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Old 10-18-09, 09:23 AM   #1
lbdunn
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New bike lock

Hello,

I am a student at Boston University. This semester I am developing a new type of bike lock. As part of my project I am trying to get feedback from people who bike in the city.

Here is the link to a completely confidential, anonymous survey: http://team4core.questionpro.com/

I would really appreciate it if you could take 5 minutes to give me some feedback.

Thank you!
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Old 10-18-09, 09:38 AM   #2
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I'm skeptical, but interested. The actual locking mechanism better be really strong.
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Old 10-18-09, 09:58 AM   #3
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very cool, man. That product looks like something I would be interested in AS LONG AS it is actually secure. I think your survey will indicate that security is the #1 priority for lock buyers. You should have ex-bike thiefs (if you can find some) test it out. Make sure that it can't be cut through with a hacksaw and make sure that bolt cutters don't work on the locking mechanism.

Another reason why I would be interested in this is b/c bike thiefs don't know about it yet. So I feel like all of the bike thiefs realize how to defeat certain types of locks, and then tell other thiefs about it (car jack, bolt cutters, etc). If you have a new type of lock they have never seen, then they probably won't even try and mess with it. They will just go for conventional locks that they know how to defeat (U-lock, chain).
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Old 10-18-09, 10:22 AM   #4
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Try breaking it with a bottle jack, a cutting torch, a portable angle grinder, yard-long bolt cutters, and anything else you can think of. I remain sceptical of most locks, yard long bolt cutters can go through those big kryptonite locks in 30 seconds.
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Old 10-18-09, 10:24 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seau grateau View Post
I'm skeptical, but interested. The actual locking mechanism better be really strong.
That's what I think too.

They ask you to rate it for security and convenience, but I have no data about either. How valid are opinions that have no factual basis?
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Old 10-18-09, 10:32 AM   #6
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It looks like a standard MBA start your own business class so...the opinions are completely valid from a marketing perspective since they will never actually make this lock so it won't get tested and people will be interested in things that "look" secure.
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Old 10-18-09, 10:44 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedallingATX View Post
very cool, man. That product looks like something I would be interested in AS LONG AS it is actually secure. I think your survey will indicate that security is the #1 priority for lock buyers. You should have ex-bike thiefs (if you can find some) test it out. Make sure that it can't be cut through with a hacksaw and make sure that bolt cutters don't work on the locking mechanism.

Another reason why I would be interested in this is b/c bike thiefs don't know about it yet. So I feel like all of the bike thiefs realize how to defeat certain types of locks, and then tell other thiefs about it (car jack, bolt cutters, etc). If you have a new type of lock they have never seen, then they probably won't even try and mess with it. They will just go for conventional locks that they know how to defeat (U-lock, chain).
Excellent points! Also, as a college student, you have to deal with probably the worst theft environment there is. The only time I've had a bike stolen was when I was in college and I chained my bike to a metal fence, only to have the crook cut the fence.
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Old 10-18-09, 11:03 AM   #8
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I would recommend some minor wordsmithing:

Quote:
How often do you lock your bike outside overnight?
Both this and the previous question threw me off. Do you mean how often do I lock my bike when I leave it outside overnight, or how often do I actually lock my bike and leave it outside overnight?

Quote:
Our product is a bike lock made of a woven blend of Kevlar (used to make bullet proof vests) and braided steel.
This concerns me a bit. If I recall correctly, one of the major downsides of older (read: currently cheaper) kevlar was that it would stop bullets but not knives...

Also, if you're serious, and to be safe, I would at least get a free 1-year provisional patent.
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Old 10-18-09, 11:09 AM   #9
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I'm not a Materials Engineer, but I don't think that kevlar is actually that strong, compared to most things yes, but when infront of a bike theif, maybe not

Of course, I would love for you to prove me wrong because this looks like it might work with some research
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Old 10-18-09, 11:55 AM   #10
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i like the idea of being able to put a lock in my pocket. I, too, am skeptical about the strength of this, but if it is strong enough (and I think that it could be if you found the right blend of materials), this lock would sell like condoms in amsterdam.

I can't tell you how many times I leave my house and have to take a back pack just to put my u-lock in. It's frustrating b/c if I didn't have to put my u-lock in something, then I wouldn't need to bring my back pack.

I realize this is just for a college project, but making a lock like this would probably be a legitimately profitable business venture.
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Old 10-18-09, 12:40 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by PedallingATX View Post
i like the idea of being able to put a lock in my pocket. I, too, am skeptical about the strength of this, but if it is strong enough (and I think that it could be if you found the right blend of materials), this lock would sell like condoms in amsterdam.

I can't tell you how many times I leave my house and have to take a back pack just to put my u-lock in. It's frustrating b/c if I didn't have to put my u-lock in something, then I wouldn't need to bring my back pack.

I realize this is just for a college project, but making a lock like this would probably be a legitimately profitable business venture.
Hang it in your belt or buy a u-lock holster.


Honestly, with this lock reviews are what would determine if I buy it or not. If it was more secure than my NYC, I'd get it. If it wasn't, I wouldn't.
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Old 10-18-09, 01:32 PM   #12
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i think a dremel style rotary tool could cut through that pretty easily.
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Old 10-18-09, 02:52 PM   #13
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be cool if this works. I some how doubt it will though
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Old 10-18-09, 03:06 PM   #14
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i agree that it is difficult for us to rate the lock itself. one of the big problems that you are going to face in this project and (if it were to happen) the early development of this product is that you are using a material that is not well understood to the average person, steel belted kevlar.

i understand a u-lock because i understand a solid piece of steel. i understand a chain. i also understand a braided steel cable. these are all things that i have interacted with through my life and if you tell me "oh this lock is made out of X inch thick Y material" than i have a good idea how strong that is going to be. i am not familiar with kevlar's properties and it would take some good convincing to show me that this lock is going to hold up any better than a regular cable lock.
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Old 10-18-09, 03:56 PM   #15
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I would buy one in a heartbeat because it looks strong and very portable.
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Old 10-18-09, 04:00 PM   #16
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i think a dremel style rotary tool could cut through that pretty easily.
It will take a LOT of cutting discs.
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Old 10-18-09, 04:14 PM   #17
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Old 10-18-09, 05:18 PM   #18
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very interesting but i hope it is just an exercise because that lock has tremendous vulnerability. the specified materials are not cut proof and will be "chewed" apart if it deflects what you intended to cut it with, especially the most common thing which is bolt cutters.

but all you really need to defeat that lock is a 1-2 foot length of pipe. the amount of force that can be generated by inserting said pipe into loop, then twisting in one direction, is amazing and way more than enough to separate by tearing the flexible bits from the solid bits no matter how you intended them to join.
So you've had your hands on this lock and know it will be defeated by all that you have mentioned? Interesting.


This looks like a cool idea, I think it could be made secure with the right material as you could really tighten it up to the object and your bike so it may be hard to get a tool in between there. If I saw a video of how this lock holds up against some cutting tools and how it can hold against brute force, I would definitely buy one (price pending).
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Old 10-18-09, 05:22 PM   #19
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i feel like every 2 months there's somebody doing either real or mock market research on this message board
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Old 10-18-09, 05:32 PM   #20
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I don't care how strong a lock is, someone will get through it.

make me a lock with a pressurized mixture of paint and mace in the loop so whomever does break it can't see where he is going for 2 hours and looks like a smurf for a week.
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Old 10-18-09, 06:26 PM   #21
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First let me thank you all for your responses! It has been a huge help.

I have worked with a textile manufacturer to develop the actual strapping. The key to the design is the braided steel wiring that is woven inside the strapping. I have taken both a hacksaw and a traditional leatherman to it. Neither made any damage. I used all my force to try to puncture it with my leatherman but I could not get the tip of the blade through the strapping. I will take your suggestions and test it against bolt cutters.

Here is a rendering of the internal wire system:


Again I truly appreciate everyone's input.
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Old 10-18-09, 06:58 PM   #22
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How does it stand up to an angle grinder, or what many "good" bike-thieves use? I've seen broken top of the line Krypto's and Onguard's because of this. Not sure how many people really try and break locks with hacksaws...
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Old 10-18-09, 07:02 PM   #23
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very cool looking I hope it meets expectations I'd like to buy something like that
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Old 10-18-09, 08:10 PM   #24
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here's the image, by the way.



I bet I could take a hammer and smash and disable the locking mechanism with a few blows. If you lock can be defeated with any simple blunt object, then it is very insecure relative to other locks that require powertools or other "advanced" methods of compromise. Replace a hammer with a cinderblock or whatever else is heavy and easily found on the street and you'll see how often such a lock can be defeated.
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Old 10-18-09, 08:29 PM   #25
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try bolt cutters too.
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