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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 10-22-06, 12:09 PM   #1
RedDeMartini
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Skidding versus control

Though skidding can be an effective means of stopping, (once achieved). I am aware that I am a little out of control when I do it. As opposed to the subtle control that can be achived by applying differing pressure when pedaling and counterpedaling. Which I find is easier with straight or riser bars.

Anyone else have thoughts on the pros and cons of different braking techniques and their relationship to equipment. I found it really easy to skid when I used a long stem and chop and flops that threw my weight far forward. But I also run a nice balanced gear ratio 46x18/16.
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Old 10-22-06, 12:43 PM   #2
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i usually sKiP if i need to control speed (either moderately or abruptly), and skid in a hockey stop manner (with back fishtailing out to one side) to abruptly stop if needed or control speed down steep hills...this is much mor effective than either skidding straight or skipping...and i never lean forward to skid

i always feel most comfortable and in control with my hands in 'bullhorn position' (wrists turned outward in relation to thumb) on my drops (they are tilted up considerably), but this may have to do with my indivual fit on my ride
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Old 10-22-06, 12:54 PM   #3
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I find skidding is my favorite way to slow down, not the best, just favored. Balls on the stem and just slide forever, especially on wet/snowy streets. I like to think about that tokyo drift movie when I do it.
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Old 10-22-06, 01:21 PM   #4
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Though skidding can be an effective means of stopping, (once achieved).
Skidding is the worse way to stop. Learn how to stop without locking your rear wheel if you want maximum braking out of the rear. Or put a rear brake on.
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Old 10-22-06, 01:35 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operator
Skidding is the worse way to stop. Learn how to stop without locking your rear wheel if you want maximum braking out of the rear. Or put a rear brake on.
i disagree
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Old 10-22-06, 10:02 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teiaperigosa
i disagree
Skidding tires are basically slipping over the surface of the road and have less traction. Same princple in a car or motorbike, with the front brakes doing the majority of the stopping as weight gets shifted forward when slowing down. When this happens weight lifts off the rear of the vehicle, traction is lost and skidding can occuer. Brakes are more effictive for stopping than skidding.
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Old 10-22-06, 10:25 PM   #7
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i disagree
Good for you, but you're wrong.
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Old 10-22-06, 10:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operator
Good for you, but you're wrong.
+1
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Old 10-22-06, 10:43 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by operator
Skidding is the worse way to stop. Learn how to stop without locking your rear wheel if you want maximum braking out of the rear. Or put a rear brake on.
DO YOU EVEN RIDE FIXED?? JEEZ!!

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Old 10-22-06, 10:48 PM   #10
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It's been discussed time and again. Skidding is not the most effective way to stop.

Wikipedia
"An anti-lock braking system (ABS) is a system on motor vehicles which prevents the wheels from locking while braking. The purpose of this is twofold: to allow the driver to maintain steering control under heavy braking and, in most situations, to shorten braking distances (by allowing the driver to hit the brake fully without the fear of skidding or loss of control). "

The same general principles apply for bikes.
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Old 10-23-06, 12:14 AM   #11
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For winter, I gear down to 72 gear inches so that I can stop without a brake and without skidding or skipping.

At 72" I can counter pedal to a stop on the steepest hill in my riding area.

Over the past two years, my spin has improved so much I actually get around faster now at 72" than I did at 82".

I think it has something to do with a more consistent average speed.

In any event, I have so much more control in a variety of situations, I think I'll stay at 72" year around.
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Old 10-23-06, 01:07 AM   #12
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hard almost seated (i cant quite get it seated) skid with or without backpedaling further than just locking the wheel is my stopping method of choice. pretty certain i can stop faster like that than with backpedaling and not locking the rear. we're talking no brakes, right?
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Old 10-23-06, 01:59 AM   #13
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Okay, newbie here.

So I know skidding. What's skipping?
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Old 10-23-06, 02:01 AM   #14
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somewhat like hopping and skidding combined, achieved by skipping your legs.
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Old 10-23-06, 10:52 AM   #15
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how fast you stop with a skid all dependent upon where you have your weight centered on your bike...do a short little skid with your ass just an inch off of the seat or even sitting and you'll slow down pretty darn quick....lean out over the bars and you can skid forever barely scrubbing any speed...one looks cool and the other is all about function.
of course skidding is never going to give the stopping power and brake modulation as a brake (except maybe coaster) but it is still efficient enough once you figure it all out.
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Old 10-23-06, 10:54 AM   #16
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If you are out of control while skidding please put a brake on the bike.
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Old 10-23-06, 11:04 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by operator
Good for you, but you're wrong.
oh boy...here we go (today's lunch has been amusing)

I didn't take this thread to be a brake vs. no brake thread... brake police can parrot about all you want

I disagree , assuming you are riding fixed and talking about using your leg power to break (the OP was talking about skidding and skipping!!!, shiet), that skidding is the worse way to stop... I wouldn't overuse it, but anyone who is adept on a fixie knows that skidding can slow you faster than simple backpedaling (assuming you don't have bannana peel tires)
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Old 10-23-06, 11:05 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by mezza
DO YOU EVEN RIDE FIXED?? JEEZ!!

+1
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Old 10-23-06, 11:37 AM   #19
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when at speed, i find skidding to be good for slowing down w/o using much energy. backpedaling hard from a good head of steam is strenuous for me. the flip side is, i don't like skidding when going downhill--it feels a bit tenuous to me. if my bars were higher i probably wouldn't feel this way. the more delicate handling, in really heavy traffic (as opposed to when bombing down an avenue), going slow and doing more weaving, i have no preference for bars--i use flats, drops, and horns and like them all for this purpose. this is when i do a lot of weighting on the pedals in order to deftly regulate my speed.

when talking about the effectiveness of skidding, it's important to differentiate between hockey-stop skidding, and plain linear skidding. it's the difference between dragging an ice skate behind you, and, well, a hockey stop. even when putting hockey-style skidding aside, skidding may be the most effective way to stop if somebody is not strong enough to backpedal hard. it took me a while to get to the point where i can backpedal hard enough to stop quicker than my skids.

but anyway, why talk so much about this? slow down however you want to in order to be safe, in order to clear the obstacle, and then keep moving!
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Old 10-23-06, 12:19 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by operator
Skidding is the worse way to stop. Learn how to stop without locking your rear wheel if you want maximum braking out of the rear. Or put a rear brake on.
You're talking theoretically here. In reality the function of backpedaling kind of decreases with speed. If I'm going quick and spinning fast and I need to slow down I pretty much have to skip or skid just to be able to scrub off enough speed to start slowing with my legs. In emergency situations there often isn't enough time to slow down with back pedaling and a skid is more appropriate. I don't know if I've just got weaker legs than everyone here, but they're just not strong enough to slow me down faster than a skid a lot of the time. Prove me wrong.

If we are comparing bike braking to cars, lets ask this more apt (in my mind) question:

Is it quicker for cars to slow down by engine braking, or by locking up the rear wheels in a skid?

ABS should not come into the question unless we are discussing brakes.
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Old 09-09-08, 07:49 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teiaperigosa View Post
i usually sKiP if i need to control speed (either moderately or abruptly), and skid in a hockey stop manner (with back fishtailing out to one side) to abruptly stop if needed or control speed down steep hills...this is much mor effective than either skidding straight or skipping...and i never lean forward to skid

Ok this is exactly the technique I want to get down, I dont really care about long skidding. I think if you do want to ride brakeless this technique is a must. Can you actually fully sit down doing this or do you lift off the seat a little? I know it's all about practice, but a few tips can help.
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Old 09-09-08, 07:57 AM   #22
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Skipping tutorial

There is some good information in this thread for technique; alot of skipping is about being able to shift weight, pedal location and practice.
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Old 09-09-08, 08:42 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiznaz View Post
You're talking theoretically here. In reality the function of backpedaling kind of decreases with speed. If I'm going quick and spinning fast and I need to slow down I pretty much have to skip or skid just to be able to scrub off enough speed to start slowing with my legs. In emergency situations there often isn't enough time to slow down with back pedaling and a skid is more appropriate. I don't know if I've just got weaker legs than everyone here, but they're just not strong enough to slow me down faster than a skid a lot of the time. Prove me wrong.

If we are comparing bike braking to cars, lets ask this more apt (in my mind) question:

Is it quicker for cars to slow down by engine braking, or by locking up the rear wheels in a skid?

ABS should not come into the question unless we are discussing brakes.
perfect response. thank you
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Old 09-09-08, 08:54 AM   #24
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Skip video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewhWYqqIXb0
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Old 09-09-08, 02:41 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shiznaz View Post
You're talking theoretically here. In reality the function of backpedaling kind of decreases with speed. If I'm going quick and spinning fast and I need to slow down I pretty much have to skip or skid just to be able to scrub off enough speed to start slowing with my legs. In emergency situations there often isn't enough time to slow down with back pedaling and a skid is more appropriate. I don't know if I've just got weaker legs than everyone here, but they're just not strong enough to slow me down faster than a skid a lot of the time. Prove me wrong.

If we are comparing bike braking to cars, lets ask this more apt (in my mind) question:

Is it quicker for cars to slow down by engine braking, or by locking up the rear wheels in a skid?

ABS should not come into the question unless we are discussing brakes.
ABS has everything to do with it. A car stops faster with the brakes on the edge of lockup, once you loose traction you have no real control This is fact, not theory. Also, as you deaccelerate weight shifts onto your front tire, which makes skidding even less effective.
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