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  1. #1
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    Sugino 75 vs. Truvativ Omnium

    Alright everyone, since I could not convince myself otherwise (I did not try very hard) I decided that I should upgrade the crankset from the stock Sugino RDs on my Steamroller to something more aggressive and track-worthy. I ride on the track some, but most of my riding is on the street, up and down hills, skip stopping etc., and some trails (some commuting, but much more just street riding; oh, and I keep my bike stored inside -- yes, my office mates think I'm crazy -- so there is no worry here about theft or weather wear). I have narrowed the field to two cranksets:

    1. Sugino 75s

    2. Truvativ Omniums

    Sugino 75s are more expensive than the Omniums, and they look better -- a more classic, less burly look (for any of you that care about that). But if I am to shell out the extra cash for the Suginos, I need a reason more than looks. I would like to know if any of you think that there is any substantial difference in the performance of these two cranksets? Or if the Omnium set is just as good performance-wise as the Suginos. (P.S. If you don't know, the Omnium cranks have an external bearing system. I like this innovation. But the admiration is rather superficial. Have any of you had bad experiences with this kind of bearing system on a fixie?)

  2. #2
    roll'em high shants's Avatar
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    I own bikes with both. Because of the external bottom bracket, I will say that the Omnium system is indeed stiffer than the Sugino 75, but I have not noticed any tangible performance difference.

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    Quote Originally Posted by shants View Post
    I own bikes with both. Because of the external bottom bracket, I will say that the Omnium system is indeed stiffer than the Sugino 75, but I have not noticed any tangible performance difference.
    That's what I suspected. But what kind of cogs do you use with the Omnium cranks? I've heard -- but I can't find my source right now -- that the chaline for the Truvativ cranks is 41.5 mm. I currently use Surly rear cogs and these are speced to work with 42.5-43.5 mm chainlines. Have you had any trouble finding rear cogs to work with Truvativ?

  4. #4
    jpdesjar
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    are you having issues with the stock cranks? i am just curious because i am still riding mine on the steamroller, they seem to be sturdy enough for the riding that i do. i think when i upgrade i may look into the 75s...they just look really well made and i here they are very stiff as well

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    No issues from the third-person perspective. It is more of a subjective issue: knowing that the chainline is 45mm bugs me like a phantom itch.

  6. #6
    roll'em high shants's Avatar
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    Sinn, I haven't taken a ruler to my drive train, but it has been more or less silent with the chain well-lubed using the cog on the Level hub that I have.

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    Senior Member mugatu's Avatar
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    I have omniums and alternate between a rear wheel with a dura ace hub / eai cog and a rear wheel with level hub and level cog. Both are silent.

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    So it seems that we have two for Omnium. Any considerations in favor of the Suginos. Here are some prices:

    The Sugino 75 crank/bottom bracket/chainring for $297
    The Omnium crank/bottom bracket/chainring for $270

    Should I save the $30 for a new chain or get the Suginos?

  9. #9
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    I'm buying the Omniums today... I just can't decide 165, 167.5 or 170, but I think they are superior in stiffness and completely equal in looks (for me). They are newer and seen less often than the 75's, and I like that sort of thing. Plus the bottom bracket/weight, go Omnium if you're basing it off of Bike Forums opinion.

    The chainline issue worries me, too. I'll deal with that when they get here. THere's always a solution when the last upgrade is a new chain and new rear wheel (my circumstance).

  10. #10
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    the salesman on the phone said they strike some of the "fatter" chainstays. that'd be a nightmare. Any ideas?

  11. #11
    Senior Member mugatu's Avatar
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    what frame are you putting them on?

  12. #12
    na975
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    the njs stamp makes all the difference, sugino 75's for sure.

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    I think that I found a few difference that may set the Suginos ahead a step. They are lighter than the Omniums (only by about 200 grams). The stiffness is something to consider. But I think that I am leaning more towards the Suginos, the more I think about it.

  14. #14
    dmg
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    If you're not married to the sugino 75 BB, you could shave at least $80 off your costs by getting a campy BB (or any other square taper JIS one if you want to live on the edge) instead. But honestly, the BB shell on your Steamroller is going to be flexing long before the crankarms will.

  15. #15
    roll'em high shants's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinn View Post
    I think that I found a few difference that may set the Suginos ahead a step. They are lighter than the Omniums (only by about 200 grams). The stiffness is something to consider. But I think that I am leaning more towards the Suginos, the more I think about it.
    Be careful about comparing weight, because the Omnium crankset includes the bottom bracket spindle since it is integrated. A more reasonable comparison is sugino 75 + bb of choice compared to Omnium + cups weight.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by shants View Post
    Be careful about comparing weight, because the Omnium crankset includes the bottom bracket spindle since it is integrated. A more reasonable comparison is sugino 75 + bb of choice compared to Omnium + cups weight.
    That's true.

    It seems that aesthetic quality is probably going to be the deciding factor for me in this case, since the extra stiffness of the Omniums is probably something that I would be just fine without on the Steamroller's steel frame. The ductility of steel is great for a comfy street ride; bad for track-style stiffness.

  17. #17
    A little North of Hell
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinn View Post
    So it seems that we have two for Omnium. Any considerations in favor of the Suginos. Here are some prices:

    The Sugino 75 crank/bottom bracket/chainring for $297
    The Omnium crank/bottom bracket/chainring for $270

    Should I save the $30 for a new chain or get the Suginos?
    I have never had 75's, the Omniums I have have are very well made.
    Chainline just doesn't depend on the cogs, it is the hub/cog combo that you use.

    Got my Omniums on sale. The 175's are on sale again+free shipping.

    http://www.ebikestop.com/truvativ_om...set-CR2469.php
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    XXXI

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soil_Sampler View Post
    I have never had 75's, the Omniums I have have are very well made.
    Chainline just doesn't depend on the cogs, it is the hub/cog combo that you use.

    Got my Omniums on sale. The 175's are on sale again+free shipping.

    http://www.ebikestop.com/truvativ_om...set-CR2469.php
    Oh. I thought that I mentioned that I am using Surly hubs and cogs. This combo specs to work with 42.5-43.5 mm. With a 1/8 chain, could this be a problem with the chainline of the Omniums?

  19. #19
    A little North of Hell
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinn View Post
    Oh. I thought that I mentioned that I am using Surly hubs and cogs.
    This combo specs to work with 42.5-43.5 mm.
    With a 1/8 chain, could this be a problem with the chainline of the Omniums?
    My bike uses 110 spacing, my chainline is a little narrower.
    Some 1/8" chain brands make a difference in noise also.
    If you are within 1 or 2mm, you should be ok.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    XXXI

  20. #20
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinn View Post
    That's what I suspected. But what kind of cogs do you use with the Omnium cranks? I've heard -- but I can't find my source right now -- that the chaline for the Truvativ cranks is 41.5 mm. I currently use Surly rear cogs and these are speced to work with 42.5-43.5 mm chainlines. Have you had any trouble finding rear cogs to work with Truvativ?
    1mm is nothing to worry about in chainline, my Omniums run silent with a DA rear hub and EAI cog, running a well lubed Izumi chain. It was a little noisier when I had a Suntour cog that wasn't broken in, but the broken in EAI cog remedied that.

  21. #21
    not actually Nickatina andre nickatina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ilive41 View Post
    the salesman on the phone said they strike some of the "fatter" chainstays. that'd be a nightmare. Any ideas?
    Didn't happen on my Concept.










    To the OP I think maybe it just depends on your bike, since you don't think you're going to notice the added stiffness. I'd say go with 75's since it's a Steamroller... if you had an Al frame, I'd say Omniums. 75's really are the "standard" and you can't go wrong with them.

    One thing about the Omniums is it gets better with time because at first the bearings have a lot of drag until you get it broken in, like more apparently so then any square taper BB I've had. From what I hear they break in really nice and get super smooth with time though. I can't say I'd know... my Omniums have been ridden for 3 days until I got hit by a swinging trailer and my Concept has been sitting in a basement since waiting for the rims to be rebuilt (see my Concept thread if you want full story).

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by andre nickatina View Post
    Didn't happen on my Concept.










    To the OP I think maybe it just depends on your bike, since you don't think you're going to notice the added stiffness. I'd say go with 75's since it's a Steamroller... if you had an Al frame, I'd say Omniums. 75's really are the "standard" and you can't go wrong with them.

    One thing about the Omniums is it gets better with time because at first the bearings have a lot of drag until you get it broken in, like more apparently so then any square taper BB I've had. From what I hear they break in really nice and get super smooth with time though. I can't say I'd know... my Omniums have been ridden for 3 days until I got hit by a swinging trailer and my Concept has been sitting in a basement since waiting for the rims to be rebuilt (see my Concept thread if you want full story).
    Nikatina, I must say that your response and your 'signature' make a interesting combo. You either really know what you are talking about or you are a good bullshi**ter! :]

    By the way, congrats on your century. That's a real feat. Did you ride your Omniums on that?

    The more I think about it, the more the Suginos are the better choice for me because of aesthetic quality. Some may think that this is a stupid reason to go with them, but if, as seems to be the case from our discussion so far, the overall performance values between each are roughly equal for the kind of riding I want to do (cf. opening post), and since I care about how my ride looks, it seems that this should be an important determining factor. Do any of you have pictures of your Surly Steamroller with Sugino 75s or Omniums on there? It seems to me that the Omniums are too burly for a Surly. But a few examples of good looking Steamroller with Omniums may uproot that opinion.

  23. #23
    jpdesjar
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    +1 on the suginos being a better fit for the steamroller frame
    all this crank talk makes me want to switch out the rds i have now...although i am enjoying the ride very much as is, i think i will hold off a bit

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jpdesjar View Post
    +1 on the suginos being a better fit for the steamroller frame
    all this crank talk makes me want to switch out the rds i have now...although i am enjoying the ride very much as is, i think i will hold off a bit
    Denial ... its the first stage.

  25. #25
    jpdesjar
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    so did you say your chainline was off with the current set up?
    if i change up the crank and chainring do i need a new cog and chain at the same time? i think this maybe be a yes but just checking...been riding fixed since April or so

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