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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 12-31-08, 12:43 PM   #1
larsalan
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new forks for old bikes?

anybody got the time to explain this to me?

The issue is lateral deflection. I have a 1970s panasonic. At the bottom the fork has the inner race pressed onto it and the frame is the outer race. At the top the setup is similar, dig it?

what kind and how could I replace it? Considering geometry, strength, etc.
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Old 12-31-08, 12:46 PM   #2
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Integrated headset cups in the 70s? Pics please!
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Old 12-31-08, 01:02 PM   #3
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maybe 80s
yeah, I dunno anything about this so that's why I am asking. Sry I have no photos. I am assuming not every fork fits every bike. I am wanting to know what these fork types are called. The frame steering tube has outer races at the top and bottom where ball bearing sit between them and the pressed on fork inner race and the headset hardware's inner race.
sry there is no pics, myb I should move this to the mechanic forum?
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Old 12-31-08, 01:06 PM   #4
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This is the style I am talking about, only my steering tube is longer.
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Old 12-31-08, 01:14 PM   #5
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that picture does not have an integrated headset, and i don't believe that's what you are talking about. those races on the frame can be removed. your fork sounds like it's called a "1 inch threaded fork" the same fork used on bikes for deeeeeeeeeeeecades

if you can't accurately describe it because you don't know the terminology and you can't take pictures, it is going to be much more worth your time to take it to a local bike shop and ask them, instead of face the wrath of the SSFG forum.
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Old 12-31-08, 01:14 PM   #6
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Those headset cups are not part of the frame, they are pressed into it.

Read this: http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=127

As far as new forks fitting, you will need a 1 inch fork (the other option is 1 1/8). You may or may not need to replace the whole headset depending on its condition and the kind of replacement fork you get.

Why do you need a new one?
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Old 12-31-08, 01:34 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wearyourtruth View Post
those races on the frame can be removed. your fork sounds like it's called a "1 inch threaded fork" the same fork used on bikes for deeeeeeeeeeeecades
Quote:
Originally Posted by huerro View Post
Those headset cups are not part of the frame, they are pressed into it.

Read this: http://www.parktool.com/repair/readhowto.asp?id=127

As far as new forks fitting, you will need a 1 inch fork (the other option is 1 1/8). You may or may not need to replace the whole headset depending on its condition and the kind of replacement fork you get.

Why do you need a new one?
Yes I see that it is a "threaded headset" probably 1" cause it says that is the japanese standard.
I would not want to have to pull those cups.
My thinking was that a carbon or round fork might be more laterally stable than the one I have if the process was as simple as unscrewing the old and putting the new in it's place.
Should I just leave well enough alone?
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Old 12-31-08, 01:37 PM   #8
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Should I just leave well enough alone?
Yes. Or pay a bike shop to do it for you. It requires special tools.
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Old 12-31-08, 02:48 PM   #9
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huerro who knew you cleaned up so nicely
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Old 12-31-08, 03:02 PM   #10
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That's my life in the tropics look. I'm back to a full beard now.
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Old 12-31-08, 03:19 PM   #11
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Yes. Or pay a bike shop to do it for you. It requires special tools.
You need one of these:



To get the headset cups out of the headtube. You will have to hit it with a hammer:



You need one of these:





To set the cups in place. You can carefully bang them in place with a piece of wood in between them and the hammer but the press is way better.

When you take them off, clean them in kerosene or mineral spirits and a brush to get any gunk out. You can polish the outsides with wax after you put them back on. Throw away the old bearings and get new ones. Loose balls are best. Apply a bunch of waterproof grease like Phil Woods or automotive bearing grease into the cups then add the bearings. Completely fill the cup then remove one ball bearing. Complete reassembly.

By the way, that bike is one of mine. The headset was the only original part I reused on the bike.
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Old 12-31-08, 03:41 PM   #12
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^^^plus tools for the crown race and possibly for cutting and threading the new fork.
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Old 12-31-08, 03:42 PM   #13
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Why should the cups need to be removed? I am over the whole plan now due to the tools and effort. But, why couldn't I just pull the original fork out and jammer in a steel round tube of the same size?

here are some
http://cgi.ebay.com/Schwinn-1-1-8-St...3A1|240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.com/700c-Cyclocross-...3A1|240%3A1318
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Old 12-31-08, 03:49 PM   #14
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Why should the cups need to be removed? I am over the whole plan now due to the tools and effort. But, why couldn't I just pull the original fork out and jammer in a steel round tube of the same size?

here are some
http://cgi.ebay.com/Schwinn-1-1-8-St...3A1|240%3A1318

http://cgi.ebay.com/700c-Cyclocross-...3A1|240%3A1318
First, those are two different sizes one of which won't work. Also, they would both require you to either install a new type of headset and stem or remove the crown race from your old fork and install it on the new fork, cut it to the right length, and cut threads in it.
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Old 12-31-08, 05:09 PM   #15
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You need a 1" threaded fork if you want to minimize the work needed.

You should have a bike shop remove the crown race from your old fork and put it on the new one. The hiccup that can occur at this point is if your fork takes a different sized crown race. There are two sizes that are less than a millimeter different in diameter. I believe the different sized came about as a result of different material being used.

Then install the new fork...and do it right.
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Old 01-01-09, 05:39 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larsalan View Post
anybody got the time to explain this to me?

The issue is lateral deflection. I have a 1970s panasonic. At the bottom the fork has the inner race pressed onto it and the frame is the outer race. At the top the setup is similar, dig it?

what kind and how could I replace it? Considering geometry, strength, etc.
Were you by chance born after 1988? Most guys your age have never seen a threaded headset. My kids have no idea of what they are either.
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Old 01-01-09, 07:12 AM   #17
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Sheldon will set you straight: http://www.sheldonbrown.com/headsets.html
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Old 01-01-09, 09:42 AM   #18
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Tools

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^^^plus tools for the crown race and possibly for cutting and threading the new fork.
Get 'em all in one place:



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Old 01-03-09, 04:09 AM   #19
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there was a guy on the local CL here asking for a 1" carbon threadless fork to replace the fork on his bike, when i sent him an email offering to sell him mine he responded by saying
"no thanks, thats a bit out of my price range, I am hoping to find something off a throw-away bike from the 70's or 80's"

... i just shook my head.
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Old 01-03-09, 04:17 PM   #20
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Crown race removal isn't usually hard at all.


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