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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 03-30-09, 02:20 AM   #1
ALaS
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Why are Leader track frames so agressive!?

I really like the look of the leader frames, despite all the negatives heard about them on this forum. Too bad their top tube lengths are so huge! I did the fit calculator and my TT length should be between 521 and 525mm and the smallest leader has a TT length of 546mm. Would that really be pushing it? All weight in my wrists and shoulders? That would benefit me if I raced though, right? Too bad I won't.

Ef.

/rant.
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Old 03-30-09, 03:11 AM   #2
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Did you measure for a track bike or road bike? Unless your 5 feet tall or have T-rex arms, you made an error somewhere.
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Old 03-30-09, 05:36 AM   #3
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That's not "aggressive," that's just long. A lot of companies, particularly small companies, make limited sizes. A lot of companies also make bad geometry decisions that result in "small" bikes having 54cm top tubes. "Between 521 and 525 mm" means that you should be riding a 52-53. The 4mm of variance is a bit too small to bother dealing with, especially if you haven't considered saddle positioning, stem length and height, and the type of bars you're dealing with - not just "road bars or track bars," but the reach and drop measurements. You can't make all decisions based on an internet fit calculator - you can just get a sense of where you need to be a trial-and-error it the rest of the way in.
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Old 03-30-09, 10:43 AM   #4
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I have both a leader and a mercier. The leaders top tube is a lot longer, so I feel more tired after riding it vs the kilo. I got used to it later on though. Just take that into consideration.
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Old 03-30-09, 11:56 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cramdangle View Post
I have both a leader and a mercier. The leaders top tube is a lot longer, so I feel more tired after riding it vs the kilo. I got used to it later on though. Just take that into consideration.
Are the cockpits the same on both bikes? If not, i don't think that's a fair comparison.
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Old 03-30-09, 12:13 PM   #6
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To me, my 735TR is the best fit I could have on a bike. I use a 130mm stem and the bars are right over the front axle from my point of view.

Apparently i have short legs and regular arms. Anyway, this isn't necessarily a poor frame size, it's just that they chose to have the top tube proportionally longer (which it is through all sizes).
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Old 03-30-09, 02:02 PM   #7
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It's perfect to give you a longer tt. You can get more saddle to bar drop this way without having to run a longer stem on a smaller size.
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Old 03-30-09, 02:05 PM   #8
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I'm 5'6. I can post my measurements. I'm pretty sure I didn't make a mistake.

Measurements:
Inseam: 29.5
Trunk: 24
Forearm: 12.495
Arm: 23.75
Thigh: 23
Lower Leg: 21.125
Sternal Notch: 53.5
Total Body Height: 66

The Competitive Fit (cm)
Seat tube range c-c: 48.5 - 49.0
Seat tube range c-t: 50.0 - 50.5
Top tube length: 52.1 - 52.5
Stem Length: 10.2 - 10.8
BB-Saddle Position: 67.0 - 69.0
Saddle-Handlebar: 48.5 - 49.1
Saddle Setback: 2.3 - 2.7

Quote:
Originally Posted by cramdangle
I have both a leader and a mercier. The leaders top tube is a lot longer, so I feel more tired after riding it vs the kilo. I got used to it later on though. Just take that into consideration.
Thanks, that's the kinda info I was looking for. How tired? Like fatigued since your position was much more "aggressive" right? What's the longest you think you could ride the leader? And how big is your bike?
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Old 03-30-09, 02:06 PM   #9
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Oh and for those who want to see

The Eddy Fit (cm)
Seat tube range c-c: 49.7 - 50.2
Seat tube range c-t: 51.2 - 51.7
Top tube length: 52.1 - 52.5
Stem Length: 9.1 - 9.7
BB-Saddle Position: 66.2 - 68.2
Saddle-Handlebar: 49.3 - 49.9
Saddle Setback: 3.5 - 3.9


The French Fit (cm)
Seat tube range c-c: 51.4 - 51.9
Seat tube range c-t: 52.9 - 53.4
Top tube length: 53.3 - 53.7
Stem Length: 9.3 - 9.9
BB-Saddle Position: 64.5 - 66.5
Saddle-Handlebar: 51.0 - 51.6
Saddle Setback: 3.0 - 3.4

Though, I'm not too sure what these are for? The french like to be a bit more aggressive? The Eddie people like to ride more compact?
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Old 03-30-09, 03:26 PM   #10
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Without knowing any info about your fitness, flexibility, riding style, etc- based on the info you've given a 525mm top tube should be the right "middle of the road" length for someone your size.
How much you can tolerate at the extremes is up to you, but all else being equal, I think getting a bike with a tt that's an inch too long would require you to make too many compromises (stem length, seat setback, etc).
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Old 03-30-09, 04:39 PM   #11
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Thanks. I'm athletic. I don't know how uncomfortable it would be to ride? Too many compromises meaning it would cost a lot or it would defeat the purpose and wouldn't be worth it because it would throw off..things, such as geometry or something?
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Old 03-30-09, 08:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALaS View Post
Thanks. I'm athletic. I don't know how uncomfortable it would be to ride? Too many compromises meaning it would cost a lot or it would defeat the purpose and wouldn't be worth it because it would throw off..things, such as geometry or something?
I think most of their models are intended to be aggressively ridden on a velo.

Buy a different bike if you want something more comfortable.
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Old 03-30-09, 09:19 PM   #13
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If by cockpit, you mean using the same parts (saddle height/ stem length/ handlebars) then yes, I am doing it all the same. The leader is longer and I feel like I'm spending more energy getting it going. I forgot to mention that the high bottom bracket position also affects my energy usage.

But I've done 30 mile rides with the leader just fine, it's not like I wanna kill myself after riding it. I did a nice 15 minute race from one point of the city to downtown Long Beach and it wasn't too bad. Oh yeah it's a 53 CM, and I'm far from athletic.

Last edited by cramdangle; 03-30-09 at 09:25 PM.
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Old 03-30-09, 10:24 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALaS View Post
I really like the look of the leader frames, despite all the negatives heard about them on this forum. Too bad their top tube lengths are so huge! I did the fit calculator and my TT length should be between 521 and 525mm and the smallest leader has a TT length of 546mm. Would that really be pushing it? All weight in my wrists and shoulders? That would benefit me if I raced though, right? Too bad I won't.

Ef.

/rant.
Are you really that shocked? This is the same bike company that makes their rear triangle too short to properly fit a 700c wheel.
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Old 04-01-09, 02:17 AM   #15
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So that "award winning track geometry is BS?" what six wheel can it fit properly? Do people run 700s?
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Old 04-01-09, 01:04 PM   #16
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"Why are Leader track frames so agressive!?" Because they've been abused by their owners all their lives.
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Old 04-01-09, 03:27 PM   #17
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Haha.

So, I can compensate the long TT by shorter stem and sadle position?
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