road bikes and disc brakes
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road bikes and disc brakes
Why is it I don't see disc brakes on road bikes?
Thanks,
Jim
Thanks,
Jim
#2
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Not looking in the right place?
More and more touring and utility bikes have them. But people who weigh components to fractions of grams would never tolerate the additional weight over caliper brakes.
More and more touring and utility bikes have them. But people who weigh components to fractions of grams would never tolerate the additional weight over caliper brakes.
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#3
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They're coming.
Race bikes have already been loaded with ballast to meet the UCI-mandated minimum weight. Some people have said that it would make sense to put that extra weight to good use -- such as, say, disc brakes so they don't have to cook wheel rims on 50-mph downhills.
I can't remember its name, but there's a new one with two small rotors on the front, giving plenty of braking force without adding any twisting forces to the fork.
Race bikes have already been loaded with ballast to meet the UCI-mandated minimum weight. Some people have said that it would make sense to put that extra weight to good use -- such as, say, disc brakes so they don't have to cook wheel rims on 50-mph downhills.
I can't remember its name, but there's a new one with two small rotors on the front, giving plenty of braking force without adding any twisting forces to the fork.
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It's because they don't sell well.
Trek debuted the Portland in 2006 as the first production road bike with disc brakes. They discontinued it due to poor sales after the 2011 model year.
I don't have many pics of the non-drive side of mine (a 2006 model). Here's the only one I could find fairly quickly.
Other than four-seasons all-weather commuters who are willing to drop some serious coin on a bike to ride in the rain and snow, there's no compelling need for disc brakes on a road bike.
Part of it too is that dealers couldn't figure out how to sell them. I own the only one sold in my area. There are six Trek dealers just on my side of town. Five of them have never even seen one in real life, until I ride in the door, then we're instant celebrities. They all think it's cool, but they don't have a clue as to who they'd sell one to.
Trek debuted the Portland in 2006 as the first production road bike with disc brakes. They discontinued it due to poor sales after the 2011 model year.
I don't have many pics of the non-drive side of mine (a 2006 model). Here's the only one I could find fairly quickly.
Other than four-seasons all-weather commuters who are willing to drop some serious coin on a bike to ride in the rain and snow, there's no compelling need for disc brakes on a road bike.
Part of it too is that dealers couldn't figure out how to sell them. I own the only one sold in my area. There are six Trek dealers just on my side of town. Five of them have never even seen one in real life, until I ride in the door, then we're instant celebrities. They all think it's cool, but they don't have a clue as to who they'd sell one to.
Last edited by tsl; 09-25-11 at 09:56 PM.
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I've done it, so I know it can be done,
but it was neither fun, nor pretty.
Next time I go to Colorado, I'm taking my Litespeed with its 1400 gram wheelset.
#6
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BarracksSi, That's a problem I had never considered, and already there's a solution waiting to go.
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I've ridden in downpours and down mountains (Mt. Evans even) and have always found rim brakes good enough.
#8
Bike ≠ Car ≠ Ped.
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The next bike I buy will probably be a CX with disc brakes. I have a good, light (enough) road bike for decently dry conditions but I've ridden through enough rain showers now to want something with disc brakes. Fortunately UCI has now legalized disc brakes for cyclo cross so more and more 2012+ models should come with disc brakes. And the CX will also double duty for the times I want to ride a bit of off-road.
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I don't see Alberto trading in his Zipps in the near future.
Last edited by tsl; 09-26-11 at 09:33 AM.
#11
Bike ≠ Car ≠ Ped.
All I'll want is for the Pro Tour to start using them. Then maybe us mortals will have more options available (not that the current offerings aren't good, 'cuz they are). I can't say that I'll give up my road bike anytime soon, but even after converting my commuter to drops -- which the general public perceives as a "road bike" -- I'd like to build up another that includes disc brakes.
Why the pros? Well, where d'ya think they developed integrated shift/brake levers?
Why the pros? Well, where d'ya think they developed integrated shift/brake levers?
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As has been pointed out, it's not just the weight of the wheels, it's the forks. They need to be beefed up to withstand the strain, and that both adds more weight and compromises handling. And there really isn't any need for them, if you're riding on the road you don't get the crud that CX or mountain biking has to deal with, and my rim brakes work fine. Moreover, while discs certainly stop you, they also require more maintaining and are more vulnerable to damage. So for the moment I can't see that the pros outweigh the cons for road cycling.
#13
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I have a touring bike with discs, and a road bike with dual-pivot calipers.
When I do my yearly complete tear-downs that include brake maintenance, after I've taken them off and cleaned them, I can install, align, and adjust my disc brakes in literally less than five minutes.
When I do my dual-pivots, it takes a good 15 minutes to get everything perfectly centered and aligned.
When I need to change my disc pads, I drop the wheel, pull the retainer clip, install the new pads, back off the dial, and I'm done.
When I need to change my dual-pivot pads, I need to deflate the tire, drop the wheel, install the new pads, fiddle with height and toe-in, tweak the barrel adjuster, reinstall and reinflate the wheel... and I'm done a lot later than the disc pads.
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I see people claim this all the time about disc brakes, and I have no clue whatsoever about where this idea comes from.
I have a touring bike with discs, and a road bike with dual-pivot calipers.
When I do my yearly complete tear-downs that include brake maintenance, after I've taken them off and cleaned them, I can install, align, and adjust my disc brakes in literally less than five minutes.
When I do my dual-pivots, it takes a good 15 minutes to get everything perfectly centered and aligned.
When I need to change my disc pads, I drop the wheel, pull the retainer clip, install the new pads, back off the dial, and I'm done.
When I need to change my dual-pivot pads, I need to deflate the tire, drop the wheel, install the new pads, fiddle with height and toe-in, tweak the barrel adjuster, reinstall and reinflate the wheel... and I'm done a lot later than the disc pads.
I have a touring bike with discs, and a road bike with dual-pivot calipers.
When I do my yearly complete tear-downs that include brake maintenance, after I've taken them off and cleaned them, I can install, align, and adjust my disc brakes in literally less than five minutes.
When I do my dual-pivots, it takes a good 15 minutes to get everything perfectly centered and aligned.
When I need to change my disc pads, I drop the wheel, pull the retainer clip, install the new pads, back off the dial, and I'm done.
When I need to change my dual-pivot pads, I need to deflate the tire, drop the wheel, install the new pads, fiddle with height and toe-in, tweak the barrel adjuster, reinstall and reinflate the wheel... and I'm done a lot later than the disc pads.
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That weight is nearer the hub than the rim (and the axis is an important part of the "rotating weight" issue).
This says that "inertial" (ie, rotational) weight of the wheels is negligible.
https://www.biketechreview.com/review...el-performance
I haven't seen any source that indicates to what amount the rotation weight contributes to effort expended moving the bike.
This says that "inertial" (ie, rotational) weight of the wheels is negligible.
https://www.biketechreview.com/review...el-performance
I haven't seen any source that indicates to what amount the rotation weight contributes to effort expended moving the bike.
Last edited by njkayaker; 09-26-11 at 11:48 AM.
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I have disc brakes on my touring bike and love them. I have no need for speed, however, so weight isn't an issue with me. I understand why roadies don't like them as the extra weight would definately slow down a good cyclist (however most aren't good enough to notice the weight difference, but that's a topic for another thread...).
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That weight is nearer the hub than the rim (and the axis is an important part of the "rotating weight" issue).
This says that "inertial" (ie, rotational) weight of the wheels is negligible.
https://www.biketechreview.com/review...el-performance
I haven't seen any source that indicates to what amount the rotation weight contributes to effort expended moving the bike.
This says that "inertial" (ie, rotational) weight of the wheels is negligible.
https://www.biketechreview.com/review...el-performance
I haven't seen any source that indicates to what amount the rotation weight contributes to effort expended moving the bike.
Unless the second one is a fixie.
Since you can't remove the braking surface from a set of rim brake wheels for a valid comparison, then you must add the braking surface--the rotors--to the disc brake wheelset for a valid, apples to apples comparison. Anything else is disingenuous.
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There's at least one company betting that discs on road bikes are worth doing: https://www.volagi.com
The only thing I don't like about the Volagi is that it has 130mm spacing. That really limits the number of hubs you can use on the rear.
I have a Salsa La Cruz cyclocross bike with disc brakes. I really like the extra stopping power. I personally would like to see a lighter version of the BB7 brakes and more options for road frames that use disc brakes.
The only thing I don't like about the Volagi is that it has 130mm spacing. That really limits the number of hubs you can use on the rear.
I have a Salsa La Cruz cyclocross bike with disc brakes. I really like the extra stopping power. I personally would like to see a lighter version of the BB7 brakes and more options for road frames that use disc brakes.
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Fair enough. I take it you don't bend any discs, then? And I've seen plenty of my MTB-ing friends struggling with jammed discs. But ymmv, and anyway I'm not arguing against discs for tourers, merely saying I don't see that they have any particular advantages for road bikes at present.
#20
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As has been pointed out, it's not just the weight of the wheels, it's the forks. They need to be beefed up to withstand the strain, and that both adds more weight and compromises handling. And there really isn't any need for them, if you're riding on the road you don't get the crud that CX or mountain biking has to deal with, and my rim brakes work fine. Moreover, while discs certainly stop you, they also require more maintaining and are more vulnerable to damage. So for the moment I can't see that the pros outweigh the cons for road cycling.
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When I need to change my disc pads, I drop the wheel, pull the retainer clip, install the new pads, back off the dial, and I'm done.
When I need to change my dual-pivot pads, I need to deflate the tire, drop the wheel, install the new pads, fiddle with height and toe-in, tweak the barrel adjuster, reinstall and reinflate the wheel... and I'm done a lot later than the disc pads.
When I need to change my dual-pivot pads, I need to deflate the tire, drop the wheel, install the new pads, fiddle with height and toe-in, tweak the barrel adjuster, reinstall and reinflate the wheel... and I'm done a lot later than the disc pads.
The main maintenance problem I see with rim brakes is that they eventually wear down the rim surface and replacing the rim takes a significant amount of time. Since I live in a climate where we have a limited rainy season this is only needed every 50 - 80 kmiles and therefore isn't a major burden. But I'd welcome a switch to a separate (and easier to change) disc if I frequently rode in wet conditions that wear out the rim's braking surface. I'd opt for just having the disc in the front since that's where you need the most effective braking and retain the lighter rim brake in the rear (I have yet to wear out the brake surface on a rear rim).
One other consideration is that the current disc brake designs make the 'lawyer lip' retention of the front wheel an essential feature. With a front rim brake I prefer to remove the lawyer lips to provide for more convenient wheel removal and replacement.
#22
Banned
Yea there are road bikes for racers .. weight weenies ... Titanium and carbon-fiber land.
then there are road bikes for commuters and the rest of the Lumpen Proletariat .
Put the BB up a half inch or so and you got the Cross bike thing going on too .
something for just about everyone.
FWIW, On my V brake posts I have Magura hydraulic rim brakes , pad changes are literally a snap.
then there are road bikes for commuters and the rest of the Lumpen Proletariat .
Put the BB up a half inch or so and you got the Cross bike thing going on too .
something for just about everyone.
FWIW, On my V brake posts I have Magura hydraulic rim brakes , pad changes are literally a snap.
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Thanks all for your input.
Jim
Jim
#24
Bike ≠ Car ≠ Ped.
Although I think it's silly, not only does Zipp put little dimples in their wheels, they even sell tires with dimples on them. I'll bet that they'd love to dispense with the brake track altogether.
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I've had to straighten the discs on two bikes;one got damaged in shipping from eBay(wheel also needed trueing) and one took a hit playing bike polo. Never had an issue just riding around town.
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