Switch brakes
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Switch brakes
Hi,
I just bought a mtb a couple of days ago and am presented with a slight problem. The bike and I are in the UK and in the UK the set the brakes up the wrong way around, i.e. left-rear/right-front. I'm not used to it and I would prefer to change them around (rather than getting used to having the like they are now).
The brakes are Shimano XT Disc Brake BR-M765, set up with some Shimano levers (no specification). Would it be as simple as shifting the hoses around? It seems like it should work... Has anyone had this problem before or done it before?
Grateful for any input!
thomas
I just bought a mtb a couple of days ago and am presented with a slight problem. The bike and I are in the UK and in the UK the set the brakes up the wrong way around, i.e. left-rear/right-front. I'm not used to it and I would prefer to change them around (rather than getting used to having the like they are now).
The brakes are Shimano XT Disc Brake BR-M765, set up with some Shimano levers (no specification). Would it be as simple as shifting the hoses around? It seems like it should work... Has anyone had this problem before or done it before?
Grateful for any input!
thomas
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Originally Posted by londonfieldsboy
Has anyone had this problem before or done it before?
If you can find a part number on the brake levers, we could tell you if that same part is used here in the US but with the hoses swapped.
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Thanks guys, really appreciate your help! However, impatient as I am I did some research (which I should have done before, I know;-)) and came up with the conclusion that, although potentially a bit messy, it wouldn't pose a prob at all. -I downloaded document SM-BH59 from the Shimano website and that pretty much cleared it up!
The levers that are installed with the brakes are ML525s which should translate as Deore I guess but the only Deore I've found are ML535s, and it clearly says 'Deore' on them. No biggie I guess.
I've always wondered why the UK set-up is different to other places; it seems like the fact that they 'drive on the left' doesn't quite explain it. Has anyone got any idea? I had my old bike (Marin pine mt) in for some repair a couple of years ago and when I picked it up the mechanic pretty much told me off for having the brakes 'the wrong way around' as it was potentially dangerous. Weird I thought that he didn't seem aware of what the rest of the world does.
Regards, thomas
The levers that are installed with the brakes are ML525s which should translate as Deore I guess but the only Deore I've found are ML535s, and it clearly says 'Deore' on them. No biggie I guess.
I've always wondered why the UK set-up is different to other places; it seems like the fact that they 'drive on the left' doesn't quite explain it. Has anyone got any idea? I had my old bike (Marin pine mt) in for some repair a couple of years ago and when I picked it up the mechanic pretty much told me off for having the brakes 'the wrong way around' as it was potentially dangerous. Weird I thought that he didn't seem aware of what the rest of the world does.
Regards, thomas
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And forgot; no the shifters are on the same side. They're not that weird, lol
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Originally Posted by londonfieldsboy
I've always wondered why the UK set-up is different to other places; it seems like the fact that they 'drive on the left' doesn't quite explain it. Has anyone got any idea? I had my old bike (Marin pine mt) in for some repair a couple of years ago and when I picked it up the mechanic pretty much told me off for having the brakes 'the wrong way around' as it was potentially dangerous. Weird I thought that he didn't seem aware of what the rest of the world does.
Regards, thomas
Regards, thomas
Sheldon Brown's postulate was that the misperceived main brake (i.e. rear) has its controls placed on the curb side so that a rider can still signal with the drive side hand when braking. As he states, for this very reason he sets his brakes backwards in the US. I have a spot on my commute when it would be very nice to have this backwards set up and will be switching my brakes soon.
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Originally Posted by bike2math
Sheldon Brown's postulate was that the misperceived main brake (i.e. rear) has its controls placed on the curb side so that a rider can still signal with the drive side hand when braking. As he states, for this very reason he sets his brakes backwards in the US. I have a spot on my commute when it would be very nice to have this backwards set up and will be switching my brakes soon.
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
- Advising people to invert a habit they've acquired long ago (that is, left lever = front brake), sometimes as a kid when they learned to ride, is a majorly bad idea : during the time it'll take them to switch braking habits, they'll be truly dangerous on the road.
I say people should learn to brake properly regardless of the hand used to control the front brake. There's no difference in braking force between right and left hands, as anyone who went over the bar in an emergency stop knows, and there's no difference in braking modulation to speak of, so the only thing that matters is to know how to distribute front and rear braking power properly at all time.
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Here's my 2p worth:
-I find that the motor control in my left hand (am right handed) is finer than on my right hand. Which hand do you pick your nose with? lol It is therefore easier to modulate the power on the front brake using the left hand. This is perhaps even more true with disc brakes which don't require much power to lock up at all.
-Absolutely right here. It really doesn't matter if you brake with your arse, as long as you know how to brake and feel confident/comfortable with it!
As for Sheldon's reasoning, I do see what he's trying to say. However, braking with the right hand, with the front brake, at the same time as signalling seems mighty risky to me. Any hard braking with the front brake whilst only holding on with one hand would seriously scare me... thus RH=REAR!
-And I just realised that that might actually be the REAL reason why the brakes are mounted the way they are here. Signal when turn right, w. right hand, whilst having the left hand on the REAR brake!
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
- Advising people to invert a habit they've acquired long ago (that is, left lever = front brake), sometimes as a kid when they learned to ride, is a majorly bad idea : during the time it'll take them to switch braking habits, they'll be truly dangerous on the road.
As for Sheldon's reasoning, I do see what he's trying to say. However, braking with the right hand, with the front brake, at the same time as signalling seems mighty risky to me. Any hard braking with the front brake whilst only holding on with one hand would seriously scare me... thus RH=REAR!
-And I just realised that that might actually be the REAL reason why the brakes are mounted the way they are here. Signal when turn right, w. right hand, whilst having the left hand on the REAR brake!
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Originally Posted by londonfieldsboy
-I find that the motor control in my left hand (am right handed) is finer than on my right hand. Which hand do you pick your nose with? lol It is therefore easier to modulate the power on the front brake using the left hand.
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Originally Posted by ppc
Sheldon sets his brake levers the "wrong way round", with the front brake controlled by the right lever, because he reckons it's better that the stronger hand (i.e. right hand for right-handed people) controls the main (front) brake. Unfortunately, as much as I respect Sheldon's opinion, I think he's wrong on this one for two reasons:
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
Originally Posted by ppc
- Advising people to invert a habit they've acquired long ago (that is, left lever = front brake), sometimes as a kid when they learned to ride, is a majorly bad idea : during the time it'll take them to switch braking habits, they'll be truly dangerous on the road.
Back in the '60s there was no standardization about this in the U.S., and I was exposed mainly to British bikes that were designed for right-front...cable routing was much neater that way, due to the cable lengths supplied, and the "handedness" of the calipers.
Originally Posted by ppc
I say people should learn to brake properly regardless of the hand used to control the front brake. There's no difference in braking force between right and left hands, as anyone who went over the bar in an emergency stop knows, and there's no difference in braking modulation to speak of, so the only thing that matters is to know how to distribute front and rear braking power properly at all time.
https://sheldonbrown.com/brakturn.html#whichside
Originally Posted by londonfieldsboy
As for Sheldon's reasoning, I do see what he's trying to say. However, braking with the right hand, with the front brake, at the same time as signalling seems mighty risky to me. Any hard braking with the front brake whilst only holding on with one hand would seriously scare me... thus RH=REAR!
Originally Posted by londonfieldsboy
Which hand do you pick your nose with?
Depends which nostril...
Sheldon "Works For Me" Brown
Code:
+----------------------------------------------------------+ | I have to mention how wary I am whenever I read bike | | reviews which talk about how great some bike handled | | the instant the rider mounted up. | | If the bike immediately feels right, it's most likely | | because it handles very similarly to whatever the | | rider most recently rode. | | I have bikes that I have ridden thousands of miles, | | that handle and perform flawlessly. Yet if I've been | | riding something different, like the tandem (especially | | captaining) or my commuter with a heavy saddle bag or | | pannier and then hop back on my sporty single, I spend | | the first mile or so hardly able to get out of the | | saddle. I'm all over the road. I would swear the bike | | has been chopped in half. But within a short time, | | everything is back to normal, and my trusty old bike | | is handling great again. --Pamela Blalock | +----------------------------------------------------------+
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All of my mountain bikes are set up the "UK way", right-front. Now a picked up a road bike and have kept the levers the "US way", right-rear. I can go back and forth between all of them without giving it a second thought.
Long story short, you'll get used to it, and perhaps prefer the UK setup for moutain biking. But, like I did, you will fall a lot at first!
Long story short, you'll get used to it, and perhaps prefer the UK setup for moutain biking. But, like I did, you will fall a lot at first!
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I switched quite a few years ago and I do prefer right front.
Why ? I learned a long long time ago that I should always brake with the rear brake, or maybe with both in an emergency. Therefore I developped the habit of braking with the right hand. I eventually discovered that braking with the front brake was much more effective and not dangerous, especially on a bike with vintage centre pull brakes. Yet, even though I practiced it for many years, braking with the left brake never became automatic. Switching the brakes allowed me to go back to my reflex: grab the right brake and stop!
As for braking and signalling, I find the bike more stable if I brake (right hand) on the front brake and signal, than if I brake (right hand) on the rear brake and signal.
Why ? I learned a long long time ago that I should always brake with the rear brake, or maybe with both in an emergency. Therefore I developped the habit of braking with the right hand. I eventually discovered that braking with the front brake was much more effective and not dangerous, especially on a bike with vintage centre pull brakes. Yet, even though I practiced it for many years, braking with the left brake never became automatic. Switching the brakes allowed me to go back to my reflex: grab the right brake and stop!
As for braking and signalling, I find the bike more stable if I brake (right hand) on the front brake and signal, than if I brake (right hand) on the rear brake and signal.
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Originally Posted by ppc
Sheldon sets his brake levers the "wrong way round", with the front brake controlled by the right lever, because he reckons it's better that the stronger hand (i.e. right hand for right-handed people) controls the main (front) brake. Unfortunately, as much as I respect Sheldon's opinion, I think he's wrong on this one for two reasons:
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
- The dominant hand isn't really stronger than the other one, it just has finer motor controls. However, braking isn't exactly delicate work, it's a roughly modulated squeezing force and either hand is perfectly able to control a brake finely, as well as lock the wheel.
- Advising people to invert a habit they've acquired long ago (that is, left lever = front brake), sometimes as a kid when they learned to ride, is a majorly bad idea : during the time it'll take them to switch braking habits, they'll be truly dangerous on the road.
I say people should learn to brake properly regardless of the hand used to control the front brake. There's no difference in braking force between right and left hands, as anyone who went over the bar in an emergency stop knows, and there's no difference in braking modulation to speak of, so the only thing that matters is to know how to distribute front and rear braking power properly at all time.
Obviously, everyone should learn proper braking technique and just as obviously, not everyone should switch their front brake to the right lever. Still, I would suggest that right-handed people at least give the idea a good think. I had been using the front brake for a couple of years before switching the levers; I knew proper technique, but I still felt an improvement when I made the change. I simply think that every rider (including the OP!) should do whatever they are most comfortable with, but don't let the uncommon nature of the right-front set up fool you into thinking that it is uncommon for any particularly good reason. If someone thinks it might be worth a shot, they should go for it. They might just find they like it better.
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The best part about switching em is the your friends fall down when they try to ride off on your bike.
I think I do it just to be different, and to confuse my enemies!
I think I do it just to be different, and to confuse my enemies!