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  1. #1
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    alright, everyone, i solicit your assistance and advice for this persistant problem in the BB/crank area. already searched in mechanics and everything that's been suggested, well, i've done. i'm sure lots of you have had creaking problems in the past so share your wisdom. i sure had, and wouldn't be posting about it unless i hadn't tried pretty much everything i could think of.

    here's the deal:
    creak occurs when when i'm pulling on the pedals going uphill and resisting the pedals going downhill and slowing down. i know it's not my saddle/seatpost. it's been that way for a few months. i'm using miche track cranks and started out with the matching BB. here's a list of my attempted remedies, none of which actually stopped the sound:

    -cleaned and regreased chainring bolts, crank bolts, and pedal bolts, and all accompanying threads several times.
    -cleaned BB cup threads and BB shell threads.
    -switched from grease to teflon tape to loctite for cups/shell interface.
    -swtiched pedals (to confirm pedals weren't the culprit)
    -switched BBs, from miche to phil wood. no avail.
    -tested loctite and teflon tape with phill bb. again, no avail.
    -had the BB shell ******** faced (done by LBS)! creak still there!
    -switched BACK to miche BB with grease. again, no avail.

    the damn creak is still there. i give up. that's the extent of my knowledge about these kinds of creaks.

    please help. i can only repay you in hugs.

    oh, and please keep my thread here. i don't like nobody else.
    every scar has a story

  2. #2
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    Are the tapers on the crankarms in good shape?

  3. #3
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trackandtrials
    Are the tapers on the crankarms in good shape?
    good question. i'm not sure. i haven't noticed anything unusual.

    the cranks are about 8 months old and were paired with their matching BB until i switched to the phil BB a week ago.

    but this (the crank taper) is one aspect i haven't explored. should i grease the spindle to see if that makes a difference? never done that before. kinky.
    every scar has a story

  4. #4
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    ok, just reading the barnett's chapter on taper fit cranks and they warn that marks on that extend the entire length of the flat section of the spindle indicate that the crank is not sitting properly, possibly causing a creaking noise. because the sound has been present with both BBs, it has to be the crank. i'll be checking this out tomorrow morning. if it's the case, i probably won't be buying miche cranks again.

    should probably invest in a torque wrench, as well.
    every scar has a story

  5. #5
    cxmagazine dot com pitboss's Avatar
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    Yo Hab
    I was recently cured of said "creak" downthere by having the BB shell tapped. I was running an Italian Shimano BB/Suntour Superbe set-up and it started creaking like a Hitchcock doorway. The frame was taken to the LBS and they tapped the shell - ta da! Installed a new Miche BB and cranks and the sound is totally absent.

    So re-tapping the shell might be a good thing - check with the LBS you trust most. And then check back in here!
    Deathlap - cyclocross, training, beer,...escape hatch

  6. #6
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    hey josh, thanks for the input. tapping and facing the shell worked wonders for the creak on my other bike, but i had my LBS do that to the raleigh just a few days ago and it didn't alleviate anything!

    sucks. anyway, i'm banking on it being the cranks not sitting properly. i'll check back in tomorrow when i take some things apart.

    chris
    every scar has a story

  7. #7
    Foward Leaning Attitude rithem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [165]
    Yo Hab
    I was recently cured of said "creak" downthere by having the BB shell tapped. I was running an Italian Shimano BB/Suntour Superbe set-up and it started creaking like a Hitchcock doorway. The frame was taken to the LBS and they tapped the shell - ta da! Installed a new Miche BB and cranks and the sound is totally absent.

    So re-tapping the shell might be a good thing - check with the LBS you trust most. And then check back in here!
    just a thought ... Suntour Superbe Pro have a taper like ISO not JIS like Shim, I run the Miche on mine works mint, It came orig. used on a frame with a Shim BB. John at Business confirmed this, thats how I ended up with my Miche in the first place, may a case of two stones with one bird for you?

  8. #8
    cxmagazine dot com pitboss's Avatar
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    oops - just saw that. Tylenol 3, post-extraction, may not be the best companion for online bike help right now.

    Perhaps the Miche crankarm/spindle interface has been altered by the use of the Phil Wood BB? I know that even the slightest gap can cause problems. I don't have any info on how the two (Miche/Phil) pair up.
    Deathlap - cyclocross, training, beer,...escape hatch

  9. #9
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    Your frame could be cracked/broken/etc.

  10. #10
    Cornucopia of Awesomeness baxtefer's Avatar
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    if it's not your seatpost, it could be your bars.

  11. #11
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BostonFixed
    Your frame could be cracked/broken/etc.
    interesting hypothesis. would be nice of you to explore that dangling "et cetera."

    anyway, what makes you think a creak like that could indicate a cracked frame? wouldn't it get worse over time?

    baxtefer: thanks, but it's not the bars, either. have switched them a couple times. it's definitely happening during the rotation of the cranks.
    every scar has a story

  12. #12
    griffin_ griffin_'s Avatar
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    what kind of bike is it?
    not that it makes much of a difference

  13. #13
    cxmagazine dot com pitboss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rithem
    just a thought ... Suntour Superbe Pro have a taper like ISO not JIS like Shim, I run the Miche on mine works mint, It came orig. used on a frame with a Shim BB. John at Business confirmed this, thats how I ended up with my Miche in the first place, may a case of two stones with one bird for you?
    Hey Rithem
    I know the taper differences, but that wasn't the problem. Oddly enough, the matching was never problematic for me - and no damage done either. The problem was the BB Shell in this case.
    good call though
    Last edited by pitboss; 11-14-05 at 09:39 PM.
    Deathlap - cyclocross, training, beer,...escape hatch

  14. #14
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by griffin_
    what kind of bike is it?
    not that it makes much of a difference
    no, it matters sometimes. it's a '76 raleigh track. like, the BB shell (part of the frame) definitely needed to be faced/tapped...but it just didn't alleviate the creaking problem. not sure about the whole frame cracking hypothesis though.
    every scar has a story

  15. #15
    Senior Member the mighty bean's Avatar
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    Make sure also that the sound doesn't come from loose spokes. I thought my creaking was coming from bb/cranks too, it took me a week to realize about it as the wheels where build just a month ago.

  16. #16
    asleep at the wheel fixedpip's Avatar
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    I think you've got to keep doing what you're doing and eliminating components.

    That said, I have a Raleigh 73 Professional track frame which was creaking after a friend had stacked it. I still rode it but there was this little creak that drove me nuts. Happened mainly in the saddle, but sometimes out of it.

    It turned out as well having an obviously dented top tube (which is why I'm a firm believer in top tube protectors now), but the seat tube/top tube lug had cracked also. The cracked lug was not noticeable to my untrained eye but my framebuilder friend discovered it.

    Got the frame repaired eventually and it no longer creaks. But just wanted to let you know the creak really didn't seem to get worse over time, it just infuriated me.

    However, I would think it has to be something other than that. Or maybe I should say, I hope its something other than that.

    Let us know what your crank inspection turns up, based on what you said I would finger the crank/bb interface as the most likely suspect still standing. Damage cranks really creak horribly. But generally you can reseat them enough so the creak should go away, which should tell you its the crank.

  17. #17
    Me talk pretty one day. eyefloater's Avatar
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    Someone else mentioned this one, but ya - check your seatpost / seat tube for dirt or other gunge. Sound travels around a bike in funny ways and it can be hard to diagnose the source sometimes. Let us know what the cause was when you finally get it, please.

    - eyefloater

  18. #18
    jack of one or two trades Aeroplane's Avatar
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    Did you grease your BB spindles when installing the cranks? Jobst Brant has a rant about it here. Maybe there is a little bit of play in the crank/spindle interface? Just a thought.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Irwin Goldstein
    Men should never ride bicycles. Riding should be banned and outlawed. It is
    the most irrational form of exercise I could ever bring to discussion.

  19. #19
    consistent inconsistency habitus's Avatar
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    ok, i suspect that most of you had trouble sleeping last night awaiting my update this morning. it's ok, it's ok: you'll sleep well tonight. here's why:

    first thing i do is remove the cranks to assess the "sitting" position of the cranks on the spindle. looks good: about 3mm of non-markedness on the flat part of the spindle. crank, therefore, is not bottoming out. check out the crank tapers--they look good, too.

    taking advice from several people in this thread, i grease the spindle and reset the cranks, tightening the bolts to what i think is sufficient (foreshawing). something changes: because i can push the cranks farther up the spindle with the grease, the inside of the drive-side crank starts to rub against the chainstay (one of the disadvantages of using 135bcd instead of 144bcd). fortunately i have an adjustable BB, so i remove everything and shift the BB about a mm to the non-drive side.

    ok, reinstall cranks with the grease, tighten like a mofo, and head out for a spin around the block. i notice that the creak doesn't occur as often as before, but it's still there. good news, though. figure i need to tighten the cranks a little more. after this first spin, surprisingly, i'm able to tighten the cranks even more with the chain and wheel acting as resistance (usually i just use the crank as resistance to the wrench). quickly back outside around the block, pedaling smoothly, i hear...

    nothing. sweet silence! no creaks.

    so the grease definitely helped, but i also learned something else: i'm weak. that's why i need a torque wrench. i don't know what 60 ft-lbs or something like that feels like, but i know that what i think is "tight" probably isn't "tight" to others.

    mmmkay.

    to my credit, though, after my LBS tapped and faced the shell they installed the cranks (tightly, i assume, but no grease), and the creak persisted. maybe we're all weak?

    so, again, it's definitely the grease. for those of you who "grease the spindle," do you notice you have to retighten the crank bolts more often? am i gonna die?

    finally, many thanks to those who have shared knowledge here. you're the best!

    come get your hugs!
    every scar has a story

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