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Old 11-10-07, 12:24 PM   #1
xcontext
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Group Etiquette

Not about etiquette within the group -- plenty of posts on the forums about that -- but about the group sharing the road with others. I just got back from my Saturday morning solo ride. A was almost home (Laguna Hills) when I was passed by a group of rodies. They were very quiet and none of them anounced they are comming on my left (I was not listening to i-pod BTW). I found myself pushed to the curb with many riders passing just inches of me. As the group passed a girl on the back of a tandem even gave me a look. If they behave like this on the road all the time and to cars as well I am worried they are creating only more bike hating drivers. I understand this is O.C. but I was not on a cheap bike, or a mountain bike, or a hybrid. Only differences were that I was alone and not dressed like a canary. They were going much faster than me leading me to believe they were much stronger riders--having much more road time. Therefore I am inclined to conclude that the behavior was not ignorance (which I would understand), but arogance. Opinions?
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Old 11-10-07, 12:39 PM   #2
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It's usually the lead rider's responsibility to call out to the pack of any potential hazzards up ahead and create enough room, whether they be a slower rider or riders, a parked vehicle, or whatever. As a solo rider you should be able to hear them approaching. But often times, they simply signal these hazzards among themselves so you may not hear them at all. Well, that's just been my experience as a solo rider who's been swarmed by 200+ riders zipping by at 30mph+....but I could always hear the roar a few seconds as they approach so that always gives me a little heads up. Most times, I think their buzzing very close is unintentional especially when it's a large peloton. I don't think it has anything to do with arrogance on their part, but I agree, a little extra room between you and them would be nice.

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Old 11-10-07, 02:03 PM   #3
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Just because they were stronger than you, it doesn't mean they know what they're doing. Unless you were doing something really dumb, I can't imagine an excuse for them acting like that. A lot of times, riders will pass and not leave you much room. Thats normal, just hold your line and don't let them push you over. They're not gonna bump you. As for the dirty look, I would have called her out on it.

99% of cyclists are total ******** freds. The ones who are really slow and the ones who are really fast tend to be the coolest ones. The ones who are stuck in the middle and feel like they have something to prove are the biggest a**holes. I can't even begin to tell you how many people I see who, judging by their attitude/kit/bike should be ultra-fit and super strong, but suck. The fact that there was a tandem in their paceline says enough about the group for me.

Look at the Rosebowl ride (or any faster group ride); spend some time at the front (where people are actualy working) and everyone is pretty cool. Fall to the back and it's a bunch of pretentious jerkoffs (who can't ride for sh*t) I remember one time, after a long pull on the front, I peeled off and fell to the back of the pack. Now, we weren't flying, but 27 or 28mph on the uphill side is a good pace, especialy when you're at the front doing the work. I was at the back reocovering and there were some idiots saying "Pshh, this ride is going slow today." I told them "Oh really? Maybe you should get to the front and do some work rather than sit in the slipstream of 150 other riders. I'm sure you could help pick up the pace a bit, right?"

So, all in all, who cares? Let these idiots do what they're gonna do. If their only glory in life is trying to look fast and intimidate other riders while in a sad paceline around Laguna, let them be. Theres nothing better than watching people like that get their legs torn off when they actualy try and ride with good riders.

Keep having fun. Don't let the wannabe heros push you down.
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Old 11-10-07, 02:11 PM   #4
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Oh, by the way. I'm neither fast nor slow, so I really probably don't have room to talk. I am, however, nice to every single person I see on a bike. Regardless of our goals, reasons for riding and differences, we're all on two wheels sharing the same roads, and every person on a bike is one less car on the road. We can all get along if we want to.
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Old 11-10-07, 02:19 PM   #5
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Welcome to the forum...

What's your name again?
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Old 11-10-07, 05:11 PM   #6
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[QUOTE=Enzo Gucci;5610108]
99% of cyclists are total ******** freds. The ones who are really slow and the ones who are really fast tend to be the coolest ones. The ones who are stuck in the middle and feel like they have something to prove are the biggest a**holes. I can't even begin to tell you how many people I see who, judging by their attitude/kit/bike should be ultra-fit and super strong, but suck. The fact that there was a tandem in their paceline says enough about the group for me.


QUOTE]

Excellent! Thanks Enzo!!!
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Old 11-10-07, 06:13 PM   #7
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Thanks for the kind replies. I was p'd off before but I feel better now. Alicestrong: thanks and Michael. I live in O.C. I commute (or at least make the best attempt to) on a bike 3 days out of the week and my road bike as time permits on weekends.
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Old 11-10-07, 06:28 PM   #8
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Thanks for the kind replies. I was p'd off before but I feel better now. Alicestrong: thanks and Michael. I live in O.C. I commute (or at least make the best attempt to) on a bike 3 days out of the week and my road bike as time permits on weekends.
Honestly.. agree with you...I would be PO'd as well...
I always try to announce myself with enough time as to not startle the rider...

I have had this happen to me..last week in fact up in Summerland...a large group came up fast on my small group...never announced themselves....
I do wear a mirror on my glasses so I did have some warning and was able to warn my group...but they passed very close, and very fast...I could see that freaking out some less experienced riders!
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Old 11-10-07, 08:06 PM   #9
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Honestly.. agree with you...I would be PO'd as well...
I always try to announce myself with enough time as to not startle the rider...

I have had this happen to me..last week in fact up in Summerland...a large group came up fast on my small group...never announced themselves....
I do wear a mirror on my glasses so I did have some warning and was able to warn my group...but they passed very close, and very fast...I could see that freaking out some less experienced riders!
I don't mind people passing close. I'd rather them brush a shoulder with me than get hit by a car... it's the dirty look from someone in the group that would have gotten me pissed off.
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Old 11-10-07, 08:38 PM   #10
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I don't mind people passing close. I'd rather them brush a shoulder with me than get hit by a car... it's the dirty look from someone in the group that would have gotten me pissed off.
It doesnt bother me if I know they're there....but yeah a dirty look would would have really PO'd me....this group was just gabbing and stuff...
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Old 11-10-07, 09:03 PM   #11
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I've had the same thing happen.
The difference is I'll say Hi to quite a few in the group, generally to just be ignored.

OTOH, many times I've had some slow up and start to chat.

It's their loss if they can't bother to be friendly.
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Old 11-11-07, 12:09 AM   #12
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Aww Man! I'm between fast and slow so I guess I'm and 'F-Fred Head'!...I do always nod or peace sign other riders. I get ignored fairly often but then again, I'm like Drew, funny looking!
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Old 11-11-07, 12:23 AM   #13
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It seems that it is no longer the norm in OC to call out "On your left" or some similar warning. In all honesty I tend not to do it either as more often than not I find that the person I am over-taking looks over his shoulder and drifts left. I typically say "Good Morning" or "How's it going?" when I get up along side of people. But that's just me.

I'm currently doing all base miles right now which means I am riding VERY slowly. Most people don't say anything when they pass me and it really doesn't bother me. On the other hand, I was riding with my buddy last week and it was really pissing him off. He was actually calling out, "How 'bout an 'On your left' next time?"

I guess everyone is different.
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Old 11-11-07, 12:57 AM   #14
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They're jerks, and if they started passing me that close, the people still behind me would see an elbow moving out to my side to create a buffer zone. Anyone who races knows what that's for and how it can be used, so I rarely have a problem after that.

I don't know about OC, but her in LA County most groups will at least give a warning call and a nod, maybe a "good morning/afernoon". That includes i.martin, LaGrange, and Amgen riders. I don't know what bug crawled up those guys' @$$es for them to treat another roadie like that.

I have had that situation happen at the Rose Bowl before. I was doing a solo ride which included 3 laps around the bowl holding a steady pace. On my last lap, I encountered the "pelaton" going 8 mph up the west end taking the whole lane. I waited for the dotted line and passed them at my desired pace. Of course, they picked up the pace and were then passing me going around the north-east corner. The first few people gave me my lane, but the last three guys almost crossed my front wheel with their rears and I was on the white line. The third of those guys got my elbow inches from his but it was too late for him to correct his line anyway.
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Old 11-11-07, 01:13 AM   #15
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"Well, that's just been my experience as a solo rider who's been swarmed by 200+ riders zipping by at 30mph+..."
Yowza! You guys get some BIG group rides out there!
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Old 11-11-07, 01:15 AM   #16
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Yowza! You guys get some BIG group rides out there!
The Simi ride is similar.
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Old 11-11-07, 01:45 AM   #17
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Getting buzzed/getting passed too close for comfort bothers me the most. Some groups almost force you to just stop or detour to the sidewalk for safety reasons rather than risk getting into a pileup. Seem some get freaked out and start weaving because there is a natural tendency to remove your left hand from the bike if someone(s) is passing too close. Everybody has a different comfort zone.

Some groups don't bother to say anything since they feel it breaks their concentration/speed/breathing rhythm. Personally, I added a bell to warn other cyclists I'm passing. Find its more humorous for them to hear an old school bell and puts a smile in their faces...lol...but a bell is a norm for most of the world and there's no language problems/misunderstandings about your intent or why you rang your bell and most will move to the right to give you even more room without thinking about it.
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Old 11-11-07, 10:16 AM   #18
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It's varies alot, but the more riders who wear headphones/earphones the worse it gets when passing. That doesn't justify idiotic riding, of course, but it may be necessary to ride more aggressively if the passee can't hear you to move over.

I use "on your left" all the time, but now I won't bother if the "passee" has them in. It's a waste of time. I just assume they won't hear me, and move around/past them as safely as I can.
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Old 11-11-07, 10:30 AM   #19
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I think one of the problems is when you ride in groups frequently with people right up against you that you forget that most riders don't feel comfortable with people passing that close.

It's not wise, though, overtaking a rider that close as you never know how they're going to react if they're startled, and can easily swerve into your group and hurt you as well as themselves.

However, I hate to say this but with some riders I don't announce when I'm overtaking them as I've had a lot, and I mean A LOT, get startled when I say "On Your Left" and immediately swerve in front of me. I do give a wide berth when passing, though, and if that means I ride behind them for a while if I can't pass them with a few feet of clearance. If I am going to announce, I'm usually a good distance back so that I can see how they react and brake accordingly if they freak.

I rarely get passed by someone that I don't see coming, though, so it doesn't bother me if they are silent.
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Old 11-11-07, 10:49 AM   #20
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This is where a mirror comes in handy. Wobble a little bit before they get to you a few times, they'll give you more room. Otherwise, show them an elbow.
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Old 11-11-07, 06:38 PM   #21
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Wobble a little bit before they get to you a few times,
I like that idea.
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Old 11-11-07, 09:22 PM   #22
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The fact that there was a tandem in their paceline says enough about the group for me.
please explain your work
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Old 11-11-07, 10:06 PM   #23
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Great comment Enzo. I'm with you; say 'hi' and wave to another cyclist regardless of the kind of rider he/she is, or what kind of bike they ride. I ride both an mtb and a road. Can't tell you how many times I've got a dirty look from a roadie while riding my mtb on the road (regardless of the fact I'm usually heading to the trailhead)...what's up with that? isn't an mtb on the road better than a full size SUV passing you by with an inch or two of room?
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Old 11-11-07, 10:13 PM   #24
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Oh, by the way. I'm neither fast nor slow, so I really probably don't have room to talk. I am, however, nice to every single person I see on a bike. Regardless of our goals, reasons for riding and differences, we're all on two wheels sharing the same roads, and every person on a bike is one less car on the road. We can all get along if we want to.
Hey Enzo,

Hard to tell 'cause it's kinda small, but is that Team Bearclaw kit in your avatar?

Might I have seen you out at Veteran's park today at the mid-season CX race? That was an awesome course. I've only done 3 CX races so far (Urban CX #1, Dam Cross, today's race), but that was my favorite course so far.

Lotsa Bearclaw guys out there kickin' butt.

Me, not so much butt-kicking. Mid pack in the 3-4s today. Guess that makes me neither fast nor slow as well. I was one of the guys that stacked up behind the dude who went down in the first corner. What a way to start a race. Poor guy. I'd probably feel even worse for him if he hadn't gone down in front of *me* .
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Old 11-11-07, 10:41 PM   #25
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Only differences were that I was alone and not dressed like a canary.
I think you have a bug up your butt. Dressed like a canary? Whatever...
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