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  1. #1
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    please HELP!! Bottom braket for Schwinn Madison??

    Hey guys i couldnt find any bottom bracket information for my 08 Schwinn Madison

    I want to buy a crankset that requires a ISO taper BB spindle

    will it fit?? Thanks in advance guys

  2. #2
    Blaster of Reality Scrodzilla's Avatar
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    Any 68mm English-threaded BB will fit your frame. Spindle length will depend on what crankset you plan on using.

  3. #3
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    well, I was hoping to buy a Paul Components Royal Flush track crankset, but im looking at their website and it says it only fits an iso
    " We designed our cranks around Campagnolo 111mm width spindles, so that's what you should use"
    so im guessing its not going to fit?

  4. #4
    u________u jessesv's Avatar
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    if that's what they recommend, then just buy a campy veloce..

    http://store.citygrounds.com/store/p...-68x111mm-ISO/

  5. #5
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    WHOA!! wait a minute...so what does iso mean? i thought it was a certain size for BB's Thanks for the link btw

  6. #6
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    my friend just told me he could give me a Campy Chorus 115.5mm spindle, 78mm shell, english thread would that fit?

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    With a BB, there's two things for fit. One is will it physically fit in your frame (English (68) or Italian (70) for most stuff), the other is will it match the crankset (Spindle length, plus ISO vs. JIS). The information from Paul is only talking about the latter part. ISO refers to the fit-to-crank as well.

    For example, here's two Veloce BB's. This one would fit, while this one would not. They have the exact same fit-to-crank, but different fit-to-bike.

    The other low-cost option is Miche.
    I have a front brake, but I only use it for slowing or stopping.

  8. #8
    Blaster of Reality Scrodzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwdxbassist View Post
    my friend just told me he could give me a Campy Chorus 115.5mm spindle, 78mm shell, english thread would that fit?
    No.

    You have a 68mm shell and if that particular crankset calls for a 111mm ISO spindle, that's what you should use.

  9. #9
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    Thanks jesse, scrod and zacked

    that last message from zacked really helped clear things up on BB's i now have a better understanding on them, thanks guys i will be buying the paul crankset and probably the miche BB.

  10. #10
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    Dura Ace (shimano) = JIS
    Campy / Sugino 75 = ISO

  11. #11
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    Shimano, Suntour, SR and similar brands are most likely JIS; ISO is more of an European sort of thing, like Campagolo, Miche, TA. However, Japanese Keirin cranks such as Sugino 75, Suntour Superbe Pro, Dura Ace 7600...etc etc, require an ISO bottom bracket.

  12. #12
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    Edit: Dura Ace 7600 = specifically, shimano dura-ace 109mm sealed njs bottom bracket

    However there is a lot of grey area here. I would personally go with JIS short taper.
    Last edited by macnab; 03-16-11 at 01:10 PM.

  13. #13
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    Link?

    I'm pretty sure the last time I checked that all NJS cranks are ISO.

    Velobase says it is JIS while online retailers say it is ISO.

  14. #14
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    Actually I have been heads-down in BB-land for the last few days. Gone through a bunch of links, some with better credentials than others. I will pull a few.

  15. #15
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    BB-land.

    I am sorry if I sound like I'm being a dick but I just want to know things about things and things that I'm wrong about.


  16. #16
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bbsize.html

    ISO vs J.I.S. Standard

    Martin Trautmann posted on rec.bicycles.tech: L_right = 18 +0.5/-0 mm
    L_left = 16 +0.5/-0 mm
    Dimension across flat 1.5 mm from end: 12.6 mm +0.02-0.05
    Spindle end to bolt seat: Loose: 3 mm
    Tightened: 1.5 mm min.

    Yet another source claimed that the squares of Campa, Mavic and
    Stronglight (ISO) are smaller than Shimano and Suntour (J.I.S.) with the
    result that J.I.S. cranks will move about 4.5 mm further in.

    This may conflict with the end of the square and result in a loose fit
    or braking stress. for ISO cranks on J.I.S. squares there's less contact
    area between crank and spindle, since the crank does not slip perfectly
    on the spindle. The result again is a higher risk of braking the crank.

    But assuming those 4.5 mm and 2 deg, ISO is about 0.3 mm smaller than
    J.I.S. (2 * sin 2 * 4.5 = 0.3)?
    ISO cranks (Campagnolo, Stronglight, others) won't go as far onto J.I.S. spindles as they ideally should. J.I.S. cranks (most Japanese models) may bottom out if installed on ISO spindles.
    In practice, you can very often get away with mixing these sizes, as long as you select an axle length that gives the desired chainline.
    http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-373033.html

    andre nickatina
    12-26-07, 01:34 PM

    there is, as you probably know, a shimano dura-ace 109mm sealed njs bottom bracket. they are the recommended bottom bracket for the DA 7600 series cranks. not dreadfully easy to find, but the best way to go if you can dig one up.

    that's the thing, they're tough to find and usually come w/ the crankset.


    http://picasaweb.google.com/deanlung...HEADSET7610BB#

    http://www.lfgss.com/post1154436-20806.html
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by wools
    It's Friday afternoon so I'm reigniting this *****.

    DA 7600 cranks are ISO. The 7600 and 7610 bottom brackets are ISO. Cliff from Royce says so. That means it's true.

    NJS = ISO (apart from that Octalink discrepancy that Gizmond mentioned which I know nothing about).
    I know people are fed up and bored with this topic. But as a final* word from me;

    I think I am now of the opinion that the 7600's are between ISO and JIS - apart from this being a fairly common opinion on the web (which is no real grounds for proof), when 7600's are fitted to a campag 111mm BB, you get a perfect chainline.

    If 7600's are JIS, and are supposed to be paired with a 109.5 BB, then according to Sheldons theory of mixing tapers; using an ISO 114BB would give the perfect chainline (as using and ISO BB with JIS cranks, makes the cranks sit 4.5mm further down the spindle).

    Hopefully that makes sense.


    *Hopefully.

    Personally: I understand the argument that nearly all NJS is ISO, but Shimano is the one company that managed to get Octalink NJS-certified, and thus could also be NJS-certified with a JIS square taper BB. I can't find a tech doc on Shimano's site, and nearly everything else I read is just someone's opinion.

    Edit: Still looking for links on diff between JIS and "short-taper JIS".



    The 7610 BB "looks" like Phils JIS short taper / low profile.

    -macnab
    Last edited by macnab; 03-16-11 at 01:57 PM.

  17. #17
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    ...and no, you didn't sound like a dick at all. It's clearly a confused area out there

  18. #18
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    Hey i went to my local LBS and they had an IRD or IRO? BB that would fit my frame and crankset(english thread 63mm shell 110mm splindel iso)
    should i go with the miche instead? any suggestions?

  19. #19
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    I just ordered an IRD (75) BB for my new frame. IRD is fine with me. Aluminum cups on both sides versus the un54 that has plastic on one side.

  20. #20
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    Cool, the one at my lbs felt very smooth, is $30 a good price?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by macnab View Post
    http://www.sheldonbrown.com/bbsize.html

    http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-373033.html



    http://picasaweb.google.com/deanlung...HEADSET7610BB#

    http://www.lfgss.com/post1154436-20806.html
    Personally: I understand the argument that nearly all NJS is ISO, but Shimano is the one company that managed to get Octalink NJS-certified, and thus could also be NJS-certified with a JIS square taper BB. I can't find a tech doc on Shimano's site, and nearly everything else I read is just someone's opinion.

    Edit: Still looking for links on diff between JIS and "short-taper JIS".



    The 7610 BB "looks" like Phils JIS short taper / low profile.

    -macnab
    This is extremely helpful to me. A friend of mine just bought a set of 7600 tonight and she's not sure what taper it is as well. Thanks for the links macnab!

    From this picture:


    It looks definitely like the JIS low profile taper but like you, I can find the info about their compatibility with a JIS.
    Last edited by Squirrelli; 03-17-11 at 01:57 AM.

  22. #22
    Senior Member macnab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hwdxbassist View Post
    Cool, the one at my lbs felt very smooth, is $30 a good price?
    Yep I am paying 40 at lbs (for the 75).

  23. #23
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by macnab View Post
    Yep I am paying 40 at lbs (for the 75).
    Cool, im looking forward to getting a new BB and crankset, my old BB has been feeling really weird lately, has anyone had any experience using Paul Components cranksets?

    also what kind of chain is that? on the picture? ive seen them before but i know nothing about them, are they stronger?

  24. #24
    THE STUFFED Leukybear's Avatar
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    That's a half link chain, there is not much proof that they are stronger... and paul components are overpriced for what you get IMO.

  25. #25
    Senior Member hwdxbassist's Avatar
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    i got this picture from Craigslist and I was thinking of buying the set with the chain included and pedals for $125

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