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  1. #1
    loose cannon tarman's Avatar
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    Yet another lock thread

    After trading in my cable lock for some real security in the form of a kryptonite standard U-lock, I've been having problems getting it to actually lock around stuff. Signs and stuff fit, most others don't. I tried getting a cable to go from the u-lock to whatever I'm locking it to, but that's a bit unwieldy. I've decided my best option is locking skewers and a chain.

    However, my u-lock is a relatively svelte 2lbs. I don't want to carry around 10lbs of chain to replace that, but I don't want my bike stolen either. What's the best compromise? There's theft in Boston, but it's not NYC. What do you use?

    KJ
    "Myself I get 20 mpcb (miles per can of beans), $0.79 for premium last I checked." -scattered73

  2. #2
    Senior Member Morgie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarman
    After trading in my cable lock for some real security in the form of a kryptonite standard U-lock, I've been having problems getting it to actually lock around stuff. Signs and stuff fit, most others don't. I tried getting a cable to go from the u-lock to whatever I'm locking it to, but that's a bit unwieldy. I've decided my best option is locking skewers and a chain.

    However, my u-lock is a relatively svelte 2lbs. I don't want to carry around 10lbs of chain to replace that, but I don't want my bike stolen either. What's the best compromise? There's theft in Boston, but it's not NYC. What do you use?

    KJ
    I live in cambridge, and having had smaller locks cut and my bike disappear I wouldn't use anythin less then a U-lock or something of comparable strengh. You could get a chain lock that is larger and would fit around more things but it would be just as heavy or heavier... other options include:
    http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20

    http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20

    http://www.onguardlock.com/armour.html

    All of which are secure, yet also heavy.

    This is the lock that was cut (would not recommend):
    http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20

  3. #3
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    just get a bigger U lock

  4. #4
    Senior Member sers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarman
    After trading in my cable lock for some real security in the form of a kryptonite standard U-lock, I've been having problems getting it to actually lock around stuff. Signs and stuff fit, most others don't. I tried getting a cable to go from the u-lock to whatever I'm locking it to, but that's a bit unwieldy. I've decided my best option is locking skewers and a chain.

    However, my u-lock is a relatively svelte 2lbs. I don't want to carry around 10lbs of chain to replace that, but I don't want my bike stolen either. What's the best compromise? There's theft in Boston, but it's not NYC. What do you use?

    KJ
    Brighton reprayzent!

    i've been using an onguard mini bulldog for the past year all around the city. sheldon style through the rear wheel (inside the rear triangle) usually attaches it to most parking meters, signs and racks. in the rare event that i need to lock it to something larger for a short time, i have one of their 10mm cables that i loop around the post and then attach to my lock which is securing the rear wheel to the frame.

    frankly, i consider the biggest threat to my bike rowdy/drunk college kids as they seem to like stomping bikes. never had a problem when i locked up in cambridge, roxbury, dorchester, lower allston, mission hill or anywhere else for that matter. if you use a good mini-u correctly, then you're probably better off than 90% of the people who leave their bikes locked in the boston area. i see thin cable locks, unsecured quick release components, and ulocks secured to quick release components all the time.

  5. #5
    LF for the accentdeprived
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    Learn to use the U. That's the best lock type, really... unless you don't mind 3or4 pounds of extra weight that you have to carry around only for being able to lock to a thicker pole.Then buy a chain.

    Forget cables. Cable from the U to the pole??? That's like freelocking... Not recommended if you like your bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by dutret
    Do you deny that you are clueless or do you just think that "moron" didn't need to be tacked on there?
    Bike on flickr and on FGG

  6. #6
    spectacular
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    I use the chain. Around the waist I hardly even notice it. The increased range of lock-to-able spots is so worth it, plus you can lock a friend up with you if for some ungodly reason they don't have a lock or just can't lock up at the spot where you're locking.
    If it's worth the going it's worth the ride.

  7. #7
    domestique squeakywheel's Avatar
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    I used to see U-locks at college campuses in weird configurations. I always thought these people didn't know what they are doing. Havent' they seen Sheldon Brown's page where he shows how to lock the rear wheel from inside the rear triangle. That way they can't steel your rear wheel.

    I have a U-lock now. It can be tough getting it around some rigid object and your rear wheel. Now, I'm one of those guys who might U-lock the head tube to a tree.

    I think the right answer if you are having trouble reaching rigid objects with the U-lock is to just get a bigger U-lock.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by squeakywheel
    Havent' they seen Sheldon Brown's page where he shows how to lock the rear wheel from inside the rear triangle. That way they can't steel your rear wheel.
    just the rest of your bike.

  9. #9
    spectacular
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    Quote Originally Posted by dutret
    just the rest of your bike.
    Nope. If you lock through the back wheel correctly the bike itself is safe. Of course it doesn't protect the stem, bars, front wheel, and such, but what lock does? If you're through the back wheel properly they can't get the U through the rear triangle, thereby protecting the whole whip. Think about it. My problem with this strategy is that it won't be readily evident to the thief that the bike is, in fact, secure. This might encourage them to make an attempt and leave your bike half taken apart or worse if they get frustrated at being thwarted and decide to take their anger out on the bike.
    If it's worth the going it's worth the ride.

  10. #10
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    Does anyone know is Krypto or similar makes chain with massive links, but that is only the length of a mini-ulock shackle? Just enough for front wheel, frame & parking meter. I didn't see one on their site.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by chip thunder
    Nope. If you lock through the back wheel correctly the bike itself is safe. Of course it doesn't protect the stem, bars, front wheel, and such, but what lock does? If you're through the back wheel properly they can't get the U through the rear triangle, thereby protecting the whole whip. Think about it. My problem with this strategy is that it won't be readily evident to the thief that the bike is, in fact, secure. This might encourage them to make an attempt and leave your bike half taken apart or worse if they get frustrated at being thwarted and decide to take their anger out on the bike.
    Sheldon is wrong. They can easily cut the wheel then just leave the lock. You bike is only as secure as the weakest link and an extruded aluminum rim is alot weaker then most things you would lock to or the lock itself.

  12. #12
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    Yeah, might as well secure a seat stay in there while you at it.

  13. #13
    spectacular
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    The spoke tension will make the rim a huge pain in the ass to cut through. There's a reason that wheels stay true through bumps and hits. I don't employ his method myself, but I definitely see how it works.
    If it's worth the going it's worth the ride.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Morgie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dutret
    Sheldon is wrong. They can easily cut the wheel then just leave the lock. You bike is only as secure as the weakest link and an extruded aluminum rim is alot weaker then most things you would lock to or the lock itself.

    If your locking the rear wheel wouldn't either of these positions work better? My lock ("on guard" U-lock which was just what I convinced my LBS to through in with my roadie bike) fits in both configurations.. They seem safer then sheldon's to me???


  15. #15
    jack of one or two trades Aeroplane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dutret
    They can easily cut the wheel ...
    I think this is where you're wrong. Cutting through a wheel, inflated tube and tire is ****ing hard. 99% of the time, the thief could do better by going to a bike with a crappier lock and/or more poorly locked bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Irwin Goldstein
    Men should never ride bicycles. Riding should be banned and outlawed. It is
    the most irrational form of exercise I could ever bring to discussion.

  16. #16
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    I've seen bikes with their top tubes cut, so to suggest that a rear rim is going to be hard is funny. But, don't go locking your bike up on 7th/Market.

    In response to the shorter Krypto links, you can buy those same links and some locksmiths in any length you want. Which would be kind of cool. Then just get a Krypto disc lock and you're set.

  17. #17
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    Having tried to hacksaw through a wheel to test this theory, I can tell you that I got a blade seriously stuck then broke it. On my second attempt I got through it with a lot of work and some cutting fluid. I cut through a ****ty rigida rim and was able to bend the two cut ends away to get the lock out, but if someone were sawing a bigger rim like a Deep-V two cuts might have to be made to get the lock out.

    So yeah, the Sheldon technique is just fine; if people are going to go through the effort to cut your rim, they'll probably find a way to steal your bike anyway.

  18. #18
    jack of one or two trades Aeroplane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donkekus
    I've seen bikes with their top tubes cut, so to suggest that a rear rim is going to be hard is funny. But, don't go locking your bike up on 7th/Market.
    Honestly, I really think that if I had a choice between cutting one of the two, based on ease, I'd go for the top tube. But give it a try.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Irwin Goldstein
    Men should never ride bicycles. Riding should be banned and outlawed. It is
    the most irrational form of exercise I could ever bring to discussion.

  19. #19
    Good Afternoon! SamHouston's Avatar
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    Rims are hard to slice through, easier to attack part of the rear triangle & make 2 cuts. Either way it's not riding away beneath the thief. I don't use the Sheldon method because an idiot might think it's not secure and remove the rear wheel, then jerk the bike around trying to figure out how to get it loose.

    Easier than slicing through the rim would be to deflate the tire, cut the tire & tube, crack the rim at the seam, snip the spokes that seperate gap in rim from u-lock.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by heliumb
    Does anyone know is Krypto or similar makes chain with massive links, but that is only the length of a mini-ulock shackle? Just enough for front wheel, frame & parking meter. I didn't see one on their site.

    krypto noose lock might do the trick. The noose makes it so you can cinch it down and make the whole chain shorter

  21. #21
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    I don't use the Sheldon method because an idiot might think it's not secure and remove the rear wheel, then jerk the bike around trying to figure out how to get it loose.
    The Sheldon method seems to rely on the fact that if they try to pry the bike loose, they'll destroy the rim and tire and not your frame. Are you saying that the stays will give before the rim?

    If they have bad-ass enough tools to cut through a rim and tire easily, then they can get the U-lock off regardless, so the method doesn't concern them.

  22. #22
    Senior Member Morgie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by schnee
    The Sheldon method seems to rely on the fact that if they try to pry the bike loose, they'll destroy the rim and tire and not your frame. Are you saying that the stays will give before the rim?

    If they have bad-ass enough tools to cut through a rim and tire easily, then they can get the U-lock off regardless, so the method doesn't concern them.
    I think his point was that some idiot might think "I can take that bike EASY!".. then the idiot procedes to the **** up the rim and tire (and maybe more) attempting to steal the bike, and may or may not succeed.. had the bike been lock in a more traditional secure manner then the idiot theif might have kept walking

  23. #23
    loose cannon tarman's Avatar
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    Thanks for the replies. I'm OK if I can find a parking meter, but one of the lovely things about Brighton is that in a lot of spaces on-street parking has no meters. Specifically, I went to get my haircut in Oak Square, nothing but 6" tree trunks and thicker lampposts. I has to leave my bike out front locked to itself. I don't know about a U-lock big enough for that situation!

    Any chains that are secure but in the 5lbs (thereabouts) or less category?

    I agree though that the sheldon method may appear to the dumber thief to be inferior, so may lead to messing with and what have you. Just a thought..

    KJ
    "Myself I get 20 mpcb (miles per can of beans), $0.79 for premium last I checked." -scattered73

  24. #24
    Senior Member Morgie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarman
    Thanks for the replies. I'm OK if I can find a parking meter, but one of the lovely things about Brighton is that in a lot of spaces on-street parking has no meters. Specifically, I went to get my haircut in Oak Square, nothing but 6" tree trunks and thicker lampposts. I has to leave my bike out front locked to itself. I don't know about a U-lock big enough for that situation!

    Any chains that are secure but in the 5lbs (thereabouts) or less category?

    I agree though that the sheldon method may appear to the dumber thief to be inferior, so may lead to messing with and what have you. Just a thought..

    KJ

    Depending on your situation you could always leave a thick chain somewhere. A lot of people leave a U-lock locked to a pole at work so they don't have to carry it everyday. You could just leave something downtown where you are a lot.

  25. #25
    Dog is my co-pilot 2manybikes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarman
    Any chains that are secure but in the 5lbs (thereabouts) or less category?
    google google google......

    The fahgedabout it is 3' 3" long. And 8.4 lb

    This is the NY noose 2"3" long. Just what you want I think. 4.6 lb

    http://www.kryptonitelock.com/inetis...s_item&pgrp=20
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by 2manybikes; 10-13-06 at 07:41 PM.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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