Motobecane07

We are new to tandeming and I'm wondering if any of you find it harder physically then when you are riding on a single bike?
Tonight my wife and I went for a 26 mile ride with some good rolling hills. This has been our third time out. My legs were toast after the ride. I have rode centuries in the past, one already this year, so I know what my limits are.
My wife said like she felt she wasn't pulling her wait because I was doing all the hard pedaling. I was pedaling hard because I felt like we were not getting up the hills easy enough. It's like the chicken or the egg dilemma. Has anyone else experienced this and what have you done to try and remedy it?

john4789

What is the problem? This is one of the fundamental points of riding a tandem, two unmatched riders getting to go the same speed. You get to ride hard w/o leaving your wife in the dust. So again, what is the problem?
Tandeming: you are doing it right! Just relax and enjoy.

PeFSQ

I think that a majority here would agree that climbing on a tandem feels more difficult than on a half-bike. Moreover, it may take some time/miles to get the team well coordinated, which seems critical for the ease of climbing (especially if you need/want to pedal out of saddles), so don't be disturbed if you perceive it difficult at first. We are at our third year and we feel that we make a leap in the quality of coordination/communication with every season. We feel that just riding, riding, and riding together, everything becomes more intuitive and we need to speak/think less to make the right and efficient strokes/shifts/moves. Maybe it's a good thing to start with mostly flat rides, if possible...

Dean V

You need to either get used to it, or lower your expectation of the speed you will ride at (especially up hill), or encourage your wife to pull her weight (this needs to be done as diplomatically as possible). In our case it was a blend of all three and over the years you develop as a team and it gets better and better.

gracehowler

John is right, especially with climbing involved. It really does take time to "balance out", ie; her working harder and you the same or less, in time, you too will gain "being together, priceless"
R&J

waynesulak

Learning to captain a tandem uphill is like riding into a strong wind. Don't fixate on the speed and use another metric like your heart rate to judge your effort. Ride the effort level you need to for the planned distance and let the speed take care of itself.

I also suggest that you search the forum for cadence and phase to get some ideas on how to help a new stoker feel resistance in the pedals.

Carbonfiberboy 

Oh heck yes! I was a very experienced and somewhat fast single rider. Our first 20 mile tandem rides left me with painful legs for sure. I was like, what the hey?? My guess is that a 350 lb. tandem combo doesn't behave the same as a 180 lb. single combo. It's much harder for one person to accelerate it with one pedal stroke, unlike a single. It doesn't "get out of the way" of your pedal pressure. I think on our singles we make many small accelerating pressures with our legs and the single responds by allowing our legs to accelerate on the pedals. With a tandem, it's more like isometric contractions. It requires a different sort of muscular conditioning which can only be obtained on the tandem.

So does it get easier? Oh heck yes! It takes time though, just like any conditioning routine. My stoker wife is very interested in having more fun on the tandem and totally willing to work for it. So we each have coded HRMs. We call out our HRs frequently to each other during a ride so we stay synched up. It seems to get easier to stay in synch after a couple hours in the saddle. We don't know why that would be, but it is. Our lactate thresholds are about the same so that makes it really easy, but if they were different each person just needs to know where in the range the other person is and where they should be. It isn't always obvious to the stoker that now we are climbing slightly or now we are descending slightly, and it isn't always obvious how hard the captain is working nor vice versa. Though breathing is a good clue, below ventilatory threshold it gets harder to tell.

So it's just tandem mileage together and as others have said and will say, getting to work smoothly as a team. You can't accelerate the bike by yourself. You just can't. You can't come online until she's coming online. You have to do it together and smoothly. She'll get so she'll know exactly when you'll shift, exactly when you'll accelerate, etc. Though I'll say "accelerating" when we attack or want to move out. Might as well, I guess - they can already hear the shifting.

OTOH, we tandem captains have something of a reputation among the single bike crowd. Most of us haven't become any better aerobically on our singles - that's not going to change significantly - but we sure can surge, stand for long periods, and do other strength-dependent things.

Feel each other's pedaling through the timing chain. You should actually never feel each other. It should just feel like you are pedaling a very heavy single bike. So see if you can come to agreement on pedal stroke technique. We'll usually call out "smooth, smooth" to each other if one gets to hammering or pedaling squares. Helps.

In our case, I used to be able to feel Stoker's power dropping off when the rpms got up around 90 or so. She wouldn't complain, she just couldn't put out power at higher rpms. I've kept pushing at her upper edge and she's gradually gotten more powerful and able to even climb at 90 sometimes.

Love to see her grin in my helmet mirror.

Motobecane07

Thanks to all for the good advice. I guess maybe I am trying to over compensate for my wife's difficulties that she normally has when riding a half bike on the hills. I have never been good at pedaling at a high cadence. I usually just run in the big chain ring and use the 28 in the back for the hills.
Perhaps I just need to lower our gear and spin a little faster so I don't burn myself out. Also I think I need to stop looking at our average speed and just enjoy our time together.

Clarabelle

We are pretty new to tandem riding, and I've noticed the same thing with hills whereas my stoker thinks it feels about the same as her single. Not seeing the steepness of the hill might be one of the perks of stoking. Ignorance is bliss.

apage4u

I had to put a heart monitor on my wife so see could see how much effort she was exerting. When she starts talking I can feel her effort drop so a simple "What's you heart rtae?" gets her back on track. If she responds with "I'll work" then I know it had dropped all the way down to a resting rate. For a while I had to tape over the speed on her CatEye V3 because she would see us reach our target cruising speed and start easing off. I was killing myself to maintain the speed and would ask how she was doing and she would tell me how easy it was. That's when we started focusing on her heart rate. After each ride we can look at average heart rate and it tells a lot. We are using one sending unit with two head units.

ct-vt-trekker

My wife and I are both strong single riders just about exactly equal in our abilities. We both think riding the tandem is physically harder than our single bikes. We do live in a hilly area though and all of our rides include some good hills so that could be the reason . Also we both tend to ride hard and push most of the time.
We ride a couple of flat centuries each year and on those rides we feel that the tandem is just a little faster than what we can do by drafting with our singles but so far we've been unable to beat our single bike fastest century time with our tandem (sub 5 hour).

AllezDada

We're relatively new to tandeming. For me it is harder than riding my single, whereas my wife feels it is easier; on her own she has come to the conclusion that she needs to try harder. Interestingly on the latter part of longer rides I get tired and she comes on strong. I guess in time we'll coordinate better.

Tandem Tom

Sometimes my wife is back there singing and I am trying to stuff my lung back in place!

wheelspeed

Another here that thinks it's harder, but also happy to accept that it's just part of tandeming. My wife happens to have a couple other nuances on the tandem that weren't mentioned yet, for example, I suspect she eases off the pedalling on flat ground or mild hills. But she does help on the uphills except when she starts talking or looking at horses or something and I'll have to remind her "this... isa... big... hill..." gasp. The thing is, she'll help too much on some uphills and spend herself before the top. So I've learned that I better keep some reserve for the tops of longer hills. Maybe it's hard for a stoker to pace themselves since they can't see very well. But it's okay... besides the physical differences, the strategic differences of a tandem ride are also fun.

Oh yeah, my single is going on 25 years old with the typical 39/53 front and 7 speed corn-cob on the back... but on the tandem I use the granny gears A LOT. Just downshift and get used to climbing at a slower rate if you need to. You'll make up for it on the downhill. :-)

Motobecane07

We went back out this morning for a short hour ride and it seemed to go much better. She suggested that she would call out the shift based on her leg strength and comfort. That seemed to work out well.
I actually heard her breathing heavy back there. We both agreed that it was a good little ride. She felt as though she had worked harder than yesterday and I felt like I wasn't killing myself.

In time I hope to be able to know her capabilities and adjust gearing to suit her. Riding by myself I always judged my progression based on my distance and average speed. Now, I'm not gonna be worried about that on the tandem and just enjoy our time together.

Thanks again guys for your advice.

mchell

For what it's worth, my wife and I have been tandeming for 20 years, formerly a Trek T200 and now a Rans Screamer. A few years ago we were riding in a tour in Florida when we both noticed the ride was more of a challenge than we'd previously experienced. We were both wiped, even on level roads, in a matter of a few hours. We blamed it on our conditioning. When we returned to Canada, we were involved in another tour and felt the same way. But by now we had almost 800 km on the season and so felt maybe it wasn't us after all. I had checked brakes, both wheels, yada yada, but this time, I pulled the chains, both of them, and BINGO! The bearings in the stoker's cranks were shot. Big, strong leg muscles would turn the cranks, but without the chains, the cranks would not spin freely by hand, as they should. Explains why the bike coasted beautifully. But in Florida, unless in the Panhandle, there's not a lot of coasting.
Sometimes, it's the bike. Mike

stevemtbr

I just say "Scotty we need more power". My wife will usually replay, "she can't take much more captain"

Motobecane07

[QUOTE=mchell A few years ago we were riding in a tour in Florida when we both noticed the ride was more of a challenge than we'd previously experienced. We were both wiped, even on level roads, in a matter of a few hours.[/QUOTE]

Was the tour called "Bike Florida"?
I did that this year. Up near Quincy it was kinda hilly for Florida. The rest of the ride was just flat and straight.

waynesulak

My wife never wants to ride her single now that we have a tandem. This is always a great surprise to anyone who knows her because she is somewhat of a control freak off the bike.

On the other hand I don't believe is because she is shirking but rather she she is very competitive and would rather go faster rather than slower. Seems logical to me to want to ride a bike with a better power to weight ratio and climbing speed and much faster on the flats. Every single rider I know feels the same just in a different context.

Yes it is physically harder for me. As mention above we use all our gears and shift a lot. The big difference for me is as a small guy I like to stand a lot on my single. We are skilled at standing on the tandem but it does overload her cardiovascular system quickly so less standing is an adjustment for me. It also puts a lot of importance on saddle choice.

Tandeming is easier mentally for me. I always have a riding partner any time I ride. Want to leave from the house riding the bike at 5:30 in the morning to avoid the summer heat? sure. No need to drive to a ride or ride alone. feeling a little too lazy too - bad because my workout partner wants to ride so out we go.

My wife and I have always worked out most days but until the tandem not usually together. Now we work out together and it is part of our routine. Overall it makes riding a lot miles much easier.

waynesulak

We don't say that but do refer to drafting singles as "Kling-ons"

rdtompki

Depends of course. Flat is faster on a tandem so it's "easier". You both may be working just as hard as on a single, but definitely going faster.

Climbs are harder than on a single; Even at the same work load they simply take longer and on steep pitches a relatively stronger captain will probably be shoulder a greater percentage of the work. In our case we are sometimes doing climbs that my wife couldn't do on her single.

The most insidious condition I find are rollers. It took me quite a while to get used to how much you may have to shift riding rollers. Ever time the captain waits to long to grab a lower gear he/she pays for it with "make up" effort. Over 100K+ this can really beat up the captain. We're past this now and generally my shifting keeps using flow.

You may never have to walk up a hill, but if the time comes, get off the bike and walk. Last year we did a 70 mile organized ride part of which was through a hillside neighborhood. I stopped at the bottom of a <1/4 mile pitch which was clearly over 15% and told my wife we were walking. We took a vote, stoker won and we rode up the small hill. That little hill was a maximum standing effort and I paid for it for the next 50 miles. It's all part of the experience of course, but setting expectations and communication are the key IMHO.

I do enjoy a periodic fix on my single, the acceleration and the relative ease of climbing, but it 's tremendously satisfying to be riding 100K+ with my wife on the tandem. When the climbing gets painful, and it does sometimes, inharmonious thoughts can occur and you need to be able to deal with these.

Alex & Deya

For us the tandem is definitely harder. I know the major reasonis that we only ride the tandem on really hard rides or events at a fast pace.

Sprout97 

Nope. We bought The Boat primarily for longer distances/charity rides. It has enabled us to stay together, especially in windy conditions. (On our former half-bikes, I found myself burning up too much energy to slow down to try to shield her from the wind.) And after her shoulder surgery, she was never comfortable again on her carbon single. The tandem enables her to still ride, and at a decent clip.

Climbing is a tougher venue. My wife/stoker certainly pulls her weight, but I'm not particularly thrilled when she stands on the pedals (balance-control issue, especially if I'm already standing). And the gear selection also comes into play: she can comfortably spin a higher cadence, but I can grind with a taller gear. So we adjust in her favor. (#1 rule of tandeming: never tick off the stoker.) OTOH...

The flat stages are easier. <16mph, she essentially extends my endurance. 16+, she makes it possible to hold higher cruising speeds over distance. And in all cases, she's still my navigator & is another set of eyes in traffic. Also, I always get to ride with my best friend.

waynesulak

Rollers that trend with a small loss of altitude are the most fun thing on a tandem. I love to carry that speed over a rise. Steep downhills are fast but we either spin out or use a lot of energy for just a small increase in speed. As a result we usually tuck and coast.

zonatandem

Been riding 'in tandem' since 1975 and covered well over 200-thousand miles.
Some new tandem captains think they have to prove themselves by out muscle-ing their stoker . . . and end up whooped in no time!
Sometimes the stoker ends up having to pedal harder to get that whooped captain back home!
Tandeming is a team effort/sport.
We were rtiding singles back in the early 70s; did quite a few centuries. Trouble was Kay rode a bit slower than Rudy and consequently we ended up riding separately most of the event.
Thought it would be more fun to be able to ride TWOgether and for our 20th wedding anniversary gave ouselves a tandem; been at it ever since.
The first few rides were a learning experience, as was that first tandem.
But, we eventually got the hang and are now on our 5th tandem.
Our advice: comunicate on the tandem and you'll become a good tandem team.
We are now 80/78 and yes, still ride TWOgether!
Rudy and Kay/zonatandem