Questions about Suntour cartridge bearing hubs
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Questions about Suntour cartridge bearing hubs
I'm wondering about something I'll probably have to deal with at some point in the future. I'm building up an early '80's touring bike, and it has Suntour hubs with cartridge bearings (40 spoke rear freewheel hub, 36 spoke front). For now, the hubs spin as smooth as silk, but I've never worked on cartridge bearing hubs before, and I'm wanting to know what I'm in for if and when the bearings go bad. The bike is nearly twenty-five years old, I've just bought it, and I have no reason to think the bearings have ever been replaced. Like I said, for now the bearings seem fine, so my thinking is that I'll probably just ride it and see what happens. It's a touring bike, but unfortunately I've got no immediate long tours planned, the bike will be ridden mostly for city riding and some longer road rides.
The thing is, in looking at the available cartridge bearings in various catalogs, etc., I'm a little overwhelmed by the selection that's available. As far as the size of my bearings, they have an inside diameter of approx. 13mm, and an outside diameter of approx. 27mm. This was as close as I could get measuring with a metric ruler. In looking at the available bearings, it seems I may need to use calipers to get the precise dimensions, because the sizes are often listed in tenths of millimeters. And beyond the size, is there a certain type, brand, etc. that I'll need? There does appear to be some text and numbers on the plastic seals on my bearings, but it's not legible. Also, is it possible to carefully remove the plastic seal with something like the corner of a razor blade and simply flush the old grease out and re-grease the bearings, and then pop the seal back in? If that's possible, I could easily service the bearings with the cartridges still in the hubs.
And the other thing is how to get the cartridges out of the hubs if I have to replace them. I've removed oil seals from automotive axle housings with a seal puller, which works more or less like a larger version of a cartridge bearing puller. Do I need to get one of the bearing puller tools, or is there another way to pull the cartridges out? It seems that a properly sized socket could be used to tap new cartridges into place, so I'm not too worried about that part of it.
Any help is greatly appreciated-
The thing is, in looking at the available cartridge bearings in various catalogs, etc., I'm a little overwhelmed by the selection that's available. As far as the size of my bearings, they have an inside diameter of approx. 13mm, and an outside diameter of approx. 27mm. This was as close as I could get measuring with a metric ruler. In looking at the available bearings, it seems I may need to use calipers to get the precise dimensions, because the sizes are often listed in tenths of millimeters. And beyond the size, is there a certain type, brand, etc. that I'll need? There does appear to be some text and numbers on the plastic seals on my bearings, but it's not legible. Also, is it possible to carefully remove the plastic seal with something like the corner of a razor blade and simply flush the old grease out and re-grease the bearings, and then pop the seal back in? If that's possible, I could easily service the bearings with the cartridges still in the hubs.
And the other thing is how to get the cartridges out of the hubs if I have to replace them. I've removed oil seals from automotive axle housings with a seal puller, which works more or less like a larger version of a cartridge bearing puller. Do I need to get one of the bearing puller tools, or is there another way to pull the cartridges out? It seems that a properly sized socket could be used to tap new cartridges into place, so I'm not too worried about that part of it.
Any help is greatly appreciated-
Last edited by well biked; 10-27-06 at 01:29 PM.
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You need a special tool to remove the bearings and I believe the bearing are standard size (ie you could pick them up at bike store or industrial supply store.)
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You can use a nail longer than the width of the hub to remove the bearing. Place the nail head-first into the hub, resting it against the inner surface of the bearing. Tap on the point of the nail with a hammer, moving the nailhead periodically around the bearing.
Replacements can be found at loosescrews.com.
Replacements can be found at loosescrews.com.
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I had a set of wheels built up in the 80's with Suntour Sprint (?) cartridge bearing hubs. Didn't ride them enough to need to service them.....but, they had the same internals as some Specialized sealed bearing hubs I previously had on another bike. I replaced bearings on one hub (with simple tools from Specialized). Method above (Nick Burns) sounds about the same.
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Originally Posted by kgatwork
You need a special tool to remove the bearings and I believe the bearing are standard size (ie you could pick them up at bike store or industrial supply store.)
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One thing to remember when you replace the bearings is to press the new bearings into the shell by the outer race only. If you use force on the inner race you will distroy them. One trick is to use to old bearing as a tool to press the new bearing in as it will exactly match the outer diameter.
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Thanks for the tips and replies everyone. I guess the best plan may be to just remove the bearings when they go bad and take them into the LBS and have them match them to the correct bearing. The problem with that is that the last time I went into the LBS, I was interested in ordering some aero-style brake levers, and I had to argue with the "mechanic" and convince him there was such a thing as road brake levers that don't have shifters built into them. I have zero confidence that they can help me if I take a twenty-five year old cartridge bearing in to them. I would imagine most cartridge bearings sold these days are for suspension pivots in full-suspension mountain bikes, so I can imagine them matching these bearings up to something like that. That may be fine, I don't know. I was just hoping to figure out exactly what I'm looking for and just order it online, there seem to be plenty of sources. I just don't know enough about cartridge bearings yet to figure it out-
Last edited by well biked; 10-28-06 at 07:56 AM.
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Originally Posted by well biked
I'm wondering about something I'll probably have to deal with at some point in the future. I'm building up an early '80's touring bike, and it has Suntour hubs with cartridge bearings (40 spoke rear freewheel hub, 36 spoke front). For now, the hubs spin as smooth as silk, but I've never worked on cartridge bearing hubs before, and I'm wanting to know what I'm in for if and when the bearings go bad.
I would not recommend using the rear one, because cassette Freehubs are superior in every respect to the old thread-on freewheel system.
These hubs are a great example of "if it ain't broke, don't 'fix' it." Other posters have addressed the issue of getting the cartridges out of the hub shell.
If you do need to replace the cartridges, they are a perfectly standard size. If you don't find 'em at your LBS, look in your Yellow Pages under "bearings" to find a local bearing shop, if you live in or near a medium sized city. These are common industrial products.
However, don't try to take the hubs apart unless/until they actually fail (which may be a LOOOOONG time--they're super reliable!)
If you have the model I'm thinking of, the axle locknuts are aluminum, with 4 notches for a special, no longer available wrench. In my experience, even _with_ the special wrench, it is just about impossible to get 'em apart without wrecking the aluminum nuts. SunTour evidently used some pretty powerful Loctite-like thread adhesive, and they're hellaciously tight.
Sheldon "Love/Hates Those Hubs" Brown
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+---------------------------------------------------------+ | The Law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich, | | as well as the poor, to sleep under the bridges, | | to beg in the streets, and to steal bread. | | --Anatole France | +---------------------------------------------------------+
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Originally Posted by Sheldon Brown
Those hubs were just great ...in their day...
I would not recommend using the rear one, because cassette Freehubs are superior in every respect to the old thread-on freewheel system.
These hubs are a great example of "if it ain't broke, don't 'fix' it." Other posters have addressed the issue of getting the cartridges out of the hub shell.
If you do need to replace the cartridges, they are a perfectly standard size. If you don't find 'em at your LBS, look in your Yellow Pages under "bearings" to find a local bearing shop, if you live in or near a medium sized city. These are common industrial products.
However, don't try to take the hubs apart unless/until they actually fail (which may be a LOOOOONG time--they're super reliable!)
If you have the model I'm thinking of, the axle locknuts are aluminum, with 4 notches for a special, no longer available wrench. In my experience, even _with_ the special wrench, it is just about impossible to get 'em apart without wrecking the aluminum nuts. SunTour evidently used some pretty powerful Loctite-like thread adhesive, and they're hellaciously tight.
Sheldon "Love/Hates Those Hubs" Brown
I would not recommend using the rear one, because cassette Freehubs are superior in every respect to the old thread-on freewheel system.
These hubs are a great example of "if it ain't broke, don't 'fix' it." Other posters have addressed the issue of getting the cartridges out of the hub shell.
If you do need to replace the cartridges, they are a perfectly standard size. If you don't find 'em at your LBS, look in your Yellow Pages under "bearings" to find a local bearing shop, if you live in or near a medium sized city. These are common industrial products.
However, don't try to take the hubs apart unless/until they actually fail (which may be a LOOOOONG time--they're super reliable!)
If you have the model I'm thinking of, the axle locknuts are aluminum, with 4 notches for a special, no longer available wrench. In my experience, even _with_ the special wrench, it is just about impossible to get 'em apart without wrecking the aluminum nuts. SunTour evidently used some pretty powerful Loctite-like thread adhesive, and they're hellaciously tight.
Sheldon "Love/Hates Those Hubs" Brown
Code:
+---------------------------------------------------------+ | The Law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich, | | as well as the poor, to sleep under the bridges, | | to beg in the streets, and to steal bread. | | --Anatole France | +---------------------------------------------------------+
Last edited by well biked; 10-28-06 at 10:39 PM.
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In older cartridge bearings, the grease may have dried out. Is there a good way to force new grease in or otherwise provide fresh lubricant without removing the cartridges? I am thinking about the Suzue sealed hubs on my new/old tandem, fresh from sitting under cover in a garage for almost 20 years with all original components and only 200 miles on the clock.
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Originally Posted by sringlee
In older cartridge bearings, the grease may have dried out. Is there a good way to force new grease in or otherwise provide fresh lubricant without removing the cartridges? I am thinking about the Suzue sealed hubs on my new/old tandem, fresh from sitting under cover in a garage for almost 20 years with all original components and only 200 miles on the clock.
Last edited by well biked; 05-28-07 at 04:58 PM.
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Interesting point about "sealed bearings", but the front hub is definitely a cartridge and I assume the rear is too. I may just pop off the seal and try to squeeze some thin grease like Phil in there.