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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 12-16-02, 06:05 PM   #1
dan the gimp
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singlespeed On-One gimp gearing

Someone help me please, anyway- does anyone know how to run gears on an On-One Gimp, it has the mounts on the top tube but not on the rear triangle which means I am currently using white zip ties, which dont show up too well on a black frame!

I can get max 3 gears because the outer cable wont stay still so when I put pressure on the rear mech from the shifter it just pulls the outer through therefore the gear doesn't change. (deep breath!) So if anyone has any advice I would be very grateful.:confused:
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Old 12-16-02, 07:30 PM   #2
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Dan,
welcome to the forums, hope to see you around here.
I have one quick question:

what the h*ll is a on-one gimp?

I'd suggest black zip ties!
old campy cable clamps (ca. 1960's?)

sorry I can't be of more help
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Old 12-16-02, 07:42 PM   #3
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Not sure exactly what your talking about but....

If your talking about running cables......
Do you mean there are no housing stops on the rear triangle? Is your bike designed to run the cables under the down tube and under the BB for the rear derrailleur? Otherwise, zip ties might be the answer.


I'm with Lotek -- What is a On-One Gimp??



EDIT: I checked out the bike. Sounds like its meant to be a single-speed. Did you get the correct hanger it said you needed on the site in order to install a derailluer? The site said that the frame had housing stops for running derrailuer cable, so I don't know why there'd be a problem. I'm still not clear on what your referring to, could you clarify it some?

Hope this helps.

-Moab

Last edited by moabrider47; 12-16-02 at 07:54 PM.
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Old 12-19-02, 05:26 PM   #4
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Thanks for replying to my question about the gimp.
You can check out what the frame looks like in the attachment. Or go to: http://www.teamplanetx.com/Pictures/...0gimp%20tn.jpg

As you will see on the picture, there are cable stops/mounts for gears to be ran, but only on the top tube, it doesnt use them on the under side of the downtube either. So i need a way of holding the outer cable completely still for the gears, otherwise i can't use all my gears- maximum of 3 at the moment. if the outer cable moves it wont change gear (not enough tension on the rear mech/derailleur).

It's a great frame, so if it can't be sorted, il just have to live with it until On-One/Planet X design something, which would be amazing if they did.

Thanks for your help
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Old 12-19-02, 05:35 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by dan the gimp
Someone help me please, anyway- does anyone know how to run gears on an On-One Gimp, it has the mounts on the top tube but not on the rear triangle which means I am currently using white zip ties, which dont show up too well on a black frame!

I can get max 3 gears because the outer cable wont stay still so when I put pressure on the rear mech from the shifter it just pulls the outer through therefore the gear doesn't change. (deep breath!) So if anyone has any advice I would be very grateful.:confused:
Don't you need real cable stops?And maybe the guides on the toptube are for brake cable,not shift cable/casing?
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Old 12-19-02, 11:17 PM   #6
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why would you want to run gears on a singlespeed frame?
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Old 12-20-02, 09:18 AM   #7
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For the rear derailleur to operate effectively there pretty much has to be a cable stop 3-4 inches in front of the rear dropout, usually on the chain stay, but I guess it could be on the seat stay. Without that stop to stabilize that last loop of housing it would be difficult to get the der to move.

This question is for the more experienced mechanics: Are there clamp on stops that could be used for an application of this type (ie, adding ders, gears to a single speed)?

I would contact On-One and ask them how the cable is supposed to be routed. It's their frame and accessory derailleur hanger.
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Old 12-20-02, 09:19 AM   #8
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For the rear derailleur to operate effectively there pretty much has to be a cable stop 3-4 inches in front of the rear dropout, usually on the chain stay, but I guess it could be on the seat stay. Without that stop to stabilize that last loop of housing it would be difficult to get the der to move.

This question is for the more experienced mechanics: Are there clamp on stops that could be used for an application of this type (ie, adding ders, gears to a single speed)?

I would contact On-One and ask them how the cable is supposed to be routed. It's their frame and accessory derailleur hanger. Were there no instructions with the hanger? Send 'em an email.
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Old 12-20-02, 09:39 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by RainmanP


This question is for the more experienced mechanics: Are there clamp on stops that could be used for an application of this type (ie, adding ders, gears to a single speed?
There are some clamp on stops.the diameter of the stuff they can be used on is the limiting factor.Check QBP catalogue or other similar source at LBS.
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Old 12-20-02, 10:01 AM   #10
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Those cable stops are for the rear brake. I dont think the bike is designed for multiple gears. Singlespeed frames are sufficiently cool that you could swap it it for a multi-gear model. Im sure you will find plenty of takers.

At the rear dropouts (where the wheel clamps in) do you have a hanger for the rear derailleur ( or a chain tensioner)? Are the axle slots vertical or horizontal ?

You may be able to get cable stops brazed onto a steel frame by a competant frameshop, but why ruin a fine singelspeed.
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Old 12-20-02, 06:31 PM   #11
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the gimp comes with an option to have a derailler hanger put on, i assume if that option was selected the frame also would have been built with the cable stops.

funny. i just finished cutting the damned things off of the fixed gear i built up. (not an on-one)
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Old 12-21-02, 07:00 PM   #12
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WOW cheers for your help guys
hopefully this will answer most of your questions:

i do have a rear mech hanger fitted.

i bought the frame because it is kick ass, and i was told it could run gears :S

if i used it just for what it is intended for then i would run it singlespeed, but as i have to travel 5 miles a day to work (well not everyday) i need gears. Which is why i desperately need to get this issue sorted, fast. I have got 3 gears max. but as the zip ties wont hold well enough so often they are really bad.

Yes, when i bought the mech hanger, i asked (emailed) how to run gears on it, the main boss geezer at On-One told me to use better zip ties (originally i had 24 of em on it, and that didnt hold!) i dont think there are any that are strong enough to keep the outer from moving!

Those stick on mounts that you guys mentioned, is it not possible to use them for gear outers? Oh, and thanks for the advice, but i don't want welded cable mounts/stops on my bike- id like to keep it how its meant to be.

If anyone knows how much those stick-on adhesive/zip-tie cable stops are, and if they will take gear cable i'd be very happy.

Thank you to all that have helped me!!
I may get a picture taken of my bike and post it on here, so that it will become more clear what im going on about

dan the gimp
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Old 12-21-02, 07:08 PM   #13
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You mentioned QBP, LBS they are?? website address please??

Cheers
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Old 12-21-02, 07:27 PM   #14
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QBP is a wholesale parts catalogue.Your LBS should have one or something similar.Why not take bike to LBS and have mechanic look at it?
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Old 12-23-02, 01:56 PM   #15
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Email Brant at On-One, explain what is happening and he will probably offer some additional advice. He is very responsive and definitely customer service oriented. He's probably the "old geezer" you referred to.

Quote:
Originally posted by dan the gimp
if i used it just for what it is intended for then i would run it singlespeed, but as i have to travel 5 miles a day to work (well not everyday) i need gears.
Five miles? Come on now Dan, multiple gears certainly aren't necessary for a five mile ride. It's certainly possible to do a few more than five miles on a one speed.
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Old 12-23-02, 02:12 PM   #16
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Reading all of the posts a bit more closely, I am betting that:
1. the cable stops are for the brakes
2. You are not using a full run of cable housing on the derailluer

If you use full housing, you should not have this problem as the shifter and derailluer will act as cable stops and the zip ties will simply hold the cable in place.
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Old 12-23-02, 03:33 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by riderx
Reading all of the posts a bit more closely, I am betting that:
1. the cable stops are for the brakes
2. You are not using a full run of cable housing on the derailluer

If you use full housing, you should not have this problem as the shifter and derailluer will act as cable stops and the zip ties will simply hold the cable in place.
True enough on #2.The full length housing from shifter to derailer is one way to do it,and provide positive end stops for the cable.but that much housing could in in itself cause shifting problems. Never done it that way,so duno for sure though.You would have to leave enough of a loop in the derailer end of the casing to allow for derailer movement.
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Old 12-24-02, 08:08 AM   #18
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You guys plucked the thought right out of my head! Full length housing! I just occurred to me last night that this should do a decent job. If you try it, Dan, as Pokey said, you still need an appropriate final loop. If I were doing it, I would probably wrap a piece of inner tube around the chainstay to protect the finish, and use a couple of zip ties to really anchor the housing. Hopefully this would stabilize that final loop almost as well as a stop. This would be about 3 inches in front of the dropout. Look at a geared bike to get an idea of where it should be.
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Old 12-24-02, 11:01 AM   #19
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Thanks guy's for your help- I did think about one long peice of outer cable, but surely it wont work, otherwise surely all bike builders/manufacturers would do it this way? On geared bikes, why is there a 2 or 3 inch gap between gear outers on the rear triangle, surely it is there for a reason


l===========l--------------------------l==============l
outer inner outer


sorry about the poor drawing, but thats what I am trying to explain

Yeah, il email On-One but its gonna take some persuading...

Oh, and what do you mean by this extra loop of cable at the end of the derailler???
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Old 12-24-02, 11:14 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by dan the gimp
Thanks guy's for your help- I did think about one long peice of outer cable, but surely it wont work, otherwise surely all bike builders/manufacturers would do it this way? On geared bikes, why is there a 2 or 3 inch gap between gear outers on the rear triangle, surely it is there for a reason


l===========l--------------------------l==============l
outer inner outer


sorry about the poor drawing, but thats what I am trying to explain

Yeah, il email On-One but its gonna take some persuading...

Oh, and what do you mean by this extra loop of cable at the end of the derailler???
there is a reason they don't do it that way.They use proper cable stops in the right places,and as mentioned the continious long cable could cause shifting problems.....gear outers?? I have no clue. Why doncha take it to a bike Shop where a mechanic can LOOK at it and tell you what you need to do??????????????
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Old 12-24-02, 11:38 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by dan the gimp
I did think about one long peice of outer cable, but surely it wont work, otherwise surely all bike builders/manufacturers would do it this way?
Dan -

This is the way it was done in the old days, before cable stops were put on frames, so it definitely does work. Also, nowadays you can get some high quality cables and housings that will make things run smooth as butter.

Of course, I still advocate riding the thing with one gear (as it was properly designed), but that's just me.
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Old 12-24-02, 11:39 AM   #22
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One more thing, install a Rollamajig down at the derailluer and you won't need the big loop and things will shift better.
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Old 12-24-02, 12:31 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by riderx
Dan -

This is the way it was done in the old days, before cable stops were put on frames, so it definitely does work.
Wasn't that the days of friction shifting,when anything worked?
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Old 12-24-02, 01:37 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by pokey
Wasn't that the days of friction shifting,when anything worked?
Sure was. If you are going to run multiple gears, friction is still the best in my opinion. Cables can be completely contaminated, drivetrain can be loaded with mud, and you can still switch gears. You can also switch through a big range of gears in one big swoop. Any experienced cyclists can hit shifts easily after they ride friction for a short bit.

A quote from the Rivendell site:
Quote:
Also in here, you'll find leather saddles, wool clothing, waxed cotton saddlebags and panniers, standard pedals clips and straps, assorted curved handlebars, chains and freewheels, forged aluminum cranks, sidepull and cantilever brakes, friction shifters, and cotton handlebar tape. As technology goes, we don't consider it outdated, but refined, and in some cases, perfected.
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Old 12-24-02, 02:56 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by riderx


A quote from the Rivendell site:
But even Grant Petersen/Rivendell has come over to the side of current fashion.The new Romulus built bikes have 9 speed cassettes and Shimano barend index shifting...But maybe they disable the index mode on the shifters?
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