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  1. #1
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    need new rims help

    hello we have a santana rio tandem with 26" wheels...shimano tandem hubs 40h ,wheels smith spokes , mavic 217 rims...these wheels are original equiptment ... heres my delema while riding today my stoker heard something pop...then i noticed when i applied the rear brakes the brakes seem to pulsate so we stopped to investigate...well to our supprise the rear rim had cracked causing a big bulge on the surface of the rim where the pad touches when brake is applied....the tire bead remained in place....now heres my question...can anyone recomment a high quality rim that will last and not wear out......oh we ride only road some dirt paths we also go loaded touring...any help thanks we need to get on the road soon....

    jim

  2. #2
    The Rabbi seely's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim thompson
    hello we have a santana rio tandem with 26" wheels...shimano tandem hubs 40h ,wheels smith spokes , mavic 217 rims...these wheels are original equiptment ... heres my delema while riding today my stoker heard something pop...then i noticed when i applied the rear brakes the brakes seem to pulsate so we stopped to investigate...well to our supprise the rear rim had cracked causing a big bulge on the surface of the rim where the pad touches when brake is applied....the tire bead remained in place....now heres my question...can anyone recomment a high quality rim that will last and not wear out......oh we ride only road some dirt paths we also go loaded touring...any help thanks we need to get on the road soon....

    jim
    Awhile back someone at the shop had some 36h Sun Rynolites built for their tandem. I think they went with XT hubs and some 14/15ga DB spokes. A good handbuilt wheel is key I think, since it will be significantly stronger in most instances than the same wheel coming off a machine. Rynolites are pretty strong but I don't know how they work on a tandem... but maybe look at some of the freeride/downhill rim offerings since they have a tendency to be redicuously strong.

  3. #3
    NOT a weight weenie Hunter's Avatar
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    Rhynolites are a good choice however for tamdem uses I reccomend the Sun Mammoth. Or if you can find them Ambrosio CC 24's.

  4. #4
    hors category TandemGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim thompson
    ..well to our supprise the rear rim had cracked causing a big bulge on the surface of the rim where the pad touches when brake is applied....the tire bead remained in place....now heres my question...can anyone recomment a high quality rim that will last and not wear out......
    As for which rim to use as a replacement, there are a very limited number of 26" rims drilled for 40h hubs. On the bright side, most of these will do quite nicely and, at this point I'm somewhat inclined to recommend you replace both rims.

    Sun RhynoLite: The name is misleading; they're quite robust and a great value. If you run widish tires this is the correct rim to replace your 217's with.
    http://aebike.com/site/page.cfm?PageID=30&SKU=RM8460

    Salsa's Gordo: Also a nice, robust rim - a bit heavier than the RhynoLite.
    http://aebike.com/site/page.cfm?PageID=30&SKU=RM8615

    Velocity Deep-V: Black only. A great rim if you run nothing larger than a 700x28. Beyond that, it's a bit narrow at 24mm (outside width) and same weight as RhynoLite.
    http://aebike.com/site/page.cfm?PageID=30&SKU=RM4421

    If you opt to go with new 36h hubs, then the world becomes your oyster with regard to rim choices. MAVIC plus the full range of Velocity & Sun rims become players. However, if your hubs are holding up and not giving you any trouble then I wouldn't bother with the expense of replacing them. If you have someone rebuild your wheels you might just have them service the hubs just to help extend their utility.

    In answer to the second part of your question, no, so long as you are using rim brakes there is no such thing as a rim that will not wear out. The rim is essentially a brake rotor and given enough use it will wear down like a brake rotor. Folks who hardly use their brakes will not often experience a rim sidewall failure; however, they are not all that uncommon on touring bikes and tandems that often times deal with more weight and greater reliance on brakes, particularly in hilly or mountainous terrain.

    Now, there are some rims that wear out faster and some -- like the early machined sidewall MAVIC rims -- that fail prematurely. I would have to know how many miles you have on your set of current rims before making a guess as to what may have led to your sidewall failure but the early MAVIC 217 SUP rims had all kinds of growing pains, including pre-mature sidewall failure, loose spoke furrels, and other annoying rattles.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Mhendricks's Avatar
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    Saw these rims and hubs on E-BAY for auction. I remembered someone suggesting these rims for tandem use. Friends of ours are looking into bidding on these wheels. Any comments or suggestions? Thanks
    Sun Mammoth Rims with LX Hubs

  6. #6
    Time for a change. stapfam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim thompson
    hello we have a santana rio tandem with 26" wheels...shimano tandem hubs 40h ,wheels smith spokes , mavic 217 rims...these wheels are original equiptment ... heres my delema while riding today my stoker heard something pop...then i noticed when i applied the rear brakes the brakes seem to pulsate so we stopped to investigate...well to our supprise the rear rim had cracked causing a big bulge on the surface of the rim where the pad touches when brake is applied....the tire bead remained in place....now heres my question...can anyone recomment a high quality rim that will last and not wear out......oh we ride only road some dirt paths we also go loaded touring...any help thanks we need to get on the road soon....

    jim

    I'm not surprised that a 217 rim popped. They were only on sale in the UK for about a year before they were replaced with the 517. The problem with the 217's was excessive wear and in my case they only lasted about 8 months before the rim started to bulge (Wear taking place) wheras the 517 will last me about 24 months.

    I would suggest going to a Freeride or even Downhill quality rim, as even the 517 is classed as a lightweight XC rim. Can't give you any numbers of rims as Since I last bought rims, they have all changed. My tandem wheels are Hope Bigun hubs with Mavic downhill rims and 36 straight gauge spokes. I can assure you that the quality of these wheels is superb and 18 months on and 1500 miles of abusive offroad use and they are still perfectly true and take all the punishment that 400lbs all up weight and lumpy tracks can through at them.

    Point is that my wheels were built by an expert wheel builder. I took his advice on what was required, paid a very fair price when broken down into individual components, and he was proved right. These are quality wheels built by an expert. Incidentally for those in the Uk, the wheel builder is Merlin cycles. at

    merlincycles.co.uk

  7. #7
    hors category TandemGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mhendricks
    Saw these rims and hubs on E-BAY for auction. I remembered someone suggesting these rims for tandem use.
    For use on a tandem? Rims are OK but the LX hubset is probably not.

    1st issue to address is compatibility with rear drop-out spacing; LX hubs are 135mm. What is the rear spacing on their tandem?

    2nd issue is durability. Unless they were a very lightweight team that intended to ride on flat or gently rolling bike paths, I wouldn't expect an LX hub to last long. If this is for off-road use, don't even think about it. Shimano makes tandem-specific hubs but they are based on the Paralax/XT Hubs which are beefier than the LX. Even so, we know of many teams who have blown-up the Shimano tandem hubs used off-road. So, durability would probably be the show-stopper if these are intended for use on a tandem even if the compatibility issue could be resolved with a wider axle and spacers.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    I'll agree with Mark about switching to 36h hubs. We use the Sun Rhynolites in 36 hole drilling, as I want to keep things simple to repair/replace when we tour. But I think that if your hub's in good shape, you need to contact Alex @ Mtbtandems.com. He carries the Rhynolite in 36, 40, and 48 hole drillings. Either get some rims from him, or see if you can send your hub(s?) to him, and have him lace them up. I'm assuming he builds wheels too, but Mark will let me know if I'm wrong.

  9. #9
    hors category TandemGeek's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Expatriate
    I'm assuming he builds wheels too, but Mark will let me know if I'm wrong.
    John Kovachi build's wheels for Alex.... which is a good thing!
    http://www.kovachiwheels.com/index.html
    Last edited by livngood; 01-14-05 at 06:04 PM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    Thanks. I hope that settles the matter for him.

  11. #11
    Senior Member zonatandem's Avatar
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    Agree with Sun or Velocity rims . . . and by all means see a GOOD wheelbuilder
    Have a front wheel on one of our tandems that lasted 57,000 miles . . . now that is outstanding!

  12. #12
    Senior Member AD-SLE's Avatar
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    My orginal Wheels are still on my Duet. I'm the third owner so all you can do is assess current condition. Front wheel is ultra true and the stock SANSIN hub is still silky smooth. But, at 48h and a Sun rim (w/o eyelets) it seems heavy. But, at 220 myself, there is no reason to worry about getting weight off the bike...I need to drop it...and I will when I can get a ruitine going!

    But the rear wheel, is not so round and has a small flat where the prior owners must have found something. You can feel it on fast decents but otherwise it does not bother me. But......

    There is a pair of never laced Mavic T519's on eBay...and, well, I was wondering....fresh rims on my 48h hubs....which are freewheel not cassette....old but for our mileage....it works fine.

    Or, I live 30 minutes from Peter White and perhaps I should just write the check for a nice set of wheels and keep what I have for unimportant days.

    Thoughts? I hate being stuck inside on cold days....but I am about to dress up and ride a single up and down a hill I live on. See how many climbs I can get in.

    Thanks!

  13. #13
    Senior Member Brian's Avatar
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    You are aware this issue is over 2 years old, right?

  14. #14
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    Another perspective... a local guy who rides a lot (former RAAM participant) considers replacing a rim about the same as replacing a tire. Rims are simply wear items that will need to be replaced after so many miles of use!

    My stoker and I built a set of 700c wheels with Velocity Dyads. I *hope* we ride them enough to wear them out -- more riding is better, and they will wear out some day!!

    I would go with a rim that's currently in production, as there will be a greater likelihood of finding a replacement should a need arise due to damage or wear. It's not unheard of to buy a spare or two of whatever rim you're using to build your new wheels.

    -Greg

  15. #15
    Senior Member AD-SLE's Avatar
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    Absolutely. It seems to me, a relative newbie, that the same stuff is dredged up over and over. So, I always try to post to a similar topic thereby making the thread more useful when folks "search" before asking already discussed topics. That's my approach to forums anyway. Just because it is old, does not mean it is wrong information. TGeek and Zono put too much darn effort into this to not research before asking. Thanks guys!

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