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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 11-29-08, 06:05 PM   #1
PoopinFresh
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Geometry Difference between Messenger and Kilo TT...

Hey all, I'm planning a purchase soon, and am currently torn between two bikes. Initially I wanted the messenger, as it comes with two brakes and is the same price as the Kilo TT, but after some thought, and watching some track racing, I realized I might actually want to race at some point, and the supposedly more "track" geometry of the Kilo TT brought me to that bike.

A post on another thread provoked some deeper thought, and I'd like other opinions:


Originally Posted by K_phomma

"The windsor is a road geo
Kilo is a track geo"

Most people on this forum (mis)judge the handling of a bike by how "steep" and "tight" it looks, but looks can be decieving.

Assuming the provided geometry charts for these bikes are correct, the Hour and Kilo TT frames have very similar geometry. See for yourself. The headtube angle of the Kilo TT ranges from 72-73.5 degrees. Thats hardly "track". The larger sizes of the Hour have a 75 degree HT angle, so if steep headtube angles are "track geo", the largest Hour frames are the most "track geo".

http://www.cyclesmercier.com/geometry_tt.html

http://www.windsorbicycles.com/track.htm

The fork rake (offset) for the Hour is not provided, so its hard to judge exactly how this bikes handles. However the Kilo TT fork has 40mm of rake for all but the smallest size. Thats not much rake for a road-like geometry frame, and I suspect they did it to make the bike look tighter. But this combo of frame and fork is actually going to result in more trail than is typical for either a road bike or a track bike, thus giving the Kilo TT more sluggish handling than even most road bikes. LOL. Track-bike indeed.

From How Do People Feel About Windsor Hour???

Is there much of a difference in geometry?

Does the geometry make that much difference in the real world?
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Old 11-29-08, 06:29 PM   #2
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http://www.urbanvelo.org/issue3/urbanvelo3_p44-45.html
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Old 11-29-08, 08:00 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopinFresh View Post
Does the geometry make that much difference in the real world?
The geometries of these cheap Bikesdirect entries do not appear to be very different, that is if the geometry charts are accurate. The geometries vary more between sizes than they do between models. For a beginner, the subtle handling difference between two similar bikes isn't going to mean much, if you can even really feel the difference at all. As you gain experience, geometry differences may become more apparent and more relevant to how you choose a bike. By the time you reach that point, if ever, you will have no doubt moved way way beyond wanting to buy and ride cheap bikesdirect bikes.

To summarize...the differences appear to be minor and to most recreational cyclists aren't going to amount to significant real-world differences in how these bikes ride. For a beginner, any of these bikes will do fine on the road or track.

Last edited by mihlbach; 11-29-08 at 08:14 PM.
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Old 11-29-08, 10:37 PM   #4
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Exactly what I was looking for, thank you.
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Old 11-30-08, 12:29 AM   #5
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the kilo looks better(tighter clearances and slightly ovalized tubing) and that is honestly why i bought it.
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Old 11-30-08, 04:10 PM   #6
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I've only had my Kilo TT for a few days, but it doesn't seem unstable or twitchy. It is very nimble though.
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