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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by IvyCap View Post
    Ha! Well I'd like to see his explanation behind his claim.
    Ignorance is not really an explanation

  2. #302
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    Quote Originally Posted by EpicSchwinn View Post
    ^this

    Here's the leader pics/discussion thread if you're interested http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...Leader-love%21


    Didn't mean to derail the thread. I'd love a SS/FG that could take me far fast. Just looking for the right place to start.
    1982 Motobecane Jubile Sport
    1997 Specialized Rockhopper

  3. #303
    Senior Member NateRod's Avatar
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    everyone knows that if your track bike doesn't have dropout plates it will EXPLODE

  4. #304
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrodzilla View Post
    I guess every other manufacturer of aluminum track frames doesn't know what they're doing.
    It's been my experience with other frames such as the specialized langster, that having polished plates on the inside of the dropouts prevents the axle from getting adequate bite and can cause the wheel to slip under heavy torque. If you only ride around flat areas, or use brakes this is probably not a big problem, but if you are skidding down steep hills you really don't want your rear wheel moving around.

  5. #305
    Just smang it. EpicSchwinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonnc80 View Post
    FWIW my Leader has single sided dropouts and even after almost 2 years they look perfectly fine. Maybe I'm doing it wrong but I think the whole double sided dropouts thing is overblown.
    I've been wondering the same thing. Anybody else with single sided dropouts and not having problems? Why not just use those dropout saver washers?

  6. #306
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  7. #307
    Veteran Bastard Scrodzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soma_Evan View Post
    It's been my experience with other frames such as the specialized langster, that having polished plates on the inside of the dropouts prevents the axle from getting adequate bite and can cause the wheel to slip under heavy torque. If you only ride around flat areas, or use brakes this is probably not a big problem, but if you are skidding down steep hills you really don't want your rear wheel moving around.
    I've never had the wheel slip on either my Kagero or my Dodici Gara, both of which have double-sided stainless inserts.

    The only time I ever had a wheel slip forward was when using a Phil Wood hub on my Leader 725 - mainly due to the Phil Wood axle hardware. I switched hubs and my wheel never slipped again. If axles aren't slipping all over the place on a steel frame, they're not going to be slipping on an aluminum frame with steel inserts.

    I've seen some bikes with single-sided dropous get chewed up pretty bad and unfortunately, not everyone knows how to properly tighten their axle nuts to prevent such damage.
    Last edited by Scrodzilla; 10-22-12 at 10:36 AM.

  8. #308
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrodzilla View Post
    I've never had the wheel slip on either my Kagero or my Dodici Gara, both of which have double-sided stainless inserts.

    The only time I ever had a wheel slip forward was when using a Phil Wood hub on my Leader 725 - mainly due to the Phil Wood axle hardware. I switched hubs and my wheel never slipped again. If axles aren't slipping all over the place on a steel frame, they're not going to be slipping on an aluminum frame with steel inserts.

    I've seen some bikes with single-sided dropous get chewed up pretty bad and unfortunately, not everyone knows how to properly tighten their axle nuts to prevent such damage.
    My FTP with it's stainless dropouts slips so much that I don't even both riding it anymore. I just push it around town with the rear wheel on my back making engine noises.


  9. #309
    Wear One IvyCap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soma_Evan View Post
    It's been my experience with other frames such as the specialized langster, that having polished plates on the inside of the dropouts prevents the axle from getting adequate bite and can cause the wheel to slip under heavy torque. If you only ride around flat areas, or use brakes this is probably not a big problem, but if you are skidding down steep hills you really don't want your rear wheel moving around.
    Who says someone can't produce the same amount of torque from a standing start, if not more(carleton)? It also solves getting chewed up dropouts like scrod said for those improperly tightening their wheels.

  10. #310
    Morton Nagrom_'s Avatar
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    My kilo, with its solid steel dropouts, has never slipped.

    ever.
    Quote Originally Posted by seau grateau View Post
    No offense but you're an idiot.
    PedalRoom

  11. #311
    Wear One IvyCap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagrom_ View Post
    My kilo, with its solid steel dropouts, has never slipped.

    ever.
    So is that for or against double sided dropout plates?

  12. #312
    Morton Nagrom_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IvyCap View Post
    So is that for or against double sided dropout plates?
    I don't think it really matters.

    I think it's just a poor argument for them. The wheel slipping? Track bikes were steel before they were anything else.

    I'd just say that it isn't necessary. The paint doesnt get chewed up on the inside, cause there isn't anything rotating. On the outside, the axle twists against the metal, messing up paint. On the inside it doesn't.

    But if you're gonna do inserts, why wouldn't you plate both sides?
    Quote Originally Posted by seau grateau View Post
    No offense but you're an idiot.
    PedalRoom

  13. #313
    Wear One IvyCap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagrom_ View Post
    I don't think it really matters.

    I think it's just a poor argument for them. The wheel slipping? Track bikes were steel before they were anything else.

    I'd just say that it isn't necessary. The paint doesnt get chewed up on the inside, cause there isn't anything rotating. On the outside, the axle twists against the metal, messing up paint. On the inside it doesn't.

    But if you're gonna do inserts, why wouldn't you plate both sides?
    True, preferences.

    Now back to Somas and Pakes




    Last edited by IvyCap; 10-22-12 at 04:42 PM.

  14. #314
    Senior Member RGNY's Avatar
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    fwiw, my Rumrunner had been flawless in performance. no frills and has taken everything i've thrown at it.

    trying to justify a French 75 for a Spring build. stable is a little crowded, but i don't currently have an aluminum/carbon trackie.......

  15. #315
    Just smang it. EpicSchwinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nagrom_ View Post
    I don't think it really matters.

    I think it's just a poor argument for them. The wheel slipping? Track bikes were steel before they were anything else.

    I'd just say that it isn't necessary. The paint doesnt get chewed up on the inside, cause there isn't anything rotating. On the outside, the axle twists against the metal, messing up paint. On the inside it doesn't.

    But if you're gonna do inserts, why wouldn't you plate both sides?
    This is just a guess, but I'm thinking stainless steel plates would be more slippery than the chromo in a steel bike's dropouts.

    Hawt.

    At 5 lbs for frame and fork though, I'm not sure why you'd pick it over a steel frameset at the same price point ($425).

  16. #316
    Veteran Bastard Scrodzilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EpicSchwinn View Post
    At 5 lbs for frame and fork though, I'm not sure why you'd pick it over a steel frameset at the same price point ($425).
    Aluminum is trendy...I mean stiffer.

  17. #317
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    Quote Originally Posted by EpicSchwinn View Post
    This is just a guess, but I'm thinking stainless steel plates would be more slippery than the chromo in a steel bike's dropouts.



    Hawt.

    At 5 lbs for frame and fork though, I'm not sure why you'd pick it over a steel frameset at the same price point ($425).
    they can be had for 325 shipped with the fork....Still not sure if its worth it.

  18. #318
    Painfully average. calv's Avatar
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    I'm sure it's worth it.
    Quote Originally Posted by ThisJauntyGent View Post
    The stories about the smell are absolutely true: straight elephant dick.
    All City Mr Pink

  19. #319
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    325 with a carbon fork is hard to argue against. Although Im a bit set on a proper steel frame for the street. Its a bit hard to see the need for aluminum when its just stiffffffffffff.

  20. #320
    Wear One IvyCap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crandrew View Post
    325 with a carbon fork is hard to argue against. Although Im a bit set on a proper steel frame for the street. Its a bit hard to see the need for aluminum when its just stiffffffffffff.
    Can't have that premium rush without carbon and aluminum bro.

  21. #321
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    Quote Originally Posted by IvyCap View Post
    Can't have that premium rush without carbon and aluminum bro.
    Bingo!

  22. #322
    Just smang it. EpicSchwinn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crandrew View Post
    325 with a carbon fork is hard to argue against. Although Im a bit set on a proper steel frame for the street. Its a bit hard to see the need for aluminum when its just stiffffffffffff.
    There definitely aren't a ton of competitors in the sub $400 aluminum/carbon frameset category. Closest thing to that I can think of is a Leader 721 or a ViSP but neither of those include a carbon fork.

  23. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by EpicSchwinn View Post
    There definitely aren't a ton of competitors in the sub $400 aluminum/carbon frameset category. Closest thing to that I can think of is a Leader 721 or a ViSP but neither of those include a carbon fork.
    http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...49_-1___202389
    http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...79_-1___202441


  24. #324
    Wear One IvyCap's Avatar
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    dirty and nekkid, just how I like it. I wish there was more info on the frame geo though

    edit: nvm I found the geo chart
    Last edited by IvyCap; 10-23-12 at 11:45 PM.

  25. #325
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    Quote Originally Posted by IvyCap View Post
    dirty and nekkid, just how I like it. I wish there was more info on the frame geo though

    edit: nvm I found the geo chart

    Yeah, the geo is a bit weird on them - tall seat tubes and short top tubes.

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