Done.

You are wrong here and wrong in all things as far as I can see. I don't carry a gun, don't plan on carrying a gun nor do I even own a gun which can be carried in the sense of concealment. Unlike you, I'm just not in a penis shrinking fantod about the thought that other citizens choose to carry.

There is a name for the psychological condition which results in fear of those who show independent thought. Worth look up so you can tell your therapist. If you lack a therapist, I see the need.

More name calling. That's cute. I never said I have a fear of citizens carrying handguns. I've even said that it is fine if that is what someone chooses to do. Obviously, I was mistaken about your personal handgun ownership preferences.

"wrong in all things"?? Methinks thou dost protest too much. If I truly am wrong in all things, and have a "fear of those who show independent thought", (yea, that's been exemplified here ) you could probably find a better debating tactic than name calling and insults.

yeah, I would venture to guess that a cyclist is more likely to be shot by someone with a concealed weapons permit than a 'gangbanger'. I would never ride with handgun. There are too many rude motorists out there and the temptation would be overwhelming.

Yeah, but I am a CPA.

Dang! I can't believe so many ppl carry guns. I have'nt even held a gun let alone carried one...

aadhils, it's fine you don't want a gun. There are thousands of people a day carrying weapons that you will never hear about because they are responsible citizens and not breaking the law.

In what context do you make this remark?

Guns?



Better to have one and not need one, than need one and not have one.


Justification?

Better to be judged by twelve than carried by six.

Below is the perfect gun for that "special someone", and you know who you are ....



Use it in good health.

no gun here.

My two favorites:

Against people: Glock 30

Against large animals: Glock 29


Sometimes I carry both, cause you never know which you will meet, people or animals.

I carry a love gun. I probably wouldn't use it against animals though.

Nice to know you are keeping tabs on me.

Holy crap, I just killed my afternoon with 473 posts. Umm...I have a question rather than a radical opinion, along the lines of the original post.

After a strange experience in southern Illinois I've been considering looking into and getting a gun. I was car camping with friends. A pickup with a couple of guys tore up to our campsite at midnight and asked where our wives were. When we couldn't immediately produce any wives they informed us that we were very sexy. Wasn't even wearing lycra. After a few tense and awkward moments we waved them off, and they tore down the road again. I don't know if they were testing us/looking for a fight, or genuinely propositioning.

Makes me think it might be nice to have a hand gun on my future biking/camping trips. I don't think it sounds like a crazy or over-cautious idea, as long as you're sufficiently knowledgable and responsible. The best things in life can often be quite risky, and MANY of the most beautiful places in the USA are quite isolated.

To my surprise, many of my friends agree with me, and there are a few that are as liberal and over-priveleged as they come.

Anyone bike tour with a gun?
Where should I get started in looking into it? Don? Chip?

(The lethal cut diagram was creepy)

I've been in a few cat 5 races where it might have come in handy. Do they make any that are aerodynamic? I'm thinking short barrel snub nosed for weight. Given that it would be used at very close range, the diminished accuracy shouldn't be a problem, and would help on weight.

Back tto the original post in what is surely a world recod troll. Some years back cyclists in the Monterey, CA area were getting hassled pretty regularly. Local bike shop began stocking small holsters that hung from the top tube, as well as handguns to go with them. A few cyclists picked them up. In CA, a concealed permit is not needed if the weapon is in plain view.

I'm aware of one instance in which a dozen or so bottom feeders stopped a cyclist for a little fun, and the pistol was an effective equalizer.

That said, I don't carry. If I ever feel the need to, I'll just get a new hobby.

"I'm surrounded by fricken idiots."

Fillthecup, I can't believe you read this whole thing. I just keep coming back every few days wondering if it will ever die.

For anyone with internet access who's considering gun ownership, I highly recommend www.thehighroad.org and www.thefiringline.com. I moderate at both sites, so say hi if you come over.


In Illinois you'd have to start by applying for a FOID card. I'd suggest doing that before you even look at guns. It'll take a minimum of two weeks to get your card back if everything goes perfectly, probably more like 90 days at the moment. Having it will make shopping for a firearm a whole lot easier--gun shops aren't allowed to let you have a gun or ammunition in your hand until you have it.

www.isp.state.il.us/docs/6-181.pdf will let you download the application form in .pdf. You'll need to send in this form, plus a passport-sized photo of yourself and $5. Most gun shops will do all this for you for $10-15 including the fee. Having the FOID means you're only out the $5 fee and your time if you decide not to get a gun, but not having it means you don't have the option.

Gun ownership for self-defense is all about giving yourself an option you didn't have before. Your experience at the campground is the perfect example, and it's hard for people who haven't been through such a thing to understand how bad it feels to know that you don't have many good options. As long as those guys chose to stay, threatening and outnumbering you (and they WERE probably "interviewing" you--either you didn't come across as easy marks or they found something more fun to do.)
Having a gun wouldn't have solved the problem, but it would have been one more option if everything had gone south on you.

Quick and dirty tutorial on Illinois gun laws:

• Once you have a FOID card, you are legally entitled to own, possess, buy, sell and transport firearms in Illinois. It is NOT a concealed carry license.
• No matter who you buy from, you do need to show your FOID. If you purchase from a private person, you need to record their FOID. If you're not sure you're following the law, stop and shoot me an email.
• If you buy a gun from out of state, say over the internet, it must be shipped to a licensed FFL (Federal Firearms License) dealer in Illinois and you must have it "transferred" from the FFL. Most charge $15-20 for this service. There's no other legal way to do it, so don't let anyone blow smoke up your. . . Lycra.
• The waiting period in Illinois is 24 hours for rifles and shotguns, 72 hours for handguns. This is the period from the time you pay for the gun and have your background checked (again, because they already checked it before they gave you a FOID) to the time you can pick it up and take it home with you.
• Legally transporting a gun has gotten a little muddy in Illinois. The bottom line is that if the gun is at all accessible to anyone in your party when you transport it, then it has to be unloaded and it must be in a case which closes around it. Holsters don't cut it, and transporting a loaded gun is a felony. A hotel room or campsite is considered your home for that night, so having your loaded gun with you there is legal.

this post makes me SOOOOO happy i dont live in the US!!! SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO HHHHHHHAAAAAAAPPPPPPPPPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY........


thank you for proving why your country is the fattest, most violent, and most conservative on the planet...oohhhh sorry accept for iraq, but you took care of that problem pretty fast

Far from being "taken care of", Iraq remains a bone in the NeoCon/Oil White House's throat that they can't swallow.

I still think this should be moved to P&R. Or closed for that matter.

After 20 pages, I'm pretty sure the moderators have side bets going on this one. It's not going to be closed. They can't stand the thought of not seeing where it goes.

I like you. Let's have a sleepover and be best friends!

Hi Don,

I'm having a great time over at THR. Thanks for the pointer.

Somebody'll just start another one. Gun threads are an existential paradigm on Bikeforums, and it's a more interesting discussion than some idiotic Campy Vs. Shimano thread.