Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 46
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Boston, MA
    My Bikes
    IRO Angus, Specialized Langster
    Posts
    50
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Original Plan for my Drivetrain....worth it?

    So i had been planning to purchase an EAI superstar cog, Specialties TA chainring, and a supertoughness chain for my new build....this comes out to roughly $175

    but after doing some reading about 1/8 vs 3/32 and kind of weighing my options i was thinking i can just do

    sugino 130j chainring, EAI cog, KMC chainring for about $60.

    Is there going to be a noticeable difference in performance between these two drivetrain options? should i just opt for the cheaper, or should it NOT cheap out on my build at the last minute?

    whadda you guys think?

  2. #2
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    OR
    Posts
    4,447
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    No need for an EAI Superstar if you're not racing on the drome. EAI's regular cogs are super nice as it is. Also, no real need for that spendy chain when KMC Kool chains run great with a little lube added. As far as the chainring, nicer chainrings are usually more round/true than lower quality ones, and this does make a difference in performance (not that noticeable assuming chainline is straight and everything else is in order but it's there) and safety (more leeway in chain looseness before you'll throw it).

    Main things that matter on the street are that your drivetrain allows you to run a perfect or near perfect chainline, and that you maintain your chain through cleaning/lubing to ensure longevity in the drivetrain and also gain performance efficiency.

  3. #3
    Beausage is Beautiful Fugazi Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    My Bikes
    2006 Langster, which I actually like.
    Posts
    5,456
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    If you really want a higher-zoot cog for street riding, I recommend a Phil Wood instead of the EAI Superstar. You really don't need the latter unless you're doing some elite-level racing at the 'drome. On the other hand, the Phil wood is beautifully machined and finished, and mine has performed beautifully in ****ty conditions for over a year now with almost no discernible signs of wear.

  4. #4
    never eaten better listen jodypolk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    763
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    yeah, any "good" cog (EAI/DuraAce/Phil) will last a loooong time, no need to go crazy.
    Last edited by jodypolk; 01-28-08 at 11:44 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by hotbike View Post
    I did hit a few cars with this bike, but the fairing never broke. It's stronger than a helmet.(They made incursions into the bike lane. I could've used my brakes, but hey, what are bumpers for?)

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Boston, MA
    My Bikes
    IRO Angus, Specialized Langster
    Posts
    50
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I did a search on the forums and just found a lot of stuff that is confusing me in terms of the chainline....what am i looking for? How can i tell if my chainline is perfect or not? Is there a way to measure this?

  6. #6
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    OR
    Posts
    4,447
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Sheldon Brown's site has a good article on it.

  7. #7
    raodmaster shaman
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    G-ville
    Posts
    1,431
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by CHEN View Post
    I did a search on the forums and just found a lot of stuff that is confusing me in terms of the chainline....what am i looking for? How can i tell if my chainline is perfect or not? Is there a way to measure this?
    you don't even need to have it exactly perfect. +/- 2mm is acceptable and will have negligible difference in performance.

    but if you are in the process of getting new parts (as opposed to making some mish-mash of old parts work) its not tough to dial it in.

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Boston, MA
    My Bikes
    IRO Angus, Specialized Langster
    Posts
    50
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    so you guys mentioned that i don't really need what i was originally planning to get unless i was planning on doing some crazy velo racing....but now i'm curious as to why it would be good for racing? Is it just minor improvements that wouldn't matter on a daily basis? Durability? or does it effect efficiency?

  9. #9
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    OR
    Posts
    4,447
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Think about it like this. A track bike is the most minimalistic bike you can ride, right? Well, when you're that stripped down to the essentials, everything is going to make a little difference that could buy you a little time in a race.

    Also, actually racing your bike generally merits higher quality componentry anyway. The trick is figuring out which high quality components benefit someone who just appreciates quality vs. someone who is racing.

  10. #10
    Senior Member mihlbach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    6,327
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by CHEN View Post
    so you guys mentioned that i don't really need what i was originally planning to get unless i was planning on doing some crazy velo racing....but now i'm curious as to why it would be good for racing? Is it just minor improvements that wouldn't matter on a daily basis? Durability? or does it effect efficiency?
    Superstar cogs and NJS chains are a waste of money, even for someone who is racing. The only speed you'll gain from these will be due to your lighter wallet.

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    four 1 OHHH , Maryland
    My Bikes
    nagasawa, fuji track pro
    Posts
    2,587
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by mihlbach View Post
    NJS chains are a waste of money, even for someone who is racing. The only speed you'll gain from these will be due to your lighter wallet.
    thats why you don't pay what bens is asking for them. my njs chain costs as little as the non njs chains.

  12. #12
    aka mattio queerpunk's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    5,389
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by CHEN View Post
    I did a search on the forums and just found a lot of stuff that is confusing me in terms of the chainline....what am i looking for? How can i tell if my chainline is perfect or not? Is there a way to measure this?
    Most trackhubs place the cog in a plane located parallel to the centerline of the bike, 42.5 millimeters away. there is some slight variation - Sheldon Brown has a database of measurements. Add the center-to-shoulder measurement of the hub in question to the chainline-from-shoulder measurement of the cog in question. Or, you can take the reasonable shorthand of assuming it's 42.5mm.

    You want your chainring to also be 42.5mm away from the centerline of the bike. That will mean your chain runs straight.

    So, use a ruler to measure how far your chainring is from the center of your seattube. See? it's easy. If it's more than a few millimeters off, you might want to look into corrective measures - getting a bb with a longer or shorter spindle.

    To deal with this chainline issue, track cranksets have a "matching bb" that place them at the right spot for a good chainline.
    the hipster myth.

    i practice vagabondery.

  13. #13
    Lamb of God
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    447
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by CHEN View Post
    I did a search on the forums and just found a lot of stuff that is confusing me in terms of the chainline....what am i looking for? How can i tell if my chainline is perfect or not? Is there a way to measure this?
    Just eyeball it. Don't obsess over a "perfect" chain-line, you'll go nuts.

  14. #14
    Beausage is Beautiful Fugazi Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    My Bikes
    2006 Langster, which I actually like.
    Posts
    5,456
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Whether or not higher-end track racing chains are worth the money to you is a matter of personal preference, but they are better made and will perform accordingly.

  15. #15
    Senior Member mihlbach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    6,327
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by jdms mvp View Post
    thats why you don't pay what bens is asking for them. my njs chain costs as little as the non njs chains.
    I get KMC 510HX chains for $11..thats KMCs most durable 1/8" chain. Show me an NJS chain that will get me more miles per dollar than that.

  16. #16
    Senior Member mihlbach's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Long Island, NY
    Posts
    6,327
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fugazi Dave View Post
    Whether or not higher-end track racing chains are worth the money to you is a matter of personal preference, but they are better made and will perform accordingly.
    You might be right (although my experience with NJS chains tells me otherwise), but the performance improvement (if any) is not proportional to cost. NJS parts are expensive because Keirin is a gambling sport and everyone involved wants a piece of the pie. Anyone buying NJS parts should realize that while the parts are good quality, there are equally good and even better non-NJS parts available for a fraction of the cost.
    Last edited by mihlbach; 01-29-08 at 07:59 AM.

  17. #17
    Perineal Pressurized dobber's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    In Ebritated
    Posts
    6,556
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Fugazi Dave View Post
    Whether or not higher-end track racing chains are worth the money to you is a matter of personal preference, but they are better made and will perform accordingly.
    Yes, to some extent you're paying for quality. And brand name. The OP needs to really decided what his needs are. For me, on my fixed Cross-Check, I'd rather buy $6 Z-Chains, run them for a 750-1000 miles and then toss them.

    On the GTB, maybe I pay a little more, but since I only put maybe a 1000 miles a year on it, it doesn't merit a $50 chain. The Fixed 1x1 and SingleSpeed get the Cross-Check castoffs.
    This is Africa, 1943. War spits out its violence overhead and the sandy graveyard swallows it up. Her name is King Nine, B-25, medium bomber, Twelfth Air Force. On a hot, still morning she took off from Tunisia to bomb the southern tip of Italy. An errant piece of flak tore a hole in a wing tank and, like a wounded bird, this is where she landed, not to return on this day, or any other day.

  18. #18
    Beausage is Beautiful Fugazi Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Chicago, IL
    My Bikes
    2006 Langster, which I actually like.
    Posts
    5,456
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    It just comes down to whether the increased quality is worth the increased price to the individual. To me it is, to OP it may or may not be.

  19. #19
    out of shape
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    va
    Posts
    1,456
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    i've not been happy with the lower-end kmc chains like the 410 and 510. the izumi eco is much quieter and less sloppy. if you're running a smallish chainring, or a higher ratio, dura-ace cogs are fine. they're only available up to 16t, which is why so many people use eai or otherwise. most track cranks come with a 48 or 49 ring, and you need a 16 to 18 cog to make that a streetable ratio for most people.

  20. #20
    thomas masini lives
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    i aint dh no mo'
    Posts
    3,496
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    lol

    this thread needs dutret

    the real question is whether being the kind of person who runs pro stuff on the street is worth the money to you

    try inflating your tires if you want increased efficiency
    not a 2ksuck'r

  21. #21
    Senior Member frymaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    where the mild things roam
    Posts
    1,092
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by ralphm2k View Post
    Just eyeball it. Don't obsess over a "perfect" chain-line, you'll go nuts.
    well, if you're buying brand new parts for a ground-up build, you should be able to get a perfect chainline without going nuts. provided you get the right components for a 42 and tighten everything well it should, theoretically, just pop in.

    as an aside, i have a pair of digital calilpers that are the ideal tool for measuring chainline. if you plan on doing a lot of builds or (especially) conversions, this is a good thing to have in your tool bucket.

  22. #22
    :jarckass: deathhare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Nashville
    Posts
    6,563
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by mihlbach View Post
    NJS parts are expensive because Keirin is a gambling sport and everyone involved wants a piece of the pie.
    That's totally wrong.
    Theyre expensive in the USA because of the huge markup by the retailers in the states. In Japan, If you want good parts, buying NJS parts is about the cheapest way you can go in building your bike. I built my bike out of almost all NJS parts because it would save me money. Of course, i liked and trusted the parts too.
    Last edited by deathhare; 01-29-08 at 09:57 AM.

  23. #23
    aka mattio queerpunk's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    5,389
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    also, the dollar is weak.
    the hipster myth.

    i practice vagabondery.

  24. #24
    :jarckass: deathhare's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Nashville
    Posts
    6,563
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    That a new thing. The dollar wasnt weak a few years ago against the and they still marked the parts up drastically.
    This just means that new NJS parts will just get more expensive as the US government continues to destroy our country.

  25. #25
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    OR
    Posts
    4,447
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by ralphm2k View Post
    Just eyeball it. Don't obsess over a "perfect" chain-line, you'll go nuts.
    -1000

    this kind of attitude at an LBS leads to newbies dropping chains while bombing hills. bad times.

    get calipers and do it right.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •