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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 03-09-08, 01:43 PM   #1
Zum1
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"against the wind"

Any of you that have ridden in the ill-adel the past couple of days have probably encountered the joys of the 50mph winds in yo face... as with any headwind of relative strength, rider's gotta stand up and mash with a smile or else the wind, wins and we cant have that. I experienced this more than I care to recall when i was nestled in chi-town as well, (obviously). Similarly the rider must respond in kind on all of the various hills and climbs we may encounter. So... i contemplated then, and considered again recently, the parallels of the two situations. Might any of you thinking men know of an equation that assimilates the MPH's of the wind gusts with the grade of inclination on a climb? also... feel free to respond with any wind stories/issues/discoveries/solutions you may have?

"you dont need a weather man to know which way the wind blows"
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Old 03-09-08, 01:46 PM   #2
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I've almost been blown over by wind.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:18 PM   #3
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Aero bars look dorky on my bike, but I've put them on when wind got bad.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:25 PM   #4
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If there is an equation its going to have to factor in how wide you are, what your wearing, etc. It would be cool to know though. I'm going to throw out a guess and say that every mile an hour of headwind equals 1 percent more effort.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:33 PM   #5
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If there is an equation its going to have to factor in how wide you are, what your wearing, etc. It would be cool to know though. I'm going to throw out a guess and say that every mile an hour of headwind equals 1 percent more effort.
Yeah the problem with the ops question is how variable your aerodymanic profile can be. A good time trialer in a teardrop helmet with nice aero wheels is going to be much different from a typical bfssfg member in street clothes and back at 45+ degrees to the ground. It would be cool to see a ballpark figure though so I'll watch this space.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:34 PM   #6
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I went for a bike ride last night at around 4am in center city...the wind almost brought me to a dead stop a few times.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:40 PM   #7
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Aero bars look dorky on my bike, but I've put them on when wind got bad.
Wtf? Aerobars make a bike more difficult to control, not less.
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Old 03-09-08, 02:46 PM   #8
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If there is an equation its going to have to factor in how wide you are, what your wearing, etc. It would be cool to know though. I'm going to throw out a guess and say that every mile an hour of headwind equals 1 percent more effort.
1% would be an unrealistically low estimate.

http://www.exploratorium.edu/cycling/aerodynamics1.html

Yes, it's not a comprehensive calculator. But its good enough to make a point.
15mph cycling into a 0mph headwind = 94w
15mph cycling into a 1mph headiwnd = 108w
15mph cycling into a 2mph headiwnd = 125w
15mph cycling into a 3mph headiwnd = 142w

Looks non-linear to me.
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Old 03-09-08, 03:02 PM   #9
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In philly the wind has just been terribly annoying

edit: it also always seem to be blowing at you for some reason too.
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Old 03-09-08, 04:50 PM   #10
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Wind with regard to power that needs to be used is a curve.

This is why racing aircraft like the mustang which cruises easily at 270kts add huge engines to their aircraft AND clip the wings/sink rivets/smooth the canopy etc etc etc.

This is also why propeller aircraft are essentially limited to 450mph.

Obviously no one is going that fast on a bike here except for me haha. But its easier to exhibit looking at the top end of the graph.
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Old 03-09-08, 05:18 PM   #11
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In heavy wind, I get down as low and narrow as I can to present less area to the wind.
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Old 03-09-08, 05:39 PM   #12
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+1
I've been thinking of putting drops back on-the wind here is a little much at times.
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Old 03-09-08, 05:43 PM   #13
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I've been brought to a dead stop before from wind. It was eerie too, cause the streets were wet and I could literally see the gust coming at me.
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Old 03-09-08, 05:59 PM   #14
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I hate wind so much.
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Old 03-09-08, 06:01 PM   #15
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I hate wind about half the time.
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Old 03-09-08, 06:31 PM   #16
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60% of the time, I hate Bob Seger all the time.
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Old 03-09-08, 06:43 PM   #17
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i received an offer to borrow a HED wheelset - HED3 front, disc rear - for the races at VeloCity today. Why oh why was it so windy?! i had to turn down the offer!
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Old 03-09-08, 06:43 PM   #18
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Rolling through Wyoming and Kansas the wind almost blew me into the ground and at times I could only stop and walk. Times like those I would try and be as aero as possible, so ditch the baggy clothes, use the drops, zip everything up and it makes a big difference.
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Old 03-09-08, 08:06 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hazylines View Post
In philly the wind has just been terribly annoying

edit: it also always seem to be blowing at you for some reason too.
I live in filthidelphia and the wind there is no joke downtown is just a series of wind tunnels
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Old 03-09-08, 08:17 PM   #20
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60% of the time, I hate Bob Seger all the time.
Damn. I wanted to make the Seger joke.

Is he still alive?
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Old 03-09-08, 08:18 PM   #21
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We've established that the graph of the power required to overcome a 1mph increase in wind speed is non-linear.

I would assume that the graph of the power required to overcome an x deg. difference in gradient is also non-linear. Or it may be linear up to a certain point, but at 91 deg (just past vertical), the power required (provided you can stick to the road) will be less than at 90 deg, so the graph will begin to drop.

The problem here is that for a body facing wind resistance, more resistance can always be countered by more power (the graph will keep going up to infinity) provided that the body can endure the forces applied.

So, in general, the graphs cannot be the same so there cannot be an equation that shows a useful relationship between the two for any variables x, y (x,y : neg. Infin.< x,y < Infin. ).

What we would need to do it focus in on a small part of each graph. Say 0 to 45 deg of inclination and 0 to 75mph air velocity (bike velocity + wind velocity in an opposing direction). Then we have to add mass and frontal surface area to both equations. Starts to feel awfully sticky to me. Maybe this is a case where anecdotal evidence is the most useful. i.e. ask an old cyclist.
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