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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 02-21-07, 09:15 PM   #1
taken67
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Piecemeal or Gruppo?

Preamble: This summer I will be building my first bike, as in building the actual frame tube, by lug, by tube. And assuming that it comes out as blissfully perfect as I'm imagining it, I want the components to be just as amazing.

Now the question came to me, should I buy each component individually, and take into consideration its relation to the other i.e. Black Sugino 75, Phil BB, Black Phil Hubs, Chrome CK Headset. OR should I buy a gruppo like a Dura Ace or C Record and let the minds at Shimano and Campagnolo do the thinking for me? Of course it's not just a matter of consistency or design, it's also one of price. A part a month is easier than dropping $700 all at once.

DISCLAIMERlease don't mistake this for an attempt to get any real "advice", I just thought it would be interesting to hear what other's would do, or have done in this situation.
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Old 02-21-07, 09:23 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taken67
Preamble: This summer I will be building my first bike, as in building the actual frame tube, by lug, by tube. And assuming that it comes out as blissfully perfect as I'm imagining it, I want the components to be just as amazing.

Now the question came to me, should I buy each component individually, and take into consideration its relation to the other i.e. Black Sugino 75, Phil BB, Black Phil Hubs, Chrome CK Headset. OR should I buy a gruppo like a Dura Ace or C Record and let the minds at Shimano and Campagnolo do the thinking for me? Of course it's not just a matter of consistency or design, it's also one of price. A part a month is easier than dropping $700 all at once.

DISCLAIMERlease don't mistake this for an attempt to get any real "advice", I just thought it would be interesting to hear what other's would do, or have done in this situation.
if you have discipline just save the money over time

it will be exactly like you are buying once piece at a time except will take less research time and you will actually save money
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Old 02-21-07, 09:30 PM   #3
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For me there's not much fun in dropping big $$$ for a package, although financially it can be cheaper than piece by piece. If I were to build something truly unique, I would take my time and pick each part out individually.
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Old 02-21-07, 09:46 PM   #4
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i tend to lean towards piece by piece, just so you can be picky with your componentry and get exactly what you want.
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Old 02-21-07, 10:01 PM   #5
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I like gruppos when possible.

*shrugs*
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Old 02-21-07, 10:04 PM   #6
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I am building up two frames, not building the frames but bikes of two frames.

I am presently collecting the components a piece at a time. I was recently considering gruppos but all are not really "street" oriented.

I would rather go to all my LBS's and see what I can get at different price points. I would be a pain in the a$$.

I have a nice custom hybrid lugged FG, and I want to put good stuff on it. I also am waiting on the SE IRO and want to build that up nicely too.

But I have to go according to my resources.
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Old 02-21-07, 11:28 PM   #7
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I hand pick every part and then buy em all at the sametime and get a big discount for dropping that much coin
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Old 02-22-07, 07:20 AM   #8
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gruppo = groupset + pretense
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Old 02-22-07, 07:37 AM   #9
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I would totally go gruppo if there were one that had all the stuff I would want, but every major track gruppo out there has at least one thing that rubs me the wrong way.

If Phil made headsets, and threw in a Sugion 75 crank, I would buy that gruppo with my fantasy cash.

If Miche made a normal track crank, (do they make a threadless headset?), I would like that.

If Campy and DA made cartridge bearing hubs/bbs, I would like that.

I don't see the point in buying a gruppo if it's not exactly what you want. That's like buying the Kellogg's Variety pack just for the Froot Loops.
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Old 02-22-07, 07:46 AM   #10
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the chinhour gruppo is really nice.
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Old 02-22-07, 07:49 AM   #11
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piece by piece
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Old 02-22-07, 08:37 AM   #12
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personally, i go where the deals are. i just built up a nice bike, mostly with used parts. used parts don'e bother me, because they're going to become used anyway, so i might as well spend less on them. i got a great deal on used miche cranks, a miche/mavic front wheel, cinelli bars/stem, rolls saddle, and used the rear wheel i've been using.

it rides beautifully and i get satisfaction knowing that i built a really amazing bike that didn't destroy my finances. i also get a lot of satisfaction from trading parts with (and buying parts from) other people in the local bike community.
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Old 02-22-07, 08:39 AM   #13
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You're hand picking the lugs and tubes I assume so why not hand pick the components? Do you want a classy looking italian track frame look or something more modern?

If I were you I'd go low spoke wheels (24 rear, 20 front, maybe radial) too. Track/SS rear hubs have no dish, which evenly distributes the load to the spokes, where as road rear hubs put almost all the weight on the drive side spokes. Basically that means your standard 32 hole road hub is really more like a 16-18 spoke low flange track hub, so low spoke is a good option for track and SS bikes.
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Old 02-22-07, 01:46 PM   #14
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Good replies, they pretty much echo the voices in my head. I probably won't make any decisions until the frame is built, but I think saving money now is a good idea either way. I'm almost leaning toward piece by piece, and I do know an LBS that would probably work with me if I had a big honkin' list of parts to order. You have to admit though, these look nice:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DuraAceTrack.jpg (18.5 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg record_pista_groupo.jpg (51.9 KB, 11 views)
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Old 02-22-07, 01:48 PM   #15
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Option 3: Build Kit
Saves money both by buying things in a prepackaged group and by not wasting money on parts where it won't effect performance.
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Old 02-22-07, 01:52 PM   #16
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I'm planning on building my first frame over the summer as well. I'm pretty happy with my Miche hubs and will probably just do a Miche group. Kind of budget, I know.

Maybe full Mavic... Ellipses with that whacky crank they used to make. Yeah!
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Old 02-22-07, 02:09 PM   #17
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Any good sources for build kits? In the cheaper range. Possible something excluding hubs. I know of iro already.
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Old 02-22-07, 02:11 PM   #18
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harris has some I think. I don't know if they're a good deal or not.
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Old 02-22-07, 02:37 PM   #19
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harris has some I think. I don't know if they're a good deal or not.

They are on the expensive side.
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Old 02-22-07, 03:56 PM   #20
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The important thing is not to mix nationalities.

Just kidding.

If money is no object, then the world is your oyster. I think the important question is whether you prefer loose ball or cartridge.

If cartridge, you can go big with Phil or Zipp hubs. Zipp may also make a track specific ISIS crankset and BB for about a bajillion dollhairs. Everyone knows that Phil BBs are the best. Except for me. I have no experience in the matter. Campy cranks are suhweet, except for the graphics.

If loose ball is what you're after, you can go whole hog with the group. DA all the way, including the track-specific headset. Suntour Superbe or olde campy record or c-record for major props, but be prepared to pay through the nose. beware the classic Italian obsession. It has killed before.

If you want to drive everyone nuts, try for an all French group. TA specialities, stronglight, mavic, maillard, ava, phillipe. Or all american or all british (yah, right)
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Old 02-22-07, 04:09 PM   #21
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I was thinking all American actually if I don't go with a group set. Phil hubs BB, CK HS, Paul Cranks, Crank Bros.
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Old 02-22-07, 04:23 PM   #22
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better get the paul hubbs 44mm chainline on the crankset
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Old 02-22-07, 04:41 PM   #23
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There's a guy here, Evan, who has an all-American bike. Sick build.
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Old 02-22-07, 04:43 PM   #24
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Could make it a WOP and do Miche or Campy drivetrain an hubs with chris king headset, thompson post, nitto quill stem (gotta do quill, CK makes threaded HS's right?), Salsa seatpost and brooks saddle.

But you have to get it off the back of a truck.

From a guy named Vinny.


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Old 02-22-07, 05:14 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Retem
better get the paul hubbs 44mm chainline on the crankset
Aren't Phil BBs adjustable?
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