Hello LHT tourers, I had a fitting a few days ago and the recommendation was for a custom frame due to my odd upper/lower body ratio and "fatness." When I turned down an expensive custom bike and gave the fitter frame geometries from four manufacturer, Surly LHT, Bruce Gordon BLT, Trek 520 and the Jamis Aurora (Elite?) he picked the 54cm LHT because it came closest to a good fit.

I went to my LBS to discuss some changes such as wheel set, drivetrain changes etc and he sprung on me (a newbie) the detail that a 54 cm LHT only supports a 26in wheel size.

While I tried to follow the pros/cons of 700c vs 26in wheels in this forum, is this a disadvantage in some way for my cross country trip? A bunch of members in these threads say the wheel size does not really matter for touring but most wheel discussions on LHT in this forum only revolves around 700c wheels...

Thanks for helping out

Gary

The most important thing is for the bike to fit, not the wheel size. i had a 26 in wheeled LHT and loved it. Youwill get points about traveling in third world countries & ability to walk into Walmart to get tubes, but the fact is the bike has to fit. You will find tubes/tires available thru-out the country and worse case, get online and have them shipped overnigHt to whereever you are.

The fact you can get parts anywhere is a huge plus to 26in wheels. The only reason I would re-consider away is if you plan to ride unloaded on group rides after your tour and are concerned with speed when unloaded. Even then I would still not be too worried.

Like was said above, bike fit is the most important thing to consider when buying a bicycle.

I have a 54cm LHT with 26" wheels that I bought for use as a city bike and for unpaved roads and trails. I am currently running 2" tires, and it works fine for how I use it. Skinnier tires are available for better roads/lighter loads.

You probably know that the reason frames (especially touring) small than about 54 or 56cm sometimes have 26" wheels is that they fit better and don't force the designer to make compromises to accommodate the larger 700c wheel.

If the 54cm frame is a good (or good enough) fit for you, get it and don't worry about the wheel size.

These frames are all pretty darn similar in terms of geometry. Did you ask him why he thought the Surly was a better fit? The 54cm LHT and 57cm Trek 520 seem to be be pretty darn close to each other in all of the critical dimensions. Bruce Gordon's BLT isn't far off. The Jamis Aurora has geometry that splits the difference between a touring bike and an endurance/plush road bike; it's the most different from the other three. I wouldn't hesitate to ride a touring bike with 26" wheels, in fact that's one of the things I'll be looking for if I ever replace my current bike, but if you want 700c I would think that one of the other three choices could work for you...

I've an LHT with 26" wheels, I think its a great bike

+1

One thing I would worry about with a 54 700c would be possible toe overlap.

Gary,

My LHT is the same size, and of course is equipped with 26" wheels. I was concerned for the size as compared to 700s as well. After nearly 5,000 miles on it like most people I have come to the conclusion that I like them.

My concern going in was:
Are they as fast as 700s? Yes they are. I rode RAGBRAI self contained (fully loaded) this year. My ride partner rode it with a Kona Sutra...every day we pretty much rode side by side. We are relatively equally matched, and total weights with riders aboard were within a pound of each other. Hill for hill, we were equal. On flat ground we were equal unless there was a headwind, then I tended to pull ahead...maybe I'm stronger in winds... I'm not sure why. I was also a bit faster on the down hills, but this is where I found the short comings of a 26" as compared to 700s. As a downhill ended and became an uphill my LHT seemed to lose momentum sooner than a 700 equipped bike. I thought I could "feel" that sensation as well. But once a 700 bike lost momentum we were both on equal terms again...I also thought that my 24/36 gear ratio was slightly lower than the same geared Kona because my wheels are smaller.

Again, I like my 26" wheeled LHT...one plus so far (knock on wood) I haven't had a single flat, my wheels are still laser straight, and my bike handles great...never a hint of a shimmy...I have heard complaints of instability concerning some 700 LHTs...but perhaps they are more sensitive to load balance. I have not had any concern for that issue.

No toe overlap...even with fenders.

Enjoy!

You are planning a motel, non-cooking tour. If the bike fits, you shouldn't need to change a thing except maybe the small chain ring if the hills concern you and possibly the tires (go narrower) if you are disciplined about packing and won't be doing rough, unpaved roads. One nice thing about the LHT is that the steering tube is long and comes uncut. That will help with the fit.

Gary, I had a 700c 56cm LHT and now have a 26" 56cm LHT. With fenders the 700c version it was very easy to catch the tip of my shoes on the fender struts, not at all the kind of thing I wanted for an all purpose bike where commuting and grocery getting is my main use. Everyday I rode it I was hitting the struts. I don't know about the Trek 520 or other 54cm 700c bikes. If you are at all on the heavy side and plan on carrying a heavy load occasionally you'll appreciate the option of having fat tires. One time I had a heavy load on the bike so that my weight, bike and load was around 345lbs. Riding down the road along cracked asphalt, up ramps and onto bike paths it wasn't always possible to steer around bad pavement that would normally catch 32-35mm tires so I'd plow into stuff anticipating the bars getting jerked and I"d just float over the cracks. The stock wheels are good. Any reason why you want to change them?

If you want speed with an unloaded bike just put on very light 1.5" tires.

Hi sstorkel, I a n00b. I just go by what I read here and the prevailing sentiment is most everyone uses 700c for reasons that are beyond me currently but after my trip I'll be more knowledgeable. It was just that I had started speccing out a Surly with a 700c wheelset etc when it came across as a surprise. The explanation from the fitter was that, because of my body size, the Surly top tube length came closest to being useable unless if I went with a custom frame. Now that you say this I plan to call Bruce, he didn't respond to an email, and if he has a 54cm BLT in stock I'll go up to Petaluma and check it out. I also told my LBS to help schedule a pre-built 54cm Hurly for a test ride on Tuesday. Now that you say a 57cm Trek 520 might also work I'll try that as well, thet also carry it and the Raleigh Sojourn.

If you all can indulge me this is what the fitter recommended based on Height 5' 8", Weight 240 and the measurements:

Saddle Height: 71.2
Saddle setback 11
Reach 81
Differential 8
Saddle avatar 143 (hated it)
Handlebar 46
Brake Levers Sti triple
Crank arm Length 170
Seatpost Setback 2
Pedals SPD

The Surly frame size for the long haul trucker in a 54. Bar width 46 cm C to C - reach = 8cm no longer. Stem 9 Or 10cm 30 degree rise. Saddle Avatar Gel or expert Size 143. Seat post 2cm setback.

He had to set the handlebars to an "unnaturally" high position relative to the seat on the Retul system to get the weight off my hands. He said that will change radically after the trip or if I ride locally after a few months. That remains to be seen, but my goal now is to get comfortable, I don't plan to set any speed records...

Now that you raised the question, I'll ask again why he picked the Surly 54cm since I sent him the other specs as well.

Hi VT_Speed_TR, thanks for the info, I am planning a test ride on Tuesday with my LBS. I'll post after that.

Hi nubcake, this whole fitting thing seems to be a Black art even if they use technology like the Retul system. If you look at my reply to sstorkel, I have the result of my fit but the fitter said that it will change a lot after I ride my bike a lot and get in better shape and I would most likely need a different bike after that! or at the least a whole different fit as I get comfortable on the bike.

Now that you all say 26" is perfectly acceptable guess I won't obsess over it.

Hi Just Riding, doing a test ride on Tuesday. If it works then its a done deal. Now I just need to find out if the drive train discussions are different for a 26" vs the 700c bike

iforgotmename/Northwestrider, I won't be doing any wheels mods just to fit in, I'll go with what the manufacturer decided. Last thing I want is an appearance on the 11pm news as the rider whose foot got caught in the wheel in the middle of the countryside...

Understood...I was referencing the a 54/700 combo on another bike. Enjoy your test ride.

what he is saying makes sense. If you haven't ridden a bike for any duration it'll take awhile to develop postural muscles. If you haven't learned to pedal in a relaxed cadence above 70rpm that will be worth learning. The Avatar 143 has been a great saddle for me since I gained 50lbs over my weight when I rode a racing bike with deep drops. You say you hate it but do you have a favorite saddle? Your goal of being comfortable is a good one, if you haven't ridden on a bike for any appreciable distance try to incorporate your bike into other activities. Instead of getting in your car and going about to do errands for four hours starting and stopping at various places do it by bike. Instead of thinking of having to get on the bike and pound out the miles with non-stop riding set up rides where you go a distance, take a break, read a book , have lunch, then head back. Basically making time in the saddle a part of life.

Maybe it is just me but 46 cm seems like an awful wide handle bar width. I'm not a small fellow with a 44.45 (17.5") shoulder width and I like a 42 cm bar. Anything beyond that I feel splayed out. Just wondering.

Hi Gus, thanks for yr. reply. All of you on this thread have been very helpful. If the bike fits I am getting it. In fact, from looking at yr. CGOAB journal it is the same size as Shirley. Except that I am getting a Jeff Jones handlebar, a 22t instead of the 24t ( I am carrying a lot of extra poundage...in the body and need all the help.) What wheelset are you using, I can't make out from the pics? Also from yr. itinerary it looks like some days you are doing less than 50 miles, is that by design or is it difficult terrain? This is going to be my same route going the other way and with way less loaded training than you.

Gary

Hi indyfabz, thanks. I'll know by Tuesday. Yes on the 22t chain ring. I was thinking replacing with a "bombproof" wheelset, you don't think its necessary? Yes, I plan on traveling light(er) than most people on a loaded tour but my tendency is to overpack so I was thinking getting two pannier sets but smaller size - too much?

LeeG, thanks for the input. Yes, I am going with the most solid, dependable, rim, spokes, hubs and tires I am not only heavy, I am still heavy on the saddle (this may change when my legs get stronger and I am not yet nimble enough to avoid all the potholes, rocks etc. Also I am not that experienced mechanically to fix anything beyond flats so far. My LBS is pushing hard against some of the components I had gleaned from this forum saying that they were too expensive, he's even against the accessories like Ortlieb/tubus - he's suggesting cheaper alternatives. He says that except for the 22t chainring, not to change anything (he agrees w/you on the stock LHT wheels). I am pushing hard on the wheelset however.

Do you have a "bombproof" wheelset suggestion? If I consider Peter White as the go to site for wheels, he sells for 26" loaded touring the following:

Shimano XTR M950 hubs, Mavic D521 silver rims, 14-16 Wheelsmith spokes, 36 spokes front and rear
or
Shimano XTR M950 hubs, Mavic F519 silver rims, 14-16 Wheelsmith spokes, 36 spokes front and rear

But those are old Mavics (2008), I don't know what the equivalent new ones are. And these tires: Schwalbe 26 x 2.00 Marathon Plus

Gary

SFGary - If you have the money, get Peter to build some 36h Velocity Synergy Assym+WS DB+Phil Wood FSC wheels, and lace them radially on the nondrive side, spoke heads out, and 3X on the drive side. This combination will yield a low-dish wheel for maximum longevity, something you really need given your physical description. Peter will know exactly what this means. The front wheel can be almost anything, since it's inherently stronger and gets maybe half the load the rear wheel will receive due to uneven weight distribution. The front and rear don't have to match. You can "cheap out" on the front to help reduce overall cost due to the expensive rear. Any std 32h mtb front (rim-brakeable) will work and be more than adequate strength-wise. Even a lowly Deore hub will work fine. Of course, matching Phil Wood front looks nicer.

Also, consider Schwalbe Big Apple tires, or similar (26x2.0"). Run these at medium pressure, and they'll give you a good ride plus help protect the wheel. Strong wheels are a necessity for heavier riders, especially for touring bikes, and it's wise to spend any extra dollars on a good wheelset and tires.

Tubus racks are worth the extra cost, IMO. The Cargo and Tara (or Ergo) are the best ones for most folks needs.

Here's something you may not be aware of, it's geometrically identical to the LHT with better brakes (a real benefit for heavier riders), for slightly higher cost, frameset projected availbility is late March/early April when I inquired a month ago.

https://surlybikes.com/bikes/disc_trucker

Good idea, I'll try the taking breaks option. I already switched from the Velodrome (excruciatingly boring) into the streets but stopping and taking a break would be a change. Also I made a mistake on the saddle, I have not tried the Avatar yet. I don't know what they used on the Retul but that was a torture device...

Gary

peteydink, the fitter was surprised too. In fact he switched to the larger bar during the fitting.

Your fitter is either a genius or a lunatic... Knowing nothing except the numbers you've posted, it looks like you've got wider shoulders than I do, a longer torso and longer legs... despite being an inch shorter than I am. FWIW, if I were going to buy an LHT, I'd be looking at the 52cm frame. With the long top tube, the geometry ends up pretty close to my 54cm road bike frame. I've test-ridden larger frames and I just don't like the way they feel. Your mileage may vary, of course.