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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 01-16-07, 12:38 AM   #1
Gnarboots
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Greasers vs. Me (The Grease Thread)

I've been overhauling the s**t outta my fleet for the past week, and have met a curious conundrum. Everything I've packed with Park grease hasn't been nearly as smooth as everything I've packed with this old tube of Bullshot grease (bet you've never heard of it) I got from my Grandpa years ago. At first I thought it was coincidence, but I've since obsessively de-and-reconstructed a BB and headset, replacing the new Park with new Bullshot, after being dissatisfied with the original results, and lo - The Bullshot is King. WTF? The only rational explanation is that the Park is in a tub, and could've thus been contaminated somewhere along the way, but I don't think so as I'm pretty careful about that.

Anyone else have similar negative/positive experiences with greases? What's you're favorite?
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Old 01-16-07, 12:46 AM   #2
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tri-flow is my favorite, but i got a tip off the mechanics forum to use boat-trailer wheel bearing grease. it's waterproof, and not as thick as regular automotive wheel bearing grease. i got a giant tub for like $4 at West Marine. i put tri-flow in my high-end bearings, and this marine grease in everything else and all threads/seatposts/stems.
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Old 01-16-07, 01:27 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnarboots
I've been overhauling the s**t outta my fleet for the past week, and have met a curious conundrum. Everything I've packed with Park grease hasn't been nearly as smooth as everything I've packed with this old tube of Bullshot grease (bet you've never heard of it) I got from my Grandpa years ago. At first I thought it was coincidence, but I've since obsessively de-and-reconstructed a BB and headset, replacing the new Park with new Bullshot, after being dissatisfied with the original results, and lo - The Bullshot is King. WTF? The only rational explanation is that the Park is in a tub, and could've thus been contaminated somewhere along the way, but I don't think so as I'm pretty careful about that.

Anyone else have similar negative/positive experiences with greases? What's you're favorite?
smooth != good lubrication.

Just cause something spins nice and fast, doesn't mean it's going to lubricate properly. Try it with 40 wieght, it'll be smooth as hell for about half of one ride.
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Old 01-16-07, 01:31 AM   #4
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the big can o white lithium doesn't break down with heat age or water park i beleive is wax bassed and I had some bullshot once that waas petrol based
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Old 01-16-07, 08:33 AM   #5
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Phil. Accept no substitute.
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Old 01-16-07, 08:56 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by chip thunder
Phil. Accept no substitute.
Phil. It looks suspiciously like the park stuff.

I still use it tho.

Marine trailer bearing grease is probably as good as it gets, even comes in a variety of stylish colors.
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Old 01-16-07, 09:00 AM   #7
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Park is the grease you use for seatposts, stems, and bolts. Phil is what you use to repack cup-and-cone affairs, as it's waterproof and designed for bike applications.
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Old 01-16-07, 09:21 AM   #8
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All grease is waterproof. Phil just writes it on the tub(e).

More on grease:

There are generally two kinds of grease out there, stuff made from regular old oils and the "synthetics." Both are thickened with various stuff, including metal soaps and clay. Park and Phil use some clay, I'm sure they're not actually the same formula but it's the same concept. Clay is not necessarily bad, pretty much all the stuff from the auto parts/boat store has some clay in it and it gets abused under conditions and wear cycles that make bike applications look pretty meek; the only consideration with using auto greases is whether they're designed to function at a higher temp than what you will be using them at. Pedros and tri-flow are full synthetic, which is not necessarily better. I personally don't like them, they off-gas some nastyness, and my theory is that I want grease to be stable, not off-gassing a bunch of aromatics that were keeping it liquid in the container. The phil/park stuff does off-gas a little, anything with a hydrocarbon base will, but it's not nearly as bad. The synthetics also give me a headache if I use an open tub of the stuff, not a big deal in your driveway or if you're using the little gun but being over a can of it in the shop sucks. Also, hot tip: if you have the pedros grease gun, just cut off the end of an empty tube, refill from a tub, and pop a big mofonkin' binder clip on there.
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Old 01-16-07, 09:25 AM   #9
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I wish you could still get bullshot. I heard the bullseye guy refused to sell the recipe when the company went under.

For rotating assemblies try out rock'n roll web grease. It's what comes packed in enduro bearings. It's consistency is more like melted string cheese that coats bearing surfaces over and over as they spin. Normal greases sort of get pushed aside or stick to bearings by virtue of viscosity alone. Plus it's way more winter/dirt friendly than Phil's.

I'm not the biggest fan of Phil as I've had washout issues, but it's quite a bit better than parks green stuff.


[Edit] Langdolier, who wrote that? It's making the chemist in me cringe.
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Old 01-16-07, 09:52 AM   #10
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the absolute best grease i have come across (and chainlube for that matter) is made by dumonde tech. dumonde tech MR grease, bicycle chain lube, chain lube lite, and liquid grease are amazing products although a bit expensive. puts traditional greases and lubes to shame.

the quick story- dumonde tech started as a motorsports company, using their lubricants and oils they managed to set the world land speed record for a STOCK 600cc motorcycle. now they make the most durable, long lasting, and quietest chainlube ive ever found.

they use polymer based technology so the lubes/greases coat the metal and 'plasticize' at the molecular level leaving a coating over the parts. and because it was based on motorcycle lube it is completely O-ring safe (motorcycles have o-rings in the chain), so you can use it on suspension forks. only a few lubes/greases are o-ring safe, most other lubes use carriers which will dry out seals. i recently rebuilt a rockshox SID using MR grease and it feels much more buttery than the day i pulled it out of the box.

dumonde tech doesnt sell direct so you have to find a dealer of theirs to get it.
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Old 01-16-07, 10:16 AM   #11
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I wrote it. I actually have a pretty good chemistry background, the bad terminology is mostly just me trying to make it accessible. Replace "off-gas" with evaporate/sublimate as appropriate, we can talk about solubility and polarity instead of "waterproof," and "metallic soap" I think is a pretty accepted term for heavy metal fatty acid thingamajiggers I can't remember the actual technical name for. I know regular stuff and 'synthetics" are pretty much getting their basic ingredients out of the same crude oil barrels, it's more a question of fractions than anyone actually sythesizing anything. I'm also aware that my nose isn't the best measure of evaporation rate or even aromatics in general, but put a squirt of phil and a squirt of pedros on a piece of aluminum foil and leave it in the sun for a week and you'll get an idea of what I'm talking about with regard to stability. The phil will look like you put it there 5 minutes ago, the "synth" stuff will have separated a bit and evaporated off a lot of crap; think week-old cake frosting.

Guess it's a good thing I don't write chem textbooks for a living...
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Old 01-16-07, 10:56 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gnarboots
Everything I've packed with Park grease hasn't been nearly as smooth as everything I've packed with this old tube of Bullshot grease

Anyone else have similar negative/positive experiences with greases? What's you're favorite?
Not as smooth? I hope you're cleaning, changing the ball bearings.. and checking the cone races ...

As for grease. I use Park because it multipurpose and cheap.
I find with thinner greases (those boarding oils) tend to run out when it gets wet, esp. tri-flow or 3 in 1.
Phils seems to be pretty thick and sticky.

To tell you the truth, I pack my hub, pedal and headset bearings so full that there is grease drag.
I like it. It's not super spinny, but knowing that there is a ton of grease inside makes for peace of mind.
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Old 01-16-07, 11:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chip thunder
Phil. Accept no substitute.
Not even when it's sold as marine wheel bearing grease?

http://bikeforums.net/showpost.php?p...0&postcount=46
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Old 01-16-07, 01:13 PM   #14
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progold epx grease kicks phil's sorry green ass.
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Old 01-16-07, 01:22 PM   #15
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I use Phil's grease and it works, what else can I say, nothing I have used has compared.
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Old 01-16-07, 01:55 PM   #16
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Valvoline automotive wheel bearing grease. Picked it up somewhere cheap. No problems thus far.
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Old 01-16-07, 03:16 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Landgolier
All grease is waterproof. Phil just writes it on the tub(e).

More on grease:

There are generally two kinds of grease out there, stuff made from regular old oils and the "synthetics." Both are thickened with various stuff, including metal soaps and clay. Park and Phil use some clay, I'm sure they're not actually the same formula but it's the same concept. Clay is not necessarily bad, pretty much all the stuff from the auto parts/boat store has some clay in it and it gets abused under conditions and wear cycles that make bike applications look pretty meek; the only consideration with using auto greases is whether they're designed to function at a higher temp than what you will be using them at. Pedros and tri-flow are full synthetic, which is not necessarily better. I personally don't like them, they off-gas some nastyness, and my theory is that I want grease to be stable, not off-gassing a bunch of aromatics that were keeping it liquid in the container. The phil/park stuff does off-gas a little, anything with a hydrocarbon base will, but it's not nearly as bad. The synthetics also give me a headache if I use an open tub of the stuff, not a big deal in your driveway or if you're using the little gun but being over a can of it in the shop sucks. Also, hot tip: if you have the pedros grease gun, just cut off the end of an empty tube, refill from a tub, and pop a big mofonkin' binder clip on there.

I hate to corrrect you but all grease is water resistant if water gets in with a wax based grease it will eventually homogenize and run out of where the grease was packed

my experience as and rv / trailer mechanic has taught me that nothing beats lithium grease for water resistance and lifespan
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Old 01-16-07, 03:18 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klink
Valvoline automotive wheel bearing grease. Picked it up somewhere cheap. No problems thus far.
had some of that I used it on a set of u joints then left the reminants in my grease gun it took one summer for that grease to break down and turn into pink oil in the bottom of my tool box
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