone was parked illegally on the other side of the road blocking most of the lane. I remember impeding traffic three times in 35+ years of cycling. Each time the motorist directly behind refused to pass even though they had ample opportunities. In many cases, it's not that easy to find a place to pull over. I estimate that my presence on the road increases average traffic speeds.
03-06-12 | 02:39 AM
#87
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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Until you come across the person who lost their job to downsizing because their factory closed down and their jobs were shipped overseas. Or lost their job because there are too many illegal immigrants flooding the market place.
A while back on a local TV call in show they did a show on the illegal immigrant problem and one of the people on the show was with the horticulture industry and he was trying to make the claim that "his" field "depended" on illegal immigrants in order to keep prices low. . .
A while back on a local TV call in show they did a show on the illegal immigrant problem and one of the people on the show was with the horticulture industry and he was trying to make the claim that "his" field "depended" on illegal immigrants in order to keep prices low. . .
03-06-12 | 02:44 AM
#88
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03-06-12 | 08:51 AM
#89
Zip tie Karen
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From: Fair Oaks Ranch, TX
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Two Possibilities
2) Assumed Risk - The winter roads have black ice on them. You fall at an intersection and are struck by a car also trying to stop. You assumed the risks when you knowingly rode when/where there was threat of ice.
I'm just guessing what was in the mind of the lobby person here...
03-06-12 | 09:03 AM
#90
On the lam
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From: The Village
I didn't own a cell phone at the time, and there wasn't anything of value to her in the panniers, and if a TSA pat down started occurring, then I would have taken some serious action.
03-06-12 | 10:16 AM
#91
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03-06-12 | 02:03 PM
#92
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Hey guys,
Chief, thank you and yes I know and agree that you have a right to travel, but how you travel is a privilege. I can walk any where I like on public lands, I can ride in a car, plane (sometime you can be banned from air travel), boat train any where as well. But under certain situations you may not have the right to operate a vehicle (a bicycle is a vehicle) on public roads, just get a DUI and see what happens to your rights. A commercial drivers license is basically the same as a personal drivers license (I am a commercial driver) but the consequences are greater. In order to maintain my commercial drivers license I can not have violations against me whether I am driving my commercial vehicle or my personal car. Say for the personal driver gets a speeding going 20+ mph over speed limit, that would be considered reckless driving and a big ticket. For me with a commercial license if I got a speeding ticket 20+ mph over the posted speed limit while driving my personal car, I would have my commercial drivers licenses suspended on the spot.
I really hated getting this far off OP topic, it was just about every time one of these post pop up cyclist start talking about rights this and rights that. I know that either driving a car or riding a bike is both a privilege and a great responsibility that need to be taken seriously.
And yes I did enjoy the freedom of my 11 mile commute today even thought it sarted snowing!
Chief, thank you and yes I know and agree that you have a right to travel, but how you travel is a privilege. I can walk any where I like on public lands, I can ride in a car, plane (sometime you can be banned from air travel), boat train any where as well. But under certain situations you may not have the right to operate a vehicle (a bicycle is a vehicle) on public roads, just get a DUI and see what happens to your rights. A commercial drivers license is basically the same as a personal drivers license (I am a commercial driver) but the consequences are greater. In order to maintain my commercial drivers license I can not have violations against me whether I am driving my commercial vehicle or my personal car. Say for the personal driver gets a speeding going 20+ mph over speed limit, that would be considered reckless driving and a big ticket. For me with a commercial license if I got a speeding ticket 20+ mph over the posted speed limit while driving my personal car, I would have my commercial drivers licenses suspended on the spot.
I really hated getting this far off OP topic, it was just about every time one of these post pop up cyclist start talking about rights this and rights that. I know that either driving a car or riding a bike is both a privilege and a great responsibility that need to be taken seriously.
And yes I did enjoy the freedom of my 11 mile commute today even thought it sarted snowing!
Don’t on one hand tell me I have a right, then say to exercise the right is a privilege. I can’t compute that!
Actually, this thread continues very much in line with the OP’s topic; a motorist not understanding cyclists’ rights. And many of these sorts of posts reflect that many cyclists do not understand, nor believe they should exercise their rights.
As you become less new to the forums, you will read plenty writings of cyclists who express that they are "intruders" on the road. And you will possibly ride with those individuals who constantly move over, stop, or detour themselves to accommodate every motor vehicle that comes along. Their actions say "I don’t have the right to be here, so I will be as inconspicuous as possible"
For me, I will not concede my right to human-powered travel, and I will not acknowledge that anyone has "given" me a revocable "privilege" to travel on public roadways for my own private reasons. Take some time, and read about the right to travel. It will shed some light on why your commercial license is more of a privilege to own.
And private vehicle licenses are quite an infringement on our rights, but we seem to have swallowed the pill (over the years) in the name of safety, or revenue collection, or "peace-of-mind" about other drivers, or something… Many court cases have rather weakly upheld regulation of motor vehicle travel (by states) with the reasoning that other forms of human-powered travel are left unrestricted. (That’s why I said "Rejoice…use the freedom!")
I’m somewhat saddened at the number of citizens that I encounter who don’t want to accept that they have a variety of rights (non-negotiable, birth-to-death rights). Instead there is a common thread of attitudes/opinions that our lives are a conducted using a series of privileges earned with good behavior, or paid for with taxes/fees, or some other arbitrary guidelines. Somehow, it’s too good to believe we are worthy of certain freedoms & behavior just because we were born!
Just remember… when a cop pulls you over, and asks "Where are you coming from?"… a lot of sacrifice has been made so you can ignore the question; and instead ask them a question.
Moderators: Feel free to move this to the Anarchy Forum!
03-06-12 | 02:37 PM
#93
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
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1) Contributory Negligence - Your actions place some of the blame on yourself - for example, you are injured while using a manufacturer's device in an unsafe or unintended way. The device fails and you suffer loss. You contributed, significantly.
2) Assumed Risk - The winter roads have black ice on them. You fall at an intersection and are struck by a car also trying to stop. You assumed the risks when you knowingly rode when/where there was threat of ice.
I'm just guessing what was in the mind of the lobby person here...
2) Assumed Risk - The winter roads have black ice on them. You fall at an intersection and are struck by a car also trying to stop. You assumed the risks when you knowingly rode when/where there was threat of ice.
I'm just guessing what was in the mind of the lobby person here...
03-06-12 | 02:40 PM
#94
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997
It goes without saying that she should never have been able to gain access to your pannier bags. But we're in the best position to be able to determine what is and isn't acceptable when we're on the road.
03-06-12 | 05:33 PM
#95
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From: Virginia
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CB HI this is for you,
Looks like voting "rights" for felons varies from state to state.
The Fourteenth Amendment clearly demonstrates that the states have the Constitutional authority to disenfranchise both currently incarcerated and former felons for as long as they deem fit. In limiting the freedoms of convicted felons, incarceration is designed to punish inmates and impress upon them the magnitude of their crimes. As a "privilege" to be enjoyed by law-abiding citizens, prohibiting inmates from voting further drives this point home. Prohibiting former felons from voting for life ensures the integrity of the electoral process, especially in states and jurisdictions where the populace directly elects judges, law enforcement officers and district attorneys.
Looks like voting "rights" for felons varies from state to state.
The Fourteenth Amendment clearly demonstrates that the states have the Constitutional authority to disenfranchise both currently incarcerated and former felons for as long as they deem fit. In limiting the freedoms of convicted felons, incarceration is designed to punish inmates and impress upon them the magnitude of their crimes. As a "privilege" to be enjoyed by law-abiding citizens, prohibiting inmates from voting further drives this point home. Prohibiting former felons from voting for life ensures the integrity of the electoral process, especially in states and jurisdictions where the populace directly elects judges, law enforcement officers and district attorneys.
- Alabama, Delaware, Florida, Iowa, Kentucky, Mississippi, Nevada, New Mexico, Virginia and Wyoming permanently prohibit voting rights for felons.
03-06-12 | 06:30 PM
#97
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It was actually a dude who was telling me this. I didn't feel like getting into a debate with this person because, well, it wouldn't have been an intellectual debate, if you know what I mean. His vocabulary was less than stellar and he would have walked away feeling victorious no matter the outcome of the discussion. Some things are best left unsaid.
03-06-12 | 10:39 PM
#98
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From: Albany, NY
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I was waiting to make a left turn in the left turn lane at a light when a motorist pulled up next to me and began shouting at me to get out of the middle of the road. I just shot him a look, then rested my arm on his fender and waited for the light to turn green. He blasted his horn and shouted at me until the light changed and i was on my way. I wasnt worried about a physical confrontation as he was in his 60s and Im 6'1" 220
Another altercation was when i was traveling south and a motorist travelig north cut a left on green RIGHT in front of me. I had to lock up my brakes and swerve just to avoid him. Of course he thought he had the right of way but his wife yelled at him about cutting me off.
Third and scariest was when a guy in a beat up old pick up told me to get my bike on the sidewalk. I yelled that my bike was worth more than his sh*tty truck and called him a red neck pos. he slammed on his brakes but he didnt have a place to turn around and chase me. I believe he would have murdered me.
Another altercation was when i was traveling south and a motorist travelig north cut a left on green RIGHT in front of me. I had to lock up my brakes and swerve just to avoid him. Of course he thought he had the right of way but his wife yelled at him about cutting me off.
Third and scariest was when a guy in a beat up old pick up told me to get my bike on the sidewalk. I yelled that my bike was worth more than his sh*tty truck and called him a red neck pos. he slammed on his brakes but he didnt have a place to turn around and chase me. I believe he would have murdered me.
03-07-12 | 12:03 AM
#99
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Joined: May 2009
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997
It was actually a dude who was telling me this. I didn't feel like getting into a debate with this person because, well, it wouldn't have been an intellectual debate, if you know what I mean. His vocabulary was less than stellar and he would have walked away feeling victorious no matter the outcome of the discussion. Some things are best left unsaid.
This is true, I've had more than a few people look at me with (I guess awe) at the miles that I ride. Or that I'm willing to ride to get where I want to go.
03-07-12 | 12:05 AM
#100
Senior Member
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 9,352
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From: Tampa/St. Pete, Florida
Bikes: Specialized Hardrock Mountain (Stolen); Giant Seek 2 (Stolen); Diamondback Ascent mid 1980 - 1997
I was waiting to make a left turn in the left turn lane at a light when a motorist pulled up next to me and began shouting at me to get out of the middle of the road. I just shot him a look, then rested my arm on his fender and waited for the light to turn green. He blasted his horn and shouted at me until the light changed and i was on my way. I wasn't worried about a physical confrontation as he was in his 60s and I'm 6'1" 220
Another altercation was when i was traveling south and a motorist travelig north cut a left on green RIGHT in front of me. I had to lock up my brakes and swerve just to avoid him. Of course he thought he had the right of way but his wife yelled at him about cutting me off.
Third and scariest was when a guy in a beat up old pick up told me to get my bike on the sidewalk. I yelled that my bike was worth more than his sh*tty truck and called him a red neck pos. he slammed on his brakes but he didn't have a place to turn around and chase me. I believe he would have murdered me.
Another altercation was when i was traveling south and a motorist travelig north cut a left on green RIGHT in front of me. I had to lock up my brakes and swerve just to avoid him. Of course he thought he had the right of way but his wife yelled at him about cutting me off.
Third and scariest was when a guy in a beat up old pick up told me to get my bike on the sidewalk. I yelled that my bike was worth more than his sh*tty truck and called him a red neck pos. he slammed on his brakes but he didn't have a place to turn around and chase me. I believe he would have murdered me.
