roadfix

I thought Japanese law always required brakes.
I know it's an ancient law but did they ever fix the no tandem law?

onetwentyeight 

yes please. id like to be stationed in kyoto, i liked it there.

Aeroplane

Then just be open and honest with yourself, man. Being repressed isn't healthy, in the long term.

pitboss

Hokkaido or death. Unceremonial death, at that.

andre nickatina

Have you gotten a ticket for riding brakeless? I've passed numerous cops on numerous occassions in Portland and have yet to even get a double-take. As far as I knew, the only people that enforced the no-brakes thing were those two ******* cops downtown who plot at every attempt to make a bike messenger's life a ****hole?

popluhv

How do you even ticket a cyclist?
I used to go to a school that had a rule against riding bikes between the dorms and the classrooms. We used to ride by the security guards laughing, as they shook their ticket books in fury at us.

phoenix

I think [165] summed it up pretty well. There are so many folks riding the coat tails of the fixed gear culture right now that this is probably a good thing (brakeless fines). I'm not a brakeless hater by any means, but if you're new to fixed gear bikes for the love of god run a f-ing brake, at least for the safety of the surrounding general public.

no0b = +1 brake

Serendipper 

I have nothing of value to add here, save these pictures of the new clamp-on keirin brakes you can buy on e-framebank.

This leaves no excuse (drilling holes, etc.) for riding brakeless.

norskagent

how much is ¥50,000, like $7?

coelcanth

or $500

mander

Sadly brakeless laws are probably justified. Safety standards generally have to be idiot proof, especially when there is the possibility of the idiot harming others.

andre nickatina

are those babies njs stamped




jokes aside, i'm glad there's options out there where you don't have to drill the frame, though i don't really plan on adding brakes to my bike soon. you can talk about brakes vs. brakeless all day, but it all boils down to this: if you can't adequately stop your bike without brakes, than you should be riding brakes until you can learn to do it with split second reflexes and stopping as fast as someone with a coaster / back brake.

mattface 

clearly. some skilled people can stop as well without a brake as neophyte with a drum brake. I'd like to see someone prove that they can stop as fast without a brake as a skilled rider with a good front caliper.

The current laws that are on the books as to what constitutes a safe braking system are far to vague, but I would support clear laws that for instance require a vehicle be able to go from 10mph to a complete stop in 20 feet. If you can't do that you shouldn't be on the road, and many brakeless riders can't do that.

cassette

I've been ticketed for riding brakeless. Though it totally sucks, and yes it's a bit odd to have that freedom taken, it's still justified. I lived in the bay, and now in portland and I see kids who need brakes. Bombing hills and not knowing how to control their bike is pretty scary. I'd hate to see someone injured just because their street cred goes up. I wish they could give you a quick stop test when they pull you over to see if you're competent or not.

andre nickatina

yeah, sure, but a super fast stop with a front brake compromises safety if you fly over the bars and into traffic or the car in front of you.

ryand

learn to use a front brake.
end thread.

mattface 

Sadly in this country you can't be prosecuted for incompetence. everyone has the right to operate a vehicle incompetently. Before clamping down on cyclists, they should fix the eye test so that people who can barely see a door nob can't pass it without their glasses on. Also the last time I took a driving test was 20 years ago, I don't think it's unreasonable to require a driving test for re-certification every 10 years when you're talking about a certification that allows someone to pilot a 2 ton vehicle on public streets.

andre nickatina

dude, if you're in a complete emergency you're not going to be concentrating on getting the right tension on your front brake, you're going to be kneejerk squeezing the lever super fast in some climatic fight or flight type response. was there not a post on here about a guy that did exactly that in an emergency and went over the bars?

ryand

I've hit my front brake in emergencies and only went over the bars one time from it... the time I was being knocked into a fence.

Go ahead and skid into the back of that truck. Have fun with it.

edit: and I do ride brakeless sometimes. I just think that the "you'll go over the bars" arguement is lame as hell. So is the "you can't stop without brakes" arguement.

mattface 

I can stop a free-wheel bike one handed with a bike frame over my shoulder on a steep downhill grade. to do that requires a front brake, I don't have a single bike that can stop like that with the rear brake alone. It requires brake modulation and shifting your weight rearward, and until they invent ABS for bicycles everyone who uses hand brakes wether one or two should learn it.

ryand

Thanks for putting "learn to use a brake" into words that people can read and say "oh, that makes sense". For that, you get a gold star.

barba

It is a good skill to practice front brake emergency stops. If your weight is distributed right and you have your arms braced you won't go over the top.

mattface 

To put it i even simpler terms you can't go over the bars unless you lock the front wheel. As long as the front tire is still moving at the same speed as the bike, the back won't try to beat the front to the finish line. Soooooooo don't lock the front wheel.

Center of gravity also plays a part. if your CG is forward near the front axel it's way easy to go over. Using the front brake shifts the CG forward. counteract that by pushing backwards and moving your body weight rearward. SOphisticated motorcycle braking systems often employ anti-dive fork mechanisms to counteract this effect under heavy braking. On a bicycle you are by far the heaviest thing on the bike even if you only weigh 80 pounds, so you can greatly effect the CG with your own body position.

humancongereel

yeah, i got a few no brake tickets, along with a couple of other b.s. tickets for things that cars do in front of cops all the time with impunity (going just slightly over the stop line, for example. hell, i see cars in the middle of the intersection all the time. i went over just a tad as the light was about to turn and got a 242 dollar ticket).

basically, i hate portland cops.

mattface 

OH PS: Not knowing how to use a brake properly is the worst excuse I've ever heard for going brakeless.