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back pedaling

Old 05-11-08, 02:24 PM
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back pedaling

Hey, I started riding fixed about a month ago and love it. I ride with a front brake and pretty much only use it in an "oh ****" situation and other times I backpedal. I started to get some tendinitis or something in my ankles from not being used to backpedaling. I also just got new toe clips which are longer than the ones I had because now i can put pressure on the arch of my foot rather than the balls of my feet which I think will help. I was wondering where is the proper placement of the pedals should be when resisting them. Like starting to resist when they are both level or when one it as the very bottom or what. Thanks
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Old 05-11-08, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by xxxxxxxxxx
Hey, I started riding fixed about a month ago and love it. I ride with a front brake and pretty much only use it in an "oh ****" situation and other times I backpedal. I started to get some tendinitis or something in my ankles from not being used to backpedaling. I also just got new toe clips which are longer than the ones I had because now i can put pressure on the arch of my foot rather than the balls of my feet which I think will help. I was wondering where is the proper placement of the pedals should be when resisting them. Like starting to resist when they are both level or when one it as the very bottom or what. Thanks
As always, sheldon can explain better than the rest of us

https://sheldonbrown.com/fixed.html#skip

Originally Posted by Sheldon Brown
Brakeless riders generally need to master a technique called the "skip stop." This is a way that you can actually lock up the rear wheel using your legs alone.

* If you lock one leg at the bottom of the pedal stroke, as the pedal rises it will start to lift your body upward.

* When the cranks get horizontal, pull up on the front pedal, while pushing down on the rear one.

* Because your body will have acquired upward momentum, when you yank up with the front foot this will temporarily partially unweight the rear wheel, making it possible to initiate a skid.

Since sliding friction is less than sticking friction, once the tire starts to skid, you will generally be able to maintain the skid until you've stopped or at least slowed down as much as you want to.

You have to really want to do it, you can't be tentative! It's easier when you're going faster.

The lower your gear , the more effectively you can "brake" by resisting with your legs.

Despite what some folks will tell you, you can not stop nearly as short this way as you can by using a good front brake.

See my article on Braking and Turning for a detailed explanation of this.
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Originally Posted by cc700
i jam my thumbs up and back into the tubes. this way i can point my fingers straight out in front to split the wind and attain an even more aero profile, and the usual fixed gear - zen - connectedness feeling through the drivetrain is multiplied ten fold because my thumbs become one with the tubing.
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Old 05-11-08, 02:56 PM
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Must be harder than i thought if it involves such complicated subjects as math and star trek.
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Old 05-11-08, 03:32 PM
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just go find an empty parking lot somewhere and practice
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Old 05-11-08, 07:38 PM
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I prefer the freewheel(I dont see the difference) except in some jurisdiction fixies are a nuisance.
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Old 05-11-08, 08:02 PM
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find a gravel path or do it in the rain
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Old 05-12-08, 01:29 AM
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Originally Posted by eXCeSS
find a gravel path or do it in the rain
+1 great idea
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Originally Posted by cc700
i jam my thumbs up and back into the tubes. this way i can point my fingers straight out in front to split the wind and attain an even more aero profile, and the usual fixed gear - zen - connectedness feeling through the drivetrain is multiplied ten fold because my thumbs become one with the tubing.
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Old 05-12-08, 09:46 AM
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Thanks but I wasn't really asking how to do it, I can skid and all that. I was just wondering if there is a position to do it in that is a little easier on the ankles. But i guess i should just keep doing it so I get used to it. Thanks
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Old 05-12-08, 09:57 AM
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how do gear ratios effect the ability to skid?
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Old 05-12-08, 10:07 AM
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different number of skid spots on the back tire with different ratios
you do it like a fraction sprocket/cog and reduce them and then the lower # denominator is how many skid spots you get.
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Old 05-12-08, 10:16 AM
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I use both of my feet to resist rotation of the rear wheel. For example, when I press down with my rear foot I pull up with my opposite foot/front foot. This helps disperse the strain over both legs/ankles/feet and provides much more power.
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Old 05-12-08, 02:46 PM
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Gear ratio also affects your ability to skid because the lower your gear ratio, the more your power is amplified to the wheel. In other words, at a lower gear ratio you don't have to push as hard to make the wheel stop turning. Its the exact same reason why a lower gear will allow you to accelerate faster but have a slower top speed.
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Old 05-12-08, 02:53 PM
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I think pedal position is all upto comfort - like with trackstanding, I'm often more comfortable in like a 2/8 or 1/7 o'clock position, depending on situation and road surface/room I have to jiggle. When I do a balls-to-stem skid I favour my right foot forward, and that's usually a set position, when skip stopping I just haul on both feet to achieve the desired effect - other than the very 0/6 top/bottom position, there's no real thought I put into positioning when doing it. Use your brake and save your knees (you can use backpedalling and your brake, too!)
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Old 05-12-08, 05:46 PM
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Back to the topic on back pedalling and your ankles hurting...
Your shorter clips should be better. I don't see how pedalling using your arch is going to help.
I suspect that your saddle height might not be working for you.
My ankles are actually better now after riding fixed
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Old 05-12-08, 11:00 PM
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well, i thought using the arch more would help disperse the tension on my ankles. Also I have a size 12 shoe and I was riding small clips before that came with the bike when I got it so i need to upgrade to bigger ones. I think the bottom line is I just gotta get used to it. Thanks for all your suggestions, you guys are real helpful on here.
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Old 05-13-08, 01:58 AM
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whoa, yea. size 12s with smalls might be the problem, get some L/XLs.
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Old 05-13-08, 02:49 AM
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riding on your arches isn't good at all. balls are where you want to be, ask any shop person that knows what they're talking about. i used to ride that way and i'm glad that habit got broke. i feel more control too.
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Old 05-13-08, 09:11 AM
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yea, well I got some LL's now and its not so much totally on my arches its more just not on my tip toes. The back of the pedal rests just on my arch.
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Old 05-13-08, 09:50 AM
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the balls of your feet should be over the pedal "spindle" or wherever the pedal pivots
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Old 05-13-08, 01:33 PM
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One month of riding? Now is the time to study bike fit. Save yourself some pain. There's another article, I believe. Perhaps by some coaching site? Anyone remember it?

Edit: Also are you using really flexible shoes? That'll cause some foot pain too.
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Old 05-19-08, 02:54 PM
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I was riding with some running shoes but i got new ones now. Thanks for the sizing advice.
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