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  1. #1
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Broken Wheel...Need Sympathy

    re: Mavic CXP33 rims, Ultegra 10-speed 32-hole hubs

    Okay...after having a terrible late Nov/early Dec due to colds, broken light system, family vacation, etc..., I was finally getting my act together and making progress. Even took part in the Holiday Bloat ride (doing well for what I was expecting).

    Well, on the descent from Baldy, I noticed that my spokes were making noise. No big deal, they've been doing that almost since I got them, but nothing major out of true on the wheel. Or so I thought. Got done, went home, put bike away. Rested Sunday.

    Then, I go to get ready for a ride today, and pull the bike out to re-true wobbles from the noisy spokes. That's when I find spoke pull-through on two different spokes!



    At this point, I do not have a spare wheel. So, it looks like I'll be waiting a bit. After Christmas...no money. In debt (of course).

    So, I need to contact the LBS. Of course, they're all closed on New Year's Day. Here's the wheel's history: bought complete bike & wheels at Shop X. Didn't like the rear wheel, it was coming out of true almost every ride, rubbing on the brake pads--it had been built up with 14/15ga. spokes, single-cross pattern. I'm a heavier guy. Shop X is 2 hours away from me, so I take the rear wheel to my local shop, Shop Z. Had them re-build with 14ga. straight spokes in 3-cross pattern. Better. Still un-truing alot, making alot of noise, non-drive side spokes coming loose. One spoke nipple was actually coming unscrewed. Took back to shop. They slapped on some more nipple-prep and trued them up. Seemed better. Still making noise and a little wobble, but nothing loose at this point. I can at least live with that. Then, this happens.

    Which shop do I contact? Is it possible it was a defective rim, thus explaining all the trouble keeping them true? Hmmmmm :: ponder :: Here's what I'm thinking: drop the wheel off at Shop Z (who re-built the wheel) and see what they can do. I don't know if they deal with Mavic. I should at least be able to get a loaner (did before while he was building this wheel).

  2. #2
    Powered by Borscht ovoleg's Avatar
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    that sux, is this the front or rear wheel?

  3. #3
    Embracing the fredness herbm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkadam68
    re: Mavic CXP33 rims, Ultegra 10-speed 32-hole hubs

    Okay...after having a terrible late Nov/early Dec due to colds, broken light system, family vacation, etc..., I was finally getting my act together and making progress. Even took part in the Holiday Bloat ride (doing well for what I was expecting).

    Well, on the descent from Baldy, I noticed that my spokes were making noise. No big deal, they've been doing that almost since I got them, but nothing major out of true on the wheel. Or so I thought. Got done, went home, put bike away. Rested Sunday.

    Then, I go to get ready for a ride today, and pull the bike out to re-true wobbles from the noisy spokes. That's when I find spoke pull-through on two different spokes!



    At this point, I do not have a spare wheel. So, it looks like I'll be waiting a bit. After Christmas...no money. In debt (of course).

    So, I need to contact the LBS. Of course, they're all closed on New Year's Day. Here's the wheel's history: bought complete bike & wheels at Shop X. Didn't like the rear wheel, it was coming out of true almost every ride, rubbing on the brake pads--it had been built up with 14/15ga. spokes, single-cross pattern. I'm a heavier guy. Shop X is 2 hours away from me, so I take the rear wheel to my local shop, Shop Z. Had them re-build with 14ga. straight spokes in 3-cross pattern. Better. Still un-truing alot, making alot of noise, non-drive side spokes coming loose. One spoke nipple was actually coming unscrewed. Took back to shop. They slapped on some more nipple-prep and trued them up. Seemed better. Still making noise and a little wobble, but nothing loose at this point. I can at least live with that. Then, this happens.

    Which shop do I contact? Is it possible it was a defective rim, thus explaining all the trouble keeping them true? Hmmmmm :: ponder :: Here's what I'm thinking: drop the wheel off at Shop Z (who re-built the wheel) and see what they can do. I don't know if they deal with Mavic. I should at least be able to get a loaner (did before while he was building this wheel).

    Sorry to hear that Mark...that looks very similar to the problems Markaj and I had with our Bontrager wheels...Hope you get it fixed soon!

  4. #4
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ovoleg
    that sux, is this the front or rear wheel?
    Rear. Front is actually still the original, 14/15 butted spokes in 1-cross pattern. They're holding up fine.

  5. #5
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    I went thru the same thing till I started building my own wheels. One thing I gave up was trying any kind of "saving weight" fators. I build my wheels with Velocity Deep V's. On the rear anyway. Rim si 520 grams alone. I have heavy buds that have used cxp33 and had problems even with the 367 hole. I say go cxp30 or Deep V (30 mm high profile rims).

    I used 32 spoke hubs. After 8-9,000 miles, haven't had any problems.

    One thing that I noticed is that when you take a wheel back to a shop, they will true it BUT, it needs to be retensioned after a few hundred miles. Excuse me for this but most shops won't take the time to do it . Yeah, they true your whell to make it straight, but ask them if they retensioned it, probably not!

    The reason your wheel makes noise is cause the spokes are not tensioned and allowed to move around and rattle/ping/swuak/whatever. I've met several riders that experience breakage after retruing. Yeah, it's stright, but not tight.

    I built one set of wheels without any prep as a test. I retensioned after 300 miles. Been 8-9,000 and not even out of true. I read Sheldon Brown's site. He says don't even really need it if a wheel is byilt properly becasue of the exact spec of new spokes now adays.

    Another thing is that when I built them, I payed attention to the lead and trailing spoke directions.

    The trailing spokes should be laced on the inside of the flange for reinforcemnt of the spokes. Leading spkes don't get as much torque, so not as important. SOme might think nonsense, but it has worked for me.

    I had a Deep V bilt at a high end store, payed the fool $100 to build it. It rattled after 20 miles. Had to turn back. Spokes were so loose, and he left scrap metal inside the rim locked in by the rim tape. I took it back and he told me, "some wheels make noise, supposed to be that way".

    That was whn I started building my own. I tore down and reassembeld the wheel using the same parts, No problems since,not a sound!

    The wheel on my Canni, I paid $25 for the Deep V on a clearance rack. DA hub ($99), and $20 for 32 14 g spokes. Has about 6,000 miles, no problems. Cheaper to build your won andyou know they will get the TLC needed!

  6. #6
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    I did have a problem with Mavic OP's. I had 3 rims built by 3 different guys. One guy did tell me that Mavic has had issues with heat treating. He's the dude that suggested Velocity. He was correct.

  7. #7
    Senior Member big john's Avatar
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    Beanz is right, Mark. It's important to spend a lot of time and care on the build for a Clyde wheel. If you aren't going to do it yourself, find someone who will. I found 2 guys who can build a great wheel for me after having wheel problems for years. I use 36 spoke OPs on Ultegra hubs.

  8. #8
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Thanx John & Beanz...I might just undertake building the wheels myself from now on. I'll take the bad wheel into the shop and see what happens. I have even built a wheel once before (once) and hadn't done one since, so my skills are rusty. But, maybe it's time to try again. (Shopping list: truing stand, spoke tensiometer, & spoke prep.)

    In the meantime, looks like I'll ride my back-up bike (1990 C-dale Black Lightning). I had set it up for my 17-year old son, and so the geometry was all different. But I just set it back up for me. It also only runs a 6-speed freewheel with friction shifters. The spacing (126mm) was different so I couldn't swap the wheels.

  9. #9
    Senior Member big john's Avatar
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    Have you seen the book "The Bicycle Wheel" by Jobst Brandt? Easy step by step building there. I tried it, not for me, I'll pay someone to do mine.
    BTW, congratulations on a great ride Saturday. You, too, Beanz.

  10. #10
    Senior Member 1265 Lombardi's Avatar
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    Too bad you dont live by me. I have a CXP33/ultegra setup just sitting in the garage, which I wouldve let you borrow till you get your wheel fixed. Sorry about your wheel. I hate wheel problems because I cant fix them right then and there.
    Joshua.

  11. #11
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    My thoughts are sometimes you have to forget about the lite fast stuff. I'd rather enjoy my time riding and taking pix rather than repairing wheels. Take a look at the BIG BEEFY wheels I used on GMR. It was a training ride for me. If I were to race ,yeah, I'd want something lighter. But just riding trying to get back into shape for this heavy guy!

    Thanx John! One of these days, I'm gonna be in the front with you guys, though!

    That darn Sonny is even better than Vanna White sometimes!Bwahahaha!


    BIG BEEFY BACKWHEEL!


    BIG BEEFY FRONT WHEEL!

  12. #12
    Embracing the fredness herbm's Avatar
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    Thats good Mr B....
    I had a good time hanging with Sonny waiting for everyone come back...That boy can talk!

  13. #13
    Senior Member big john's Avatar
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    Sonny is a trip! Fun guy to ride with, even with the cigarette in his ear.

  14. #14
    Embracing the fredness herbm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by big john
    Sonny is a trip! Fun guy to ride with, even with the cigarette in his ear.

    Yeah..I cant believe he can smoke and ride so well...
    BTW..it was great to meet you!!

  15. #15
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by big john
    Sonny is a trip! Fun guy to ride with, even with the cigarette in his ear.
    Yeah, the guy talks but doesn't get tired! When we run into an arrogant rider on the trail, I get in front and push the pace while Sonny rides along side the guy and makes him play 20 questions. Usually the guy will drop after a few topics!...just kidding!...no I'm not!

    Yesterday's 42 mile ride on SART. I still wonder what Sonny was asking the guy!

    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 01-01-07 at 05:24 PM.

  16. #16
    no more nellie
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    Quote Originally Posted by big john
    Sonny is a trip! Fun guy to ride with, even with the cigarette in his ear.
    Which one was Sonny? What's his handle or was he the guy who jumped in and joined on his own who said he hadn't ridden up Baldy since he was 21? He was really nice and funny.

    Oh, and sorry about your wheel, Mark. I've had issues with spokes in the past, but not since I got my new bike and I'm not sure why. Hope you get it fixed soon!

  17. #17
    no more nellie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz
    Yesterday's 42 mile ride on SART. I still wonder what Sonny was asking the guy!

    Oh, you just answered it for me. That was Sonny. I saw him at he end. He's a hoot!

  18. #18
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz
    My thoughts are sometimes you have to forget about the lite fast stuff. I'd rather enjoy my time riding and taking pix rather than repairing wheels. Take a look at the BIG BEEFY wheels I used on GMR. It was a training ride for me. If I were to race ,yeah, I'd want something lighter. But just riding trying to get back into shape for this heavy guy!
    Well...that's what I was looking for when I got the bike. I thought the Mavic CXP33s were big and beefy.

    I just took my old bike for a spin......I can't believe I actually rode that! Way too small!! And it doesn't help that the shorter stem for my son is still on it! I hope tomorrow I can get a loaner wheel from the shop.

  19. #19
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=mkadam68]Well...that's what I was looking for when I got the bike. I thought the Mavic CXP33s were big and beefy.
    QUOTE]


    I use a cxp33 on the front of my Canni for a lil bit of weight savings. It's fine, but for the back, you need Big. Heck, I think you got me by 40lbs if I remember correctly,prolly 30 of it in your calf muscle!. I have Deep V in the front of my Lemond with only 28 ( was the only hub I had when I made it) and I feel a big difference from the cxp33 when I stand to crank.

    Bontrager 20 spokes? Heck, when I cranked down on my bike, I could feel the wheel flex, even hear the magnet hit the sensor. I had to back the wheels sensor way back. I wouldn't even consider less than a cxp33 for the front and nothing less than the V for the back. A lil heavier but last year at 20 lbs less, I don't think the wheel was slowing me down. This year, it's been Ben and Jerry slowing me down!

    I know BigJohn is a clyde, but maybe his weight is distributed differently. He's a real tall lanky guy. I think you and I are more the compact types. Our weight hits like a ton of lead!

  20. #20
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by merider1

    Oh, and sorry about your wheel, Mark. I've had issues with spokes in the past, but not since I got my new bike and I'm not sure why. Hope you get it fixed soon!

    I thought his name was ADAM?

  21. #21
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz
    I thought his name was ADAM?
    Middle name is adam. Unless you're thinking of awhiner?

  22. #22
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkadam68
    Middle name is adam. Unless you're thinking of awhiner?
    Yi're the big dude in red kicking butt on GMR, went down Baldy rd?

  23. #23
    Powered by Borscht ovoleg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mkadam68
    Rear. Front is actually still the original, 14/15 butted spokes in 1-cross pattern. They're holding up fine.
    what kind of cassettes is your rear wheel support?

  24. #24
    Senior Member GP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by big john
    Sonny is a trip! Fun guy to ride with, even with the cigarette in his ear.
    He blew by me Saturday.

  25. #25
    Senior Member mkadam68's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz
    Yi're the big dude in red kicking butt on GMR, went down Baldy rd?
    Yep...that'd be me. Although kicking butt is pretty strong language.

    Quote Originally Posted by ovoleg
    what kind of cassettes is your rear wheel support?
    I'm running a 12/25 rear and 53/39 front.

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