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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 10-19-05, 02:13 AM   #1
no tengo coche
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the secrets of brakeless and toe cages

I seem to split my time between sidi/spd and normalshoe/toecage. I love the simplicity of jumping off my bike, and having normal shoes on. But my full stroke definitely fells weaker, the back stroke is non existent, and the up stroke is also less effective than with clipless. On the flip side of that, it seems a little harder to skid the wheel with the cages.
Yet it seems more people opt for cages, even with brakeless bikes, and regardless of the SF hills. Is there something I'm missing, or is it just a trade-off that people make?
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Old 10-19-05, 02:45 AM   #2
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Some people complain of popping out of clipless pedals, most I think just want to be able to wear normal shoes though. I imagine once you are accustomed to riding that way you can be as (or almost as) effective in stopping and whatnot as with clipless.
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Old 10-19-05, 02:49 AM   #3
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maybe...tighter straps...
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Old 10-19-05, 04:02 AM   #4
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I had to run mine dangerously tight. I was also afraid of clipping out, but it has never happened with ATAC's. I wear a MTB shoe that does not click when I walk, and its a decent looking sneaker and I can work in it all day. I could care less if I was sporting the newest vintage vans, but I think its a fashion choice usually. Or a cost thing, atacs and shoes came to about $110, where as clips and shoes is usually some sort of free. In addition I only have one pair of shoes that would even fit into my clips so shoe choice was not a factor.

Milo
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Old 10-19-05, 10:46 AM   #5
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Öjust put down the money for double straps, then your foot will not move.
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Old 10-19-05, 11:03 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by no tengo coche
I seem to split my time between sidi/spd and normalshoe/toecage. I love the simplicity of jumping off my bike, and having normal shoes on. But my full stroke definitely fells weaker, the back stroke is non existent, and the up stroke is also less effective than with clipless. On the flip side of that, it seems a little harder to skid the wheel with the cages.
Yet it seems more people opt for cages, even with brakeless bikes, and regardless of the SF hills. Is there something I'm missing, or is it just a trade-off that people make?
When riding with no handbrakes, there will be moments when you will need to pitch your bike sideways. Chances are you will twist your foot doing so. If you run straps and cages it is no bike deal. If you run clipless you will unclip because that is what they are designed to do. As Travsi said, run doublestraps. Either buy two doubles or buy four singles and drill two holes in each cage and zip tie the second strap on there so it sits just a little lower that the first one.
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Old 10-20-05, 01:54 AM   #7
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The double strap sounds like a good idea. But even with double straps tightened like a virgin, seems like you just cant get the same back stroke as clipless. With clipless I tend to pull myself up hills, where as with clips I'm relying on the push down to get up those same hills (which isnt as affective for me, and seems to stress my knees). Also I feel like you're defeating the practical benefits of the cages, if you're clamped so tight you cant get out. Oh and the only time I ever pop out of clipless is when tweaking too much on skids, but I just pretend like im going for a one foot skid (I always pop back in as soon as the pedal comes back around).
But the more I ride the cages, the less I'm missing the fancy silly shoes I'm sure theyll still get used for some rides, but when commuting, its nice to make the instant transition from Cyclist to Walker.
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Old 10-20-05, 02:05 AM   #8
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I much prefer clipless, and ride them exclusively. I've never had an issue with popping out of my eggbeaters, and I use a mountain shoe that looks exactly like a skate shoe. They're comfortable enough to walk in for long periods.

I could never switch to clips and straps.
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Old 10-20-05, 06:32 AM   #9
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more like whats up with clip/strap riders and beat up vans m i ryt?!

i switched from clipless to clips/straps not too long ago, and yeah, i do miss the pure connectivity and control and pedal strokes, but since its my commuting bike, it just makes more sense for me to be able to wear normal shoes and sacrifice that extra efficiency

...plus it looks better :/
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Old 10-20-05, 07:14 AM   #10
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i didn't realize beat up vans were such the norm... man, now i feel like a sheep!
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Old 10-20-05, 07:34 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A3rd.Zero
I had to run mine dangerously tight. I was also afraid of clipping out, but it has never happened with ATAC's. I wear a MTB shoe that does not click when I walk, and its a decent looking sneaker and I can work in it all day. I could care less if I was sporting the newest vintage vans, but I think its a fashion choice usually. Or a cost thing, atacs and shoes came to about $110, where as clips and shoes is usually some sort of free. In addition I only have one pair of shoes that would even fit into my clips so shoe choice was not a factor.

Milo
I will echo every word said above... I have never unclipped without wanting to from my ATACs and wear a cannondale mountain shoe that doesn't click (time cleats click less i have found than spd) and they look snazzy look snazzy... I wear them all day long
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Old 10-20-05, 08:05 AM   #12
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Practice! Christophe clips with Binda straps . the way to go!

S/F,
CEYA!
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Old 10-20-05, 08:20 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evanyc
i didn't realize beat up vans were such the norm... man, now i feel like a sheep!
thats why i rock the beat up one stars: indestructables!
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Old 10-20-05, 09:08 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plinkerton
I much prefer clipless, and ride them exclusively. I've never had an issue with popping out of my eggbeaters, and I use a mountain shoe that looks exactly like a skate shoe. They're comfortable enough to walk in for long periods.

I could never switch to clips and straps.
what kind of shoes do you have? i'd definitely be interested in a non-bike-shoe-looking shoe. but some of the casual/touring shoes are fugly. some. not all.
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Old 10-20-05, 09:48 AM   #15
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queerpunk ...

661 and a few other companies make skate shoe-esque clipless shoes. if you poke around on jensonusa or other cycling web stores, you can find a decent pair. i will probably pickup a pair of the 661's if i ever go clipless fulltime on my fixie but for now, i like the cages.
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Old 10-20-05, 10:05 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by queerpunk
what kind of shoes do you have? i'd definitely be interested in a non-bike-shoe-looking shoe. but some of the casual/touring shoes are fugly. some. not all.
A ride a pair of old Duegi Touring shoes I found for 9.99 on Nashbar a while back.
They are wonderful and wish I could buy more. Very hard stiff sole and a sleek profile.
Carnac still makes some very fine Touring shoes like this one: http://www.rainbowinternet.net/shops...y54/product885
Pricey but probably worth it.
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Old 10-20-05, 10:06 AM   #17
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It seems that a lot of riders in San Francisco are into trick riding on their track bikes. That (and fashion?) is probably a big part of the OP's observation.

And I'd agree with 46x17's comment about popping out when pitching the bike sideways if clipless = SPD only, but ATACs, for me, make his statement false.
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Old 10-20-05, 10:35 AM   #18
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I know I am going to hear the opposite but the one week I tried clipless (Eggbeaters with Izumi shoes) I felt so disconnected from my bicycle it was lonely. I admit, I did feel like I was a pedalling machine and there is better power transfer on clipless compared to straps and vans shoes. But, on the other hand, I could not feel my bicycle. Kind of felt like I was dancing with robot. If that makes sense.
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Old 10-20-05, 10:42 AM   #19
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No Tengo Coche, what IS up man? You go to SF and then stay?


That's hot. I miss SF badly. Nothing much to miss here other than weather...

Hey, do you find, between regular shoes and overpiced cycling shoes any difference?

My biggest complaint is the stiffness that I don't get in regular shoes... Do you see that?

How is SF? Been down to Hellyer yet?

Did you go to City Light Books?

Cruise Polk and watch the "drag races"..

Golden Gate park at 2 am... lost of interesting smells and sights there.

Oh man, to be back in SF......

What's new!!
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Old 10-20-05, 10:42 AM   #20
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Clipless pull out if you put enough pressure on them, it only takes one pull out while flying down a *real* hill towards a busy intersection to realize that if you ride without handbrakes you better be damn sure your feet aren't going to pop off of your pedals. That's why I ride straps. If I lived somewhere without hills or had a bike that would take a brake I'd probably ride clipless, for the power transfer.
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Old 10-20-05, 10:59 AM   #21
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at the world's this year as you know i was in charge of sprints and alot of guys either couldn't clip in or pulled out in the first 25 meters or later at the 300meter mark.

i tried clipless with the old campy 440 grams pedal and couldn't get out so i went back to double straps.

S/F<
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Old 10-20-05, 11:06 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceya
at the world's this year as you know i was in charge of sprints and alot of guys either couldn't clip in or pulled out in the first 25 meters or later at the 300meter mark.

i tried clipless with the old campy 440 grams pedal and couldn't get out so i went back to double straps.

S/F<
CEYA!
I was told it was a "safety feature" of clipless pedals to release under very high pull, so that riders disengage from their bikes in a crash.
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Old 10-20-05, 11:14 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by 46x17
I was told it was a "safety feature" of clipless pedals to release under very high pull, so that riders disengage from their bikes in a crash.

YEAH , I remember the crash and can't get out syndrome. that is correct what you say but you can put them in lock so only if you fall they ONLY come out.

S/F,
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Old 10-20-05, 11:19 AM   #24
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QueerPunk:

I wear 661 Launch shoes. I just checked their website, and they have some new styles for 06. They look pretty good.

Here's the "Session"


And here's the "Launch", which look A LOT different than mine. I like them.


There's also the new "Dually".
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Old 10-20-05, 11:45 AM   #25
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What about this shoe, Looks comfy. Probably what I'm going to buy for my next shoe. Looks less like a mtb shoe than a lot of ohers that I've seen
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