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Singlespeed & Fixed Gear "I still feel that variable gears are only for people over forty-five. Isn't it better to triumph by the strength of your muscles than by the artifice of a derailer? We are getting soft...As for me, give me a fixed gear!"-- Henri Desgrange (31 January 1865 - 16 August 1940)

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Old 11-19-10, 01:14 AM   #1
cal_blam
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bicyclewheels.com warning

I'd recommend you think twice before ordering from bicyclewheels.com.

I ordered mavic 32 spoke mavic OP's with formula hubs. I received 36 spoke OPs with origin hubs. Regardless of the builders view of the comparitive merits of the build, at the very least I should have been contacted before they shipped an alternative product. See emails exchanged below.

They still do not have 32 hole OP's in stock yet are advertising them for sale on their website. I imagine they are continuing to ship whatever alternative product they think best to the unsuspecting customer.


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: (edited)
Date: Thu, Nov 18, 2010 at 1:31 PM
Subject: RE: Your Bicyclewheels.com online order
To: (edited)


I make $ 40.00 profit on a set of wheels, I gave you a High quality wheelset, stronger than what you purchased.



The hubs I sell are branded Origin8 and made by formula, I can't afford to lose $ 100 on this deal just because they

dont say Formula on them, I dont understand what is the problem, you got what you purchased ........even better.



If you want a refund, please send them back, I will refund the Full amount you paid me, Not the return freight.

Please send them Certified mail with signature confirmation. I will only refund you upon delivery.



Cesar

From: (edited)
To: Cesar Insignares
Subject: Re: Your Bicyclewheels.com online order

Will you also refund the cost of return freight in both directions?

----- Reply message -----
From: (edited)@bicyclewheels.com>
To: "(edited)
Subject: Your Bicyclewheels.com online order
Date: Thu, Nov 18, 2010 12:40 am


Hi:

Formula and Origin8 are the same hubs, the US importer labels them as Origin8 because he has

an entire line of Origin8 products, you can research the net.

I took the liberty to do some research for you:

1. If its any help, I have Origin 8 Hubs on my weinmann track wheelset. I got these through wheel and sprocket's ebay page. It seems that they lace everything up to origin 8s or formula (whether weinmann or velocity
2. I have had these hubs on my weinmanns since July when i brought this new wheelset out here and I have not had any problem, and I have been riding and abusing these wheels A LOT. The bearings are everything seem absolutely fine, but I am also comparing these to the stock setup that came with my original giant wheelset.
3. I think based on the comments before from an earlier thread about formula and phil wood hubs, I am convinced that hubs arent the most essential part of the wheelset. Despite the fact that origin 8 seems to be a cheap brand, i think the fact that they are being used on a lot of pre built wheelsets means that they are at least realiable and safe.
4. I have been doing research and found that Origin8 are rebranded Formula hubs, the importer in US has a complete line of origin8 products including cranks, bars and seatposts, rebranding is a very popular thing nowadays.
5. I Hope this helps.


We ran out of 32 hole rims a few weeks back and the wheelbuilders decided to make the wheels

in 36 holes ( much more stronger, only 8 grams heavier per set )


We are still out of 32 hole open pro's.

I understand if you dont want to keep them, you can return them for a full refund, but those They are super stiff,

super strong, and they only weight 16 grams more a set. it is really not a big deal.In the long run you will have a more durable

wheelset.


From: (edited)
To: (edited)@bicyclewheels.com
Subject: Re: Your Bicyclewheels.com online order


Hello, I have just received a package from you, but it is not my order. You have sent me

Mavic OP / Origin 8/ 36 /36

I ordered

Mavic OP/Forumla / 32 / 32

see below.

These have cost me $70 in postage alone and are not the wheels I need.

What to do?
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Old 11-19-10, 01:20 AM   #2
Squirrelli
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Formulas are rebranded to many many different companies, such as IRO, Origin8, Velocity, Harris Cyclery, etc etc.

Even though you are definitely getting a stronger set of wheels, they however, should've informed about the change in rims/hubs drilling.
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Old 11-19-10, 01:24 AM   #3
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really id be stoked for 36 spoke at the 32 spoke price... everyone and their mother re-labels formula hubs. I have heard nothing but good things about them so not sure of the issue. he does sound a bit rude i will give you that...
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Old 11-19-10, 01:24 AM   #4
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Dude you got more spokes for the same munny. Liek wuts the prolbem?

edit- Dude is a cock.
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Old 11-19-10, 01:28 AM   #5
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really id be stoked for 36 spoke at the 32 spoke price
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Dude you got more spokes for the same munny. Liek wuts the prolbem?
inorite

I'm surprised they didn't ask you to pay extra for more spokes.
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Old 11-19-10, 01:32 AM   #6
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the hubs are equivalent. formula is the manufacturer and companies buy them to label them with their own name. It's like buying a maxway frame vs a fuji or whatever. same bike, different name.

Crappy customer service to just send you different spoke count though. sure you can argue that you're getting a stronger wheel for the same price, but you don't just change someone's order without notifying them first.

i'd expect them to pay return shipping, it's their error (though not refund you on your shipping out, kind of like split the cost. poor form.
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Old 11-19-10, 01:52 AM   #7
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sure you can argue that you're getting a stronger wheel for the same price, but you don't just change someone's order without notifying them first.
I don't need the extra spokes for strength, I don't weigh enough to worry about it. Decided I really wanted the 32s, shopped around for them, and ordered them.
There's no problem with the build, they look real nice - just getting something different to what i wanted.
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Old 11-19-10, 02:04 AM   #8
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Old 11-19-10, 02:06 AM   #9
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I LOL'd hard at this fail rant. It just got better and better.
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Old 11-19-10, 02:31 AM   #10
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Good to read his email. I will not order anything from bicyclewheels.com after seeing that type of customer service.
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Old 11-19-10, 02:43 AM   #11
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Yup... the mod deleted the Rydbike thread... may have been a copyright issue involved.

Onto the subject of this thread... you pay what for you get. Bottom line - its that old dicum - caveat emptor!
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Old 11-19-10, 02:57 AM   #12
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Dood you should email Cesar this forum thread and see what happens.

www.bicyclewheels.com is now on my naughty list.

"I dont understand what is the problem, you got what you purchased ........even better."

This quote from Cesar doesn't make me want to buy from them. They screwed up, they should pay for both your initial shipping and the return shipping. An extra 16 grams is not want you paid for.

He may have saved $100, but I think he lost a lot more in potential business due to his poor customer service.

Last edited by 531phile; 11-19-10 at 03:07 AM.
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Old 11-19-10, 03:16 AM   #13
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Dood you should email Cesar this forum thread and see what happens.

An extra 16 grams is not want you paid for.
Exactly. The choice is mine whether I want the extra spokes or not. I paid extra so I could get the nice setup that I wanted. Really I have to decide whether it is worth the argument, worth a month without new wheels.
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Old 11-19-10, 03:28 AM   #14
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haha, the dude is a jerk. You didn't get what you ordered. It is as simple as that.
Quote:
We ran out of 32 hole rims a few weeks back and the wheelbuilders decided to make the wheels

in 36 holes ( much more stronger, only 8 grams heavier per set )


We are still out of 32 hole open pro's.

I understand if you dont want to keep them, you can return them for a full refund, but those They are super stiff,

super strong, and they only weight 16 grams more a set. it is really not a big deal.In the long run you will have a more durable

wheelset.
hmmm...his grammar could be improved.

"much more stronger"

and wait...he saids its only 8grams more per set and then 16grams more per set in the following sentence???
i wouldnt even trust his weights. THIS GUYYY...shoot ahah

he just lost a lot of business
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Old 11-19-10, 03:40 AM   #15
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You didn't get what you ordered. It is as simple as that.
...he saids its only 8grams more per set and then 16grams more per set(
Yep. I reckon he meant to say 8gms per wheel (maybe it's 2g per spoke) and so 16 g per set. Not that weight is a huge thing for me on my bike. Except that I like to keep the rolling weight down on the wheels cos in the end it makes a diff to my knees. Don't know how much diff 8g on each wheel would make, shouldn't have to know either.
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Old 11-19-10, 03:47 AM   #16
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i have never order from them
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Old 11-19-10, 03:54 AM   #17
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dear god, that is a tragic mistake! damn them!
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Old 11-19-10, 03:55 AM   #18
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i have never order from them
and i never will...
wheelandsprocket, bens cycle, velomine will supply me with all my wheeling needs
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Old 11-19-10, 06:34 AM   #19
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i fully agree with the OP, there is no excuse for bad customer service this day in age.

it would have taken him 30 seconds to fire an e-mail to you explaining the situation. handled correctly, this could have been a good (+) for him, now he just looks like some jerk building wheels in his mom's basement.
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Old 11-19-10, 07:27 AM   #20
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Pretty sure 4 extra stainless spokes and brass nipples and 4 additional stainless eyelets in the rim weighs more than 8 grams.

Either way, that's kind of bogus customer service. I'd still just ride the 36 spoke wheels and move on with my life.

Get your wheels from universalcycles.com next time. They build INCREDIBLY good quality wheels. I have several sets of handbuilt wheels from them and they always show up perfectly true and tensioned and stay that way. They have great wheelbuilders.

Another option is to go to your local QBP dealer LBS (most are) and have them go through QBP for custom wheels. I think the labor is like $35 a wheel and the builders up in MN do a helluva good job building wheels. You also have the entire range of QBP supplied products to choose from. At the shop I work weekends, we've started using QBP more and more for custom wheel builds since they're such a good deal for the customer (same price/labor as if we built them), they build a super-good wheel, and it saves our mechanics time in building wheels (we're a small shop, so getting repairs out the door on time can be stressful). Two of our mechanics are incredible wheel builders and will still build/rebuild wheels for customers on occasion though.

A couple of other options for your next wheelset.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:07 AM   #21
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Ouch, did you have to pay $70 shipping as listed on the website?
That would have me looking closer to home for a wheel builder.
It would also make me think twice about sending them back. No wonder he's trying to get out of paying return freight.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:12 AM   #22
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Either way, that's kind of bogus customer service. I'd still just ride the 36 spoke wheels and move on with my life.
...
A couple of other options for your next wheelset.
Yep its bogus and totally will just ride the 36 spokers and move on - I need wheels yesterday. For me me buying new wheels is a once in a ...well...this is the first time buying new wheels and I reckon they will still be going when I stop riding single. Kinda part of why I really had in my head exactly what I wanted.

So this is just to put the info out there - so that people who rely on searching around forums for info and reviews n stuff, like me, can take it into account alongside all the other info.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:15 AM   #23
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Ouch, did you have to pay $70 shipping as listed on the website?
That would have me looking closer to home for a wheel builder.
It would also make me think twice about sending them back. No wonder he's trying to get out of paying return freight.
With the Aussie dollar being very strong against the greenback, buying all sorts of stuff from the US is booming. So even with postage, its attactive. Again, part of the reason for me posting the info, so people can add it to their considerations. I know my LBS would charge more, but then they'd also build what I asked for.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:46 AM   #24
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OP, that sucks. That is some horrible customer service. Maybe u'll feel better knowing he just lost about 20 potential customers with this thread. And also..

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it would have taken him 30 seconds to fire an e-mail to you explaining the situation. handled correctly, this could have been a good (+) for him, now he just looks like some jerk building wheels in his mom's basement.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:56 AM   #25
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While you did get a good, strong wheel (if built properly), you didn't get exactly what you ordered so I can understand your frustration. The Origin 8 hub really isn't a big deal because it's just a rebranded Formula but getting a 36h when you ordered a 32 sucks. That dude's customer service - while he's trying to come across as Mr. Good Guy - is horrendous. You should be able to send that wheel back and have him eat the return shipping charge, as it was his mistake.

Velomine FTW.
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