Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Professional Cycling For the Fans
Reload this Page >

Two leaders for Astana, Uh Oh

Notices
Professional Cycling For the Fans Follow the Tour de France,the Giro de Italia, the Spring Classics, or other professional cycling races? Here's your home...

Two leaders for Astana, Uh Oh

Old 09-24-08, 07:10 AM
  #1  
Crank Crushing Redneck
Thread Starter
 
SamDaBikinMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: A van down by the river.
Posts: 2,600

Bikes: Bikes are environmentally damaging

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Two leaders for Astana, Uh Oh

Just read in Velo News that the current thinking is that Contador and Armstrong will share leadership.

WTF! So when do you decise who goes for the win? Will they divide the domestiques in half and run two separate races? Maybe I am over reacting but this makes NO sense to me.

The decision needs to be made and it would obviously end up being Armstrong. If Contador chooses to go to another team then that is his perogotive. Quick Step tried to recruit Armstrong so perhaps they can get Contador now.

This is just a ******** idea. I can't believe Johann Bruyneel would even consider this an option.
SamDaBikinMan is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:12 AM
  #2  
Señor Member
 
USAZorro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hardy, VA
Posts: 17,934

Bikes: Mostly English - predominantly Raleighs

Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1491 Post(s)
Liked 1,071 Times in 633 Posts
I agree.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
USAZorro is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:17 AM
  #3  
Dances With Cars
 
TRaffic Jammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 10,527

Bikes: TBL Onyx Pro(ss converted), Pake SS (starting to look kinda pimped)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
The attention that Lance will bring to Astana, hopefully the plan is to legitimize the squad after all it's recent issues. JB career has been bet on this team he helped create, and Lance and JB would never compete again each other. I feel badly for Contador, it's like his girl left him to make up with her ex.

'There can be only one' Highlander
TRaffic Jammer is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:20 AM
  #4  
Roadie
 
ninjaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Yeah, Contador really just needs to extricate himself from that mess ASAP before he becomes the next Levi Leipheimer.
ninjaman is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 10:44 AM
  #5  
Senior Member
 
2wheelchef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wimberley, Texas
Posts: 70

Bikes: 06 Specialized Roubaix, 05 Bianchi Volpe

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Why? LA says 5 races only, no Giro no Vuelta. AC didn't ride the the TdCali did he? I'm not sure if he rode in AU. But I am sure that he didn't ride in every race that Astana took part in. There are more than enough riders on that team to divide them up, LA can ride the TdF with his folks after AC keeps his title in the Giro, then defend the Vuelta. It worked well for him this year not riding the middle race why not let LA do his thing? The guy most afected imo is Levi, who will GC Astana in Cali or GA?
2wheelchef is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 11:19 AM
  #6  
Roadie
 
ninjaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
But the whole point is that Contador desperately wants to ride and win the TDF again, to prove that his win wasn't a fluke.
ninjaman is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 11:23 AM
  #7  
Crank Crushing Redneck
Thread Starter
 
SamDaBikinMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: A van down by the river.
Posts: 2,600

Bikes: Bikes are environmentally damaging

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by 2wheelchef
Why? LA says 5 races only, no Giro no Vuelta. AC didn't ride the the TdCali did he? I'm not sure if he rode in AU. But I am sure that he didn't ride in every race that Astana took part in. There are more than enough riders on that team to divide them up, LA can ride the TdF with his folks after AC keeps his title in the Giro, then defend the Vuelta. It worked well for him this year not riding the middle race why not let LA do his thing? The guy most afected imo is Levi, who will GC Astana in Cali or GA?
I guess the thing for me is that Contador deserves the right to defend his TDF title and did not get that opportunity. So now he is expected to "share" leadership throwing the GC contention up in the air.

While I am ecstatic about LA's return I am also sadened by the position AC is now in. I'd be headed over to Quick step if I were him and leave LA to be sole team leader for Astana. As for Levi, I don't see him as a tour winner. Podium placement yes, winner, not likely. He is a great rider no doubt but always seems to fall back at some point and not recover the lost time.
SamDaBikinMan is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 11:30 AM
  #8  
Roadie
 
ninjaman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Posts: 934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I don't think Quickstep can afford him. Their sponsors said they would spring for LA, not Contador.
From an advertisement-return perspective, they're not even in the same universe.
ninjaman is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 11:33 AM
  #9  
Senior Member
 
2wheelchef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wimberley, Texas
Posts: 70

Bikes: 06 Specialized Roubaix, 05 Bianchi Volpe

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
You guys read the AC thing in Velo news? He's a little Bit@h. Any one see the Vuelta on TV? There is only one guy that's going to get AC the face time he craves and that's Lance. He can ride the TdF 10 times after next year may win a few and maybe we will get to see him win the 09 Giro or Vuelta live? There is more than enough to go around, you can't ride them all and if your on a team you do what's best for the team and the sport.
2wheelchef is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 01:36 PM
  #10  
fixed for the long haul
 
40 Cent's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 366

Bikes: 1975 Raleigh Professional, 1990 Cannondale 3.0 Touring bike

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Contador will be Dave Wiens and LA will say "go" at some point. Armstrong won't be a AC's level by July. It'll be fun though.
40 Cent is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 02:24 PM
  #11  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 736
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Astana has been successful with multiple leaders, have they not? 1st & 2nd in the Vuelta this year. 1st & third in the TDF last year. Two leaders? Maybe 3. If the Vuelta was run under the same rules as the TDF this year (no time bonuses), then Levi & Contador would have had the same overall time. The winner would have been decided by thousands of a second. Astana went into the TDF in 07 with 2 leaders (Levi & Kloden) & one wild card (Contador). They may do the same thing in 09. They were very successful with it. They had three riders in the top 10. They will certainly be the only team capable of filling a podium at a grand tour next year.
daveF is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 03:41 PM
  #12  
works for truffles
 
pigmode's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,037
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
What's wrong with having two potential leaders on the same team for the Tour? There is no certainty that Contador has it in him to dominate for however many consecutive years. The probability is there but its fruition remains to be seen. From Bruyneel's perspective having a potential La Vie Claire/Lemond-Hinault-like situation should have many advantages. It could work.
pigmode is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 03:48 PM
  #13  
Señor Member
 
USAZorro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Hardy, VA
Posts: 17,934

Bikes: Mostly English - predominantly Raleighs

Mentioned: 70 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1491 Post(s)
Liked 1,071 Times in 633 Posts
Originally Posted by daveF
Astana has been successful with multiple leaders, have they not? 1st & 2nd in the Vuelta this year. 1st & third in the TDF last year. Two leaders? Maybe 3. If the Vuelta was run under the same rules as the TDF this year (no time bonuses), then Levi & Contador would have had the same overall time. The winner would have been decided by thousands of a second. Astana went into the TDF in 07 with 2 leaders (Levi & Kloden) & one wild card (Contador). They may do the same thing in 09. They were very successful with it. They had three riders in the top 10. They will certainly be the only team capable of filling a podium at a grand tour next year.
Fact check time. In 2007, Levi was still with Discovery, as was Contador. Astana had Vino and Kloden.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
USAZorro is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 04:11 PM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 736
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by USAZorro
Fact check time. In 2007, Levi was still with Discovery, as was Contador. Astana had Vino and Kloden.
You're correct. Let me rephrase. Bruyneel has been very successful in grand tours with several leaders. Same people involved, Contador, Leipheimer, Kloden. Two different teams. And, in fact, Astana has been very successful with multiple team leaders prior to Bruyneel. Vinokourev won the Vuelta in 2006 and Kaschechkin was third. The point I'm making is still the same. Having multiple leaders & doing it successfully is nothing new for the team, riders, nor management.
daveF is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 04:18 PM
  #15  
Senior Member
 
Green Jager's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 97

Bikes: Giant OCR C1 ,Giant Yukon

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Well hopefully the problem will be solved and Astana will not be allowed at the Tour.
Green Jager is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 04:26 PM
  #16  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 736
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Green Jager
Well hopefully the problem will be solved and Astana will not be allowed at the Tour.
So, you like a boring tour?
daveF is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 05:29 PM
  #17  
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 12
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
If I were Contador, I'd stay, as long as the team is allowed to race in the Tour. Lance will end up getting ALL the face time and focus by the other teams and AC will be left to do his own thing. Lance takes the pressure and Alberto takes the wins. And, as has been mentioned, after this much time off, and at his age, the chances of Lance really competing for the win are remote, and the leader on the road will become the leader of the team, by the time it really matters.
JohnRW is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 06:02 PM
  #18  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,655
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by JohnRW
If I were Contador, I'd stay, as long as the team is allowed to race in the Tour. Lance will end up getting ALL the face time and focus by the other teams and AC will be left to do his own thing. Lance takes the pressure and Alberto takes the wins. And, as has been mentioned, after this much time off, and at his age, the chances of Lance really competing for the win are remote, and the leader on the road will become the leader of the team, by the time it really matters.
Very true,

By the time the TDF rolls around they will have enough season results to know if Lance is capable of being the team leader. Until then it is not really necessary to make any firm decisions. They will know by the first of july if Lance has a shot at the podium. I hope Contador stays with Astana as riding with Lance will only improve his performance.
Hezz is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 06:40 PM
  #19  
Senior Member
 
sykerocker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Ashland, VA
Posts: 4,420

Bikes: The keepers: 1958 Raleigh Lenton Grand Prix, 1968 Ranger, 1969 Magneet Sprint, 1971 Gitane Tour de France, 1973 Raleigh Tourist, 3 - 1986 Rossins, and a '77 PX-10 frame in process.

Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 221 Post(s)
Liked 237 Times in 129 Posts
Let's not panic too quickly.

First off, let's see how Lance does in Australia and California - I don't see Bruyneel making any permanent decisions before he sees how effective his riding is going to be.

Right now Lance is the publicity leader of the team. He has to pedal before he actually becomes the team leader.
__________________
Syke

“No one in this world, so far as I know — and I have searched the records for years, and employed agents to help me — has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people. Nor has anyone ever lost public office thereby.”

H.L. Mencken, (1926)

sykerocker is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 07:18 PM
  #20  
Senior Member
 
2wheelchef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Wimberley, Texas
Posts: 70

Bikes: 06 Specialized Roubaix, 05 Bianchi Volpe

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
The way I see it Johan is a genius, has any one rider won all three grand tours in the same year? But JB can be the first to have a team that has a realistic chance to win all 3 and maybe the Worlds as well? LA takes no money so he can hire every nurse maid and domestic in sight. He rides Contador in the Giro with Levi et all. Then LA in the TdF with the suport he needs, might just win, stranger things have happened. AC has the rest he needs to ride the Vuelta Spain's hero wins again (there is a reason why no one has won all three in one year). Maybe Levi sits and rests up for the TT at worlds? Or maybe JB takes LA's cash and hires another but JB has the chance to have all 4 championships on one team. Not bad for a guy who the French pushed out of the TdF in 08, the most boring TdF to date IMO.
2wheelchef is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 07:23 PM
  #21  
Senior Member
 
skinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 821
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
There are no guarantees with Lance. No one knows yet what he'll be able to do. Bruyneel is smart to cover his ass. Like 2wheelchef says, Bruyneel has lots of arrows in his quiver. He can't miss.
skinny is offline  
Old 09-24-08, 07:24 PM
  #22  
Senior Member
 
geraldatwork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Long Island, New York
Posts: 767

Bikes: 2005 Windsor Kennet, 1982 Raleigh Super Course

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
As long as Armstrong and Contador don't have to work for each other I think it will sort out. The strongest rider of the two will win. If the difference is that Lance really outshines Alberto on the TT days and gains a big time difference than he probably will have an advantage. If on the other hand some climber takes off on a mountain stage and both Armstrong and Contador take off and Lance can't keep up then Contador may win. I have no way of knowing but I don't think Bruneel will force one rider to hold back.
geraldatwork is offline  
Old 09-25-08, 06:45 AM
  #23  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: north-west ireland
Posts: 53

Bikes: orange mtb, road bike

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
how does lance legitimize anything ******************************

i do not beleive this i raced clean never did as paul kimmage says 2005 tour position 2-10 all dopers or major suspicions over them we are supposed to beleive only lance could compete clean against them ?? i dont think. i'm sick to death of the news being lance this or lance that why doesnt he crawl back into his hole and stay there. i want to watch bike racing not a lance armstrong publicity show
ednwireland is offline  
Old 09-25-08, 06:55 AM
  #24  
Dances With Cars
 
TRaffic Jammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 10,527

Bikes: TBL Onyx Pro(ss converted), Pake SS (starting to look kinda pimped)

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Just having Lance's face associated with a squad will net that team a Tour invite. Yes it's unfortunate that celebrity rules the day in this instance but it's a money machine at the end of the spreadsheet. The rest of the squad could show up with needles sticking out of their backsides but as long as Lance is in front, they're in.
TRaffic Jammer is offline  
Old 09-25-08, 11:56 PM
  #25  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Bossier City, La
Posts: 628

Bikes: 70's Motobecane, 89 Centurion Ironman

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by 40 Cent
Contador will be Dave Wiens and LA will say "go" at some point. Armstrong won't be a AC's level by July. It'll be fun though.
Everyone thinks Lance is at the same "speed" he was when he left....He left at the top of his game and is coming back to TDF 4 years later. Has he gotten stronger? I know he's game and will give this his best shot but what will his best be? Contador is very young compared to Lance and most GC contenders. Have we seen Contador's best yet? I'd love to see Lance win it all but if it's a "match race" between Contador and Lance,,,,,,,,,,,,CONTADOR......easily........
dahoss2002 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.