ElRey

I'm not married at all. Not right now, anyway. And this has what to do with letting someone boss you around? I don't let other men push me around, either. I expect some sort of equality in a relationship and will stand up for it. What that means depends on the relationship. I sure wouldn't pedal someone around all day to get browbeat. If that's your idea of a relationship, or even a bike ride, you can have my entire share of it. If that's the norm on this forum, you won't have to put up with me for long: I'll figure that out and move on. forum- "a medium of open discussion..."

DaveB1234

I just had a chance to read this article. Bill makes a lot of assumptions. While it's okay for him to express his viewpoint, it frustrates me that people are so caught up in the 'right way' to do things. His method may be more applicable to bikes with more than two riders as it could be more difficult to coordinate multiple people putting their foot down.

Does it really matter if a stoker stays clipped or unclipped? IMO, no it does not matter – to me communication is more important.

ElRey

HOw do I change my forum moniker to Spartacus?

TandemGeek

The reason for asking is, couples who are in long term relationships (or who are nurturing a potential long term relationship) regardless of the mix tend to approach tandeming and how they interact with their stokers differently than folks who are not. That you are not in a marital situation at the present time does not diminish your commentary, but it does help to put it into perspective.

TandemGeek

Send a PM to Joe Gardner, the guy who runs the forum.

TandemGeek

Bill always makes lots of assumptions, many of which are wrong. Bill also believes he is always right and everyone else in the business is usually wrong and his writings clearly convey that point. Many of us take him to task when he crosses the line, but it’s pointless… after all, despite what we think about the way he thinks and expresses himself he’s done more to promote tandem cycling, sold more tandems than anyone else I know, and has made a comfortable living doing something he loves for nearly 30 years.

As for “the proper method” and his rules of tandeming, they are what they are… suggestions designed to help folks who are new to tandems get off to a good start. If you strip away the presumptions and look at the core message or techniques, they are sound. Can you succeed without heeding his suggestions? Most likely… But, if you attend a rally with a couple hundred tandems don’t be surprised at the start when you find that 9 out of 10 tandem teams have stokers who don’t have a foot on the ground, many of whom have never read “The Proper Method”. It's simply a "technique" that works well for most teams.

ElRey

based on this thread, I'm assuming Joe Gardner's stoker runs the forum?

galen_52657

I will just chime in here...

The OP's stoker may never like any type of pedal system that restrains her feet. It may have nothing to do with which type of system she tries - old style toe clips and straps, 'power straps' or any of the multitude of available clip-in systems.

She may be one of those people who's parents would not let her play on the jungle gym by herself without a crash helmet, mouth guard, elbow and knee pads....

ElRey

Mr TandemGeek, if you choose to delude yourself into perpetuating a one-way "she's always right" interaction with your wife, whether on the bike or no, it's of no consequence to me. Just don't assert that it's a reasonable approach. If you wish to change, I suggest that the next time you're being browbeat from the back seat you pull over and let her walk home. If you pass a nice looking lady while getting there yourself, take a detour. Smell the roses, not the fertilizer.

galen_52657

May I respectfully suggest that we keep personal relationships off limits**********

TandemGeek

Interesting sentiment, albeit misdirected. If you re-read this thread you'll find that I do not advocate the "stoker's always right" to which you refer. In fact, here is my response....

ElRey

DOn't worry, he's mad because I posted "Cycling is full of local yokels who run their mouthes in the small pond but never get it together to get out into the deep water" in another thread....

PaMTBRider

Okay.... Back to the original question. I have tried several pedal systems to include Look, SPD, Speedplay Frogs, Time ATACs... For me I keep ending up going back to good old SPD pedals and cleats. I am currently using spd on all my single street and mountain bikes as well as our tandem. The one thing I reccomend to people starting out with clipless pedals, especially for mountain biking, is to use the Shimano sh-55 multi-release cleat as opposed to the standard sh-51 that comes stock with the pedals. This cleats allows you to release much easier without turning your foot outward as far. I have never had any issues on the street but during technical singletrack it is a big confidence boost to know you can get your foot off the pedal quickly if you need to.

galen_52657

I have Crank Bros. Candies on the tandem for me. She has SPD road knockoffs that came with the tandem (second set of pedals went on her single).

Candies are easy in, out and walking.

I use LOOK racing pedals/cleats and SIDI racing shoes on road single, toe clips and straps (OMG!!!) on mountain bike - with a set of soccer cleats with the middle cleats sawed off the shoes...

Ritterview

Insightful you are.

Ritterview

Now...the rest of the story on this old thread. We tried Speedplay's but they were not sufficiently easy to clip out of. We ultimately arrived at Crank Brothers Smarty's, which she loves. As a bonus, the cleats are great to walk on. I'd recommend these to anyone with a terrified stoker.

Skipper

Stoker and I both use Shimano M324 pedals. Stoker only unclips to dismount. That's the way we have done it from the start, two years ago.

Michel Gagnon

Like others, I am not sure I agree with everything Bill McCready (Santana) says, but keeping the tandem fairly upright at stops and even when we are ready to dismount is indeed a very good idea. And with children, keeping the child clipped in at stops and traffic lights works very well. Now that we have trained that way, we continue to ride that way, even with my oldest who will turn 13 shortly.

However, looking where you come from, I would suggest you do it in stages.

1. Use your favourite clipless pedals in front, but let her keep her flat pedals for a while. However, suggest to her that she keeps both feet on the pedals at intersections. It should not take too long to master that habit, and you'll know right away if you tilt the bike at stops (it will feel unstable). On the other hand, if you keep the bike truly upright, the fear of falling will disappear very quickly.

2. Install her favourite clipless pedals, set tension low, and go on the bike. However, stay upright near a fence, car, etc. Let her practise unclipping with either or both feet until she feels comfortable.

Ritterview

^As I noted in Post #41, ultimately we solved this problem with the Crank Brothers Smarty Pedals.

I was at Sea Otter this weekend, and my stoker and I stepped up to the Crank Brothers booth. We told the rep of our experience with clipless terror, and how after a lot of trying we found that their egg beater type system was the answer.

I noted to the rep that there are a lot of recreational cyclists still on flat pedals, and that the really easy ingress/egress of their pedals is a marketing opportunity for a transitional pedal for those apprehensive about making the jump to clipless. Maybe they could have a flat on one side, a egg beater clip on the other. No, they are dropping any road cycling pedals to emphasize mountain biking, and the person I spoke with didn't see that there were any numbers in that market. Geez, what do I know? I guess the numbers of gnarly hard core mountain bikers must dwarf the numbers of very casual cyclists ambling about on flat pedals who have clipless dread. I certainly see a lot of such cyclists, but I guess eyes can be deceiving.