Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-22-07, 01:36 AM   #1
oktokrewl
baby eater!
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: bushwick, brooklyn
Bikes: fuji track '06, fixed lowrider, fixed folding bike
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How to lace 28 hole rims to 36 hole hubs?

I can't find any info on it anywhere...

On the hub, would it be: 4 holes, empty hole, 3 holes, empty hole, 4 holes, empty hole, 3 holes, empty hole?

It's the only pattern I can think of that would be even remotely balanced/symmetrical..

And if so, what length spoke do you need for a 3x (all the same length or mixed lengths?) and how would you actually go about doing a 3x?

Anything you could tell me would save my life..
oktokrewl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 01:45 AM   #2
666pack
tarck bike.com exile
 
666pack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: lancaster, pennsylvania
Bikes: bfssfg iro--black.
Posts: 2,058
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oktokrewl View Post
Anything you could tell me would save my life..
don't do it. a rim with 36 holes is meant to be laced to a hub with 36 holes using 36 spokes.
i wouldn't recommend doing this. something just seems really off to me about it.

i wouldn't risk messing around with something like this on something as important as wheels.

but hey, who am i to tell you what to do? try it and see what happens... you'll either have a sick wheel or you'll be in the hospital.
666pack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 01:50 AM   #3
oktokrewl
baby eater!
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: bushwick, brooklyn
Bikes: fuji track '06, fixed lowrider, fixed folding bike
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
it's actually my guy thats doing it.. right now.. hehe..

and the reason is the only hubs the shop had were 36, and he has 28 hole tubulars.. we are on a week and a half break back home in LA, we just managed to get out of the caribbean during the whole hurricane business, but we didnt bring our wheels with us..

so basically, its lace 28 hole wheels to 36 hole hubs.. or dont ride at all.. and not riding at all is unacceptable..

btw.. Im lacing up neon green deep v's.. right now.. the neon green bike where every single part is green is slowly on its way to reality!!
oktokrewl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 03:55 AM   #4
filtersweep
Senior Member
 
filtersweep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 2,615
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
When you figure out how to calculate spoke length, please let me know...
filtersweep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 04:27 AM   #5
LóFarkas
LF for the accentdeprived
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Budapest, Hungary
Bikes:
Posts: 3,549
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Yeah, because there are no 28 hole hubs or 36 hole rims available in LA...
Clever solution.
LóFarkas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 07:03 AM   #6
deathhare
:jarckass:
 
deathhare's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Nashville
Bikes:
Posts: 6,562
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666pack View Post
don't do it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666pack View Post
i wouldn't recommend doing this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666pack View Post
i wouldn't risk messing around with something like this on something as important as wheels.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666pack View Post
try it and see what happens..
too many 666 packs today?
deathhare is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 07:15 AM   #7
Aeroplane
jack of one or two trades
 
Aeroplane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Suburbia, CT
Bikes: Old-ass gearie hardtail MTB, fix-converted Centurion LeMans commuter, SS hardtail monster MTB
Posts: 5,637
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by LóFarkas View Post
Yeah, because there are no 28 hole hubs or 36 hole rims available in LA...
Clever solution.
I think he said he's in the Caribbean right now, FWIW...

Is this a front, or front and rear? If it's just front, you can do it radially. Otherwise, you'll have to do a hack-job of some cross lacing. I'm not going to do the math for you, but here's how you figure out the spoke length:

Only think about one side of the hub and rim. You go in reference to what the normal radial spoke length would be on a rim that matched your hub. Then, figure out the angle of the spoke would be if it were displaced one one hole on this rim (i.e. a 1x lacing). Now, figure out whatever the angle of the spoke would be for whatever wacky-ass lacing system you come up with (you'll probably have multiple angles, since you won't have the same line-up for each spoke). Divide these angles by the theoretical 1x angle to get the "cross value" of the spokes. Then use spocalc.exe and put in your hubs and rims to get the effective rim diameter, hub flange diameter, flange distance from center, etc. When it asks for the lacing pattern, put in your "cross value(s)" and it should give you the proper length(s) to do whatever wacky-ass lacing pattern you came up with.
Aeroplane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 07:17 AM   #8
sven_svensenson
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 69
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
it can be done. you have to use a hybrid spoking pattern. 2x leading/trailing mixed with a crows foot pattern on the same side. ive done it the other way, 36hole rim to a 28hole hub, but just for fun. the wheel never got ridden. calculating accurate spoke lengths has a direct correlation to the grade you got in high school trig.

as for a rideable wheel, eh. your spoke tensions are going to be all over the place. id take a pic of my crazy wheel, but it doesnt photograph well.
sven_svensenson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 08:37 AM   #9
666pack
tarck bike.com exile
 
666pack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: lancaster, pennsylvania
Bikes: bfssfg iro--black.
Posts: 2,058
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by deathhare View Post
too many 666 packs today?
haha. i'm just saying I wouldn't ride on it.

but then again, i would also never shoot heroin into my veins; play russian roulette with a loaded gun; drive a bus with a bomb in it that explodes with the bus goes under fifty miles per hour; et cetera, et cetera, so on and so forth.

something just makes me think that having eight empty holes on the rim MIGHT make it a bit weaker.


but you've gotta make your own decisions in life.
666pack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 08:42 AM   #10
iamtim
Senior Member
 
iamtim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Bikes: 2012 Motobecane Vent Noir; 2016 Mercier Kilo TT Pro
Posts: 3,041
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 23 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666pack View Post
something just makes me think that having eight empty holes on the rim MIGHT make it a bit weaker.
I think you've got it backwards... the OP wants to use a 28 hole RIM on a 36 hole HUB. There'd be eight empty holes on the hub, not the rim.

That said, I agree with you. I wouldn't ride it either.
iamtim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 09:30 AM   #11
dmotoguy
Edificating
 
dmotoguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Portland
Bikes: Spooky + Sachs
Posts: 2,446
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
people run hubs with open holes all of the time.. it doesnt weaken anything, you just have less spokes.
dmotoguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 09:51 AM   #12
fix:
vernal stylostixis
 
fix:'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 300
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i think this is what you want
http://sheldonbrown.com/mismatch/index.htm
fix: is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 10:25 AM   #13
kemmer
*****es love tarck
 
kemmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Sandy, UT
Bikes: so many
Posts: 3,302
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by fix: View Post
i think this is what you want
http://sheldonbrown.com/mismatch/index.htm
Honestly, why you would ask a question here without searching sb.com is beyond me. The risk-of-getting-flamed to good-informaition ratio here is just too high.
__________________
kemmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 12:39 PM   #14
oktokrewl
baby eater!
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: bushwick, brooklyn
Bikes: fuji track '06, fixed lowrider, fixed folding bike
Posts: 408
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
1. i went to several shops (i am currently in LA, but only for about 10 days..) and everyone had 28 hole front hubs.. but noone had 28 hole back hubs (well, none that are under $300)

2. i saw that article on sheldon brown, but was wondering if there was any other info besides that.. that lacing patten is quite pretty, but this is the first wheelset we've built, and that is an advanced techinique..

3. the shop we got hubs from said that we could do it with a 3 cross pattern, but it was late and busy in there, so i guess some stuff just slipped his mind, cuz it is SO not possible to do that, especially with only one spoke length.. we tried several times, but it just doesnt work


4. we are going to another shop today to look for either 1 36 hole rim, and 1 28 hole hub, so it will be 28front/36back.. or a set of 36 hole rims..


thanks for the help tho.. and the funny yelling at me
oktokrewl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 12:47 PM   #15
Aeroplane
jack of one or two trades
 
Aeroplane's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Suburbia, CT
Bikes: Old-ass gearie hardtail MTB, fix-converted Centurion LeMans commuter, SS hardtail monster MTB
Posts: 5,637
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oktokrewl View Post
the shop we got hubs from said that we could do it with a 3 cross pattern, but it was late and busy in there, so i guess some stuff just slipped his mind, cuz it is SO not possible to do that, especially with only one spoke length..
This is the key. You'll have multiple spoke lengths for each side of the hub. Not pretty, but it's possible.
Aeroplane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 01:29 PM   #16
moe sizlack
nothing but a gnab gib
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Rock City
Bikes: The Heart of Gold starship bicycle
Posts: 222
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
That wheel on Sheldon's site looks ****ing badass.
moe sizlack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 02:41 PM   #17
kemmer
*****es love tarck
 
kemmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Sandy, UT
Bikes: so many
Posts: 3,302
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oktokrewl View Post
4. we are going to another shop today to look for either 1 36 hole rim, and 1 28 hole hub, so it will be 28front/36back.. or a set of 36 hole rims..
If you have that option I'd definatly do it.
__________________
kemmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 02:48 PM   #18
filtersweep
Senior Member
 
filtersweep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 2,615
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I guess Sheldon explains it succinctly as follows:

Quote:
θ = 4θh
φ = 2θr
T = 4θh + 2θr

Where for a 28 hole rim,
θr = 360/28 = 12.857 degrees

and for a 36 hole hub,
θh = 360/36 = 10 degrees

For the magenta spokes, the analysis is similar, and we get

θ = 3θh
φ = θr
T = 3θh + θr

The diagram for the blue spokes is not shown, but after a similar derivation we get

θ = θh
φ = 3θr
T = θh + 3θr
filtersweep is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-07, 05:47 PM   #19
lamalex
Invented the Skid Salute
 
lamalex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Philly
Bikes: EAI Bareknuckle, Schwinn Tandem, Specialized Metal Matrix Comp, Peugeot UO8
Posts: 370
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oktokrewl View Post
btw.. Im lacing up neon green deep v's.. right now.. the neon green bike where every single part is green is slowly on its way to reality!!
Make sure you post before it's finished so I can kill myself.
lamalex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-09, 11:02 AM   #20
d49truck
ride on brother
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: san clemente
Bikes: elgin twin bar garylittle john mongoose 36 autocycle
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
36 hole hub 28 hole rim

hi can you send me a pick of a lace job or a rought hole spacing to make it work this is for my boys 16" pit bike for his b day witch is on the 30th of june so i need to make this happen thanks for your reply daprice d49truck@cox.net
d49truck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-09, 05:32 PM   #21
operator
cab horn
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Toronto
Bikes: 1987 Bianchi Campione
Posts: 28,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by kemmer View Post
Honestly, why you would ask a question here without searching sb.com is beyond me. The risk-of-getting-flamed to good-informaition ratio here is just too high.
You must be new here
operator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-09, 05:39 PM   #22
Cynikal
Team Beer
 
Cynikal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Sacramento CA
Bikes: Too Many
Posts: 5,921
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
I think he was new here in 2007.
Cynikal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-27-09, 06:18 PM   #23
operator
cab horn
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Toronto
Bikes: 1987 Bianchi Campione
Posts: 28,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cynikal View Post
I think he was new here in 2007.
/woosh
operator is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:35 AM.