Braking Systems
#1
El Diablo
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Austin Tx, Ex So Cal
Posts: 2,750
Bikes: Cannondale CAAD8/Record 10s, Felt DA700 Chorus 10s,
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Braking Systems
We just bought an early 90's Burley Duet. This being our first tandem and having spent all of my time on singles the first thing I noticed was how "spongey" the rear brakes felt. Is this normal due to the long leangth of the cable. The rear brakes are Avid (long throw not the shorties). Would the Avid shorties increase or decrease this feeling? If this is not normal any recommendations would be welcome.
Thanks in advance,
Thanks in advance,
__________________
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
#2
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Posts: 30,225
Bikes: Catrike 559 I own some others but they don't get ridden very much.
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1572 Post(s)
Liked 643 Times
in
364 Posts
Originally Posted by 2Rodies
We just bought an early 90's Burley Duet. This being our first tandem and having spent all of my time on singles the first thing I noticed was how "spongey" the rear brakes felt. Is this normal due to the long leangth of the cable. The rear brakes are Avid (long throw not the shorties). Would the Avid shorties increase or decrease this feeling? If this is not normal any recommendations would be welcome.
Thanks in advance,
Thanks in advance,
#3
El Diablo
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Austin Tx, Ex So Cal
Posts: 2,750
Bikes: Cannondale CAAD8/Record 10s, Felt DA700 Chorus 10s,
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
The rears have been upgraded to an Avid brake, the fronts are still the canty's. I was curious about the spongy feeling if it is normal because of the cable lenghth. The Avids on the rear are the long throw and I thought maybe the Avid shorties would decrease the spongy feeling.
__________________
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: St Peters, Missouri
Posts: 30,225
Bikes: Catrike 559 I own some others but they don't get ridden very much.
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1572 Post(s)
Liked 643 Times
in
364 Posts
Originally Posted by 2Rodies
The rears have been upgraded to an Avid brake, the fronts are still the canty's. I was curious about the spongy feeling if it is normal because of the cable lenghth. The Avids on the rear are the long throw and I thought maybe the Avid shorties would decrease the spongy feeling.
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Grand Prairie, TX
Posts: 702
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time
in
1 Post
Retrogrouch is exactly right. You should embark on a brake setup optimizing campaign, starting by running out the straddle cable to a tall triangle with just a small margin before hardware starts running into the brake cable housing stop at full application. You need to true the wheel and take the shoe/rim clearance down to the minimum. And you have to remove any mush from the front end of the system. If you see the rear brake cable housing move when you apply the rear brake, that will use up some travel. You can prevent this by ziptying the rear brake cable housing to the front brake cable housing where they cross, which will deny it the opportunity to flex. When you are done you just might be able to lock up the rear wheel with a stoker on board.
Lots of tandems out at Peach Pedal today (Weatherford, TX), including Art Cowsen (everybody's hero, you can see a picture of our Fearless Leader on the FWBA Death Ride picture pages) on his extended stoker compartment CoMotion Capuccino and Duane Neu on a triple with his wife and hapless son. I'm old, lazy, and fat, so I could only manage 2:48 for 62 miles on my single. I might have seen two tandems towing trail-a-bikes towing trailers. Mind-boggling. Watching those things turn U-turns across the better part of four lanes is amazing.
Lots of tandems out at Peach Pedal today (Weatherford, TX), including Art Cowsen (everybody's hero, you can see a picture of our Fearless Leader on the FWBA Death Ride picture pages) on his extended stoker compartment CoMotion Capuccino and Duane Neu on a triple with his wife and hapless son. I'm old, lazy, and fat, so I could only manage 2:48 for 62 miles on my single. I might have seen two tandems towing trail-a-bikes towing trailers. Mind-boggling. Watching those things turn U-turns across the better part of four lanes is amazing.
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 11,016
Bikes: Custom Zona c/f tandem + Scott Plasma single
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 77 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 19 Times
in
11 Posts
Howdy from Duluth!
Another option is to add a brake stiffener/booster, available in alloy or even carbon fiber.
Pedal on TWOgether!
Rudy & Kay/Zona tandem
Another option is to add a brake stiffener/booster, available in alloy or even carbon fiber.
Pedal on TWOgether!
Rudy & Kay/Zona tandem
#7
hors category
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 7,231
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 5 Times
in
5 Posts
Originally Posted by 2Rodies
Is this normal due to the long leangth of the cable.
(Or -- with a nod to Scott -- to be more accurate, you end up with at least twice as much loss of efficiency in the "system". More specifically, on a single bike you lose cable-pull efficiency by a factor of X due to various things. On a tandem, the factor is ~2x. At the same time, you are exacerbating 2x because you are riding a bicycle that weighs twice as much and are pulling on the brake lever 2x as hard in an effort to achieve the same result. When you combine all of those things, you end up with a rear brake that feels "mushy" and would feel mushy even compared to the same brake device on a single bike.)
Originally Posted by 2Rodies
Would the Avid shorties increase or decrease this feeling?
Just my .02.
Last edited by livngood; 07-11-04 at 07:32 AM.
#8
El Diablo
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Austin Tx, Ex So Cal
Posts: 2,750
Bikes: Cannondale CAAD8/Record 10s, Felt DA700 Chorus 10s,
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
So I had the chance to check out another "older" tandem today and the rear brake felt just like ours. It is the cable length and I'm just used to the feel of a single. Thanks for all of the responses we are going for our first (as a team) ride this evening!
__________________
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
Campy Neutrons for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...86#post2464586
HAC4 for sale!
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...83#post2478083
#9
@#$% cars
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Chicago
Posts: 405
Bikes: '02 Schwinn Frontier;'03 Fisher Tiburon; '04 Raleigh Companion; 04 Dahon SpeedPro; 69 Raleigh Sport fixed
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Sometimes a bend in the cable routing contributes more to sluggish feel than length of the cable. My step-through single has a less crisp feel than our Raleigh companion's rear brake ... but the tandem cable is a very straight route and the step thru has a nice cable bend up to the brake. At least this is what my mechanic convinced me of on the step thru -- essentially there is alot of friction, the cable in the casing doing the bend.
jus' another tho't
jus' another tho't