Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-20-10, 09:41 AM   #1
tekne
Keep movin
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 6
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Is it OK to put a narrow tire on a wider rim?

Hi there,

I posted this on the Road forum, but thought to post here as well as some people may know.

I recently went to my local LBS to buy a QR front wheel to replace my bolt on. My original wheel rim size is 622-14 and has a 700c/23 tire. I was given a wider wheel that is sized 622-19 or 700 x 28/36.

They said it would fit fine, but now that I have the 23 tire on it, I'm not so sure.

I'm assuming the 700 x 28/36 means that it fits tire widths from 28mm-36mm, but I'm not sure.

Can someone please tell me if it is ok to use this tire size on this rim - or should I go for a narrower rim if I want to continue to use a 23 or 25mm tire?

Are there any disadvantages in using a tire width that is narrower than what a rim is marked for?
Any help is greatly appreciated.
tekne is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 09:44 AM   #2
hairnet
Fresh Garbage
 
hairnet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Bikes:
Posts: 12,435
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 35 Post(s)
you probably could have just replaced the solid axle in your previous wheel with a hollow one for quick release

but 622x19mm gives you the rim's width, 19mm. Look here http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html, 28-36 is the suggested tire width. It may work to put a narrow tire on a wide rim, reading from Sheldon, but it may be risky.

Last edited by hairnet; 03-20-10 at 09:53 AM.
hairnet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 09:49 AM   #3
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
you're more likely to pinch flat.

that's about it for running tires that are too narrow for rims.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 10:57 AM   #4
oldfolksmashers
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 288
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wrong.

HED Wheels, who uses 23mm wide rims on their C2 road race wheels has this to say:

"But what makes 23mm better than the ubiquitous 19mm rim? Width. Picture a standard 23mm tire on the C2 rim. Tire and rim width are the same, the sidewalls are fairly straight, and the width of the rim spreads the tread contact patch out. With straighter sidewalls, and more rubber on the road, cornering is an entirely new experience. The sidewalls don’t flop over in a hard corner, and more rubber on the road is, well... better. C2s should be run with lower pressure, since there is more air volume in the wider tire profile. The same tire on a 19mm rim looks more like the profile of a light bulb. The curved sidewalls flop over under hard cornering, there is less rubber on the road, and more air pressure is needed to prevent pinch flats."

A 23mm tire on a 23mm rim is more aerodynamic, less prone to pinch flats, can be run at lower pressures with less chance of roll-off in turns, and provides an overall more comfortable ride.

AEO, tires that are too WIDE for a rim are more prone to pinch flats.

So to conclude, you'll be fine. As long as your tire is wider than your rim, you won't have any problem. (i.e. don't run 19mm tires on a 21mm rim...)
oldfolksmashers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 12:39 PM   #5
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by oldfolksmashers View Post
Wrong.

HED Wheels, who uses 23mm wide rims on their C2 road race wheels has this to say:

"But what makes 23mm better than the ubiquitous 19mm rim? Width. Picture a standard 23mm tire on the C2 rim. Tire and rim width are the same, the sidewalls are fairly straight, and the width of the rim spreads the tread contact patch out. With straighter sidewalls, and more rubber on the road, cornering is an entirely new experience. The sidewalls don’t flop over in a hard corner, and more rubber on the road is, well... better. C2s should be run with lower pressure, since there is more air volume in the wider tire profile. The same tire on a 19mm rim looks more like the profile of a light bulb. The curved sidewalls flop over under hard cornering, there is less rubber on the road, and more air pressure is needed to prevent pinch flats."

A 23mm tire on a 23mm rim is more aerodynamic, less prone to pinch flats, can be run at lower pressures with less chance of roll-off in turns, and provides an overall more comfortable ride.

AEO, tires that are too WIDE for a rim are more prone to pinch flats.

So to conclude, you'll be fine. As long as your tire is wider than your rim, you won't have any problem. (i.e. don't run 19mm tires on a 21mm rim...)
and sheldon says otherwise.
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/tire-sizing.html#width
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 01:32 PM   #6
hairnet
Fresh Garbage
 
hairnet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Bikes:
Posts: 12,435
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 35 Post(s)
mmm where are the armchair physicists at?

Last edited by hairnet; 03-20-10 at 01:35 PM.
hairnet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 01:53 PM   #7
gospastic
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 539
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
well speaking from experience and not just spitting back out what the internet says, i rode 23s all winter long on horrible chicago streets on 23mm wide rims. worked totally fine. no pinch flats.
gospastic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 01:59 PM   #8
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by gospastic View Post
well speaking from experience and not just spitting back out what the internet says, i rode 23s all winter long on horrible chicago streets on 23mm wide rims. worked totally fine. no pinch flats.
yeah, this is my finding too. just keep the proper pressure and avoid broad siding curbs and pot holes.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 02:21 PM   #9
desconhecido
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Bikes:
Posts: 927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Depends on how wide the rim is. Mavic says the A719 is a 622-19 rim. It's 19mm inside. Outside, best I can tell, it's 24.6 mm. If the rim is 19mm outside width, it's ok. If it's 19mm inside, you might want a larger tire.

OP says the rim he replaced is a 622-14. That is probably a 19mm (plus or minus) wide rim. Mavic says the Open Pro is 622-15.

According to the Sheldon Brown site, ISO/ERTO standard refers to the inside flange width, not the outside width.

Last edited by desconhecido; 03-20-10 at 02:27 PM.
desconhecido is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 02:36 PM   #10
prathmann
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Bay Area, Calif.
Bikes:
Posts: 6,003
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AEO View Post
yeah, this is my finding too. just keep the proper pressure and avoid broad siding curbs and pot holes.
Agreed, and the advice on pressure, curbs, and potholes is good regardless of the rim width. I'm currently using a 23mm tire on a rim that's at least that wide on the outside and haven't encountered any problems.
prathmann is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 02:37 PM   #11
hairnet
Fresh Garbage
 
hairnet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Los Angeles
Bikes:
Posts: 12,435
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 35 Post(s)
for one thing, with my Open Pro rim it looks like my 23m tire is almost flush with the rim. Maybe we're confusing interior width with exterior width here?
hairnet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 02:45 PM   #12
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Open pro is 13mm inner width and around 19.5mm outer width.

A719 is 18mm inner width and around 24.5mm outer width.

I go by inner width, because that's the one that matters.

most clincher rims that I've measured have 3.3mm of wall/braking surface on each side.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm

Last edited by AEO; 03-20-10 at 02:48 PM.
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 02:57 PM   #13
desconhecido
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Bikes:
Posts: 927
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AEO View Post
Open pro is 13mm inner width and around 19.5mm outer width.

A719 is 18mm inner width and around 24.5mm outer width.

I go by inner width, because that's the one that matters.

most clincher rims that I've measured have 3.3mm of wall/braking surface on each side.
So, someone might call the Open Pro a 19mm rim and someone else may call the the A719 an 18mm rim. The key thing, I think, is that a 23mm tire on an Open Pro is just a wonderful thing, on an A719, not so much.
desconhecido is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 03:04 PM   #14
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
yeah, 18mm inner width rims ask for 28mm wide tires as the minimum from the manufacturers.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-20-10, 10:00 PM   #15
Six jours
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 6,401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
While seeing hipsters get taken advantage of by the LBS is a never ending source of amusement, try this. (Don't say I never did anything for you.)

Almost all modern track hubs* use 10x1 rear axles and 9x1 front. I've never seen an aftermarket 120mm hollow axle, so you'll need to buy a 130 and file off 10mm, or a 126 and file off 6mm . This is easy to do with hand tools, even for teenaged trend followers. And you can use the $100 you saved by not replacing your wheel to buy nose jewelry and tweed!

*I know some of you kids are using truly sh!tty hubs from Suzue, etc, which may have wacky axle threading. Harris, as always, can set you straight if you're not sure what you need.

Last edited by Six jours; 03-20-10 at 10:04 PM.
Six jours is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-10, 07:21 AM   #16
AEO
Senior Member
 
AEO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: A Coffin Called Earth. or Toronto, ON
Bikes: Bianchi, Miyata, Dahon, Rossin
Posts: 12,258
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
or just buy hubs that have hollow axles to start off with and cut them down to size.

novatech hubs already have hallow axles.
it's quite easy to turn one of these hubs into...
(You can also find novatech hubs on a lot of the ebay FG wheel sellers)

this. I think it took around 2mins to saw off the excess bits.
__________________
Food for thought: if you aren't dead by 2050, you and your entire family will be within a few years from starvation. Now that is a cruel gift to leave for your offspring. ;)
http://sanfrancisco.ibtimes.com/arti...ger-photos.htm
AEO is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:00 PM.