MassiveD

Make your own quilt. There are kits, but you can just tape the perimeter together and use a tagging gun for stabilization, or the yarn bits. One of the ideas behind quilts is to make them somewhat disposable so that when the loft starts to be lost you toss them. Not really how I roll, but they have a point. Quilts are less likely to wear out anyway, since you aren't lying on them so if you don't like that idea, it isn't required.

I don't really buy the whole tarp thing, and then Jardine got really ill with lime disease. But a very simple single wall tent is pretty much the same weight.

BigAura

Of course you can. My point is that carbon bicycles & bits are NOT overbuilt. Once you get outside of their intended design purpose, which is lightweight racing, you're looking at higher rate of failure. Also to reiterate my position: the material carbon-fiber could be used to overbuild an awesome touring bike. BUT the repurposing of racing bicycles to carry loads (excluding rider) is problematic especially over time.

Rowan

The loops at the rear of Brooks saddles are metal and form part of the framework for the saddle itself. Yes, they are capable of supporting 20lbs for an extended period of time.

nun

I have a Bagman that I use on other bikes, but I don't need it on the Cervelo so I don't use it. The saddlebag loops on the Brooks saddle are metal and will support lots of weight. My bag weighs 12lbs. To transport pizza I discard the box, Fold the pizza up and put it in a paper bag before strapping under the long flap.

azza_333

24L capacity in one of those things, I wounder how stable it is compared to one of the revelate designs viscacha bags

staehpj1

They are definitely one option and making one can be pretty inexpensive. I have not found that for me at least they save weight or are nearly as versatile. Quilts are one of those things that I had high hopes for, but they didn't really pan out as well as I hoped. I found that in order for a quilt to work for me it needs to be big enough to either hang over a good bit or tuck under me. That makes them as heavy or heavier than a slim cut bag. I find that a slim cut bag of a similar weight can be warmer and more adjustable.

When it is the warmest I sleep on top of my mummy bag and then as the weather cools down, I partially cover myself with it zipped open like a quilt, then fully cover my body, then climb in, then zip up, then put the hood on, then pull hood drawstring tight leaving only a small opening to breath through. That gives a lot more range of comfort than I got with a quilt.

As far as longevity... down bags can last quite a few decades. Synthetics tend to compact over time and not last as long. That is true for quilts or bags, but yes synthetic quilts may suffer from that less than synthetic bags do on the bottom.

I have a 1 pound 1 ounce bag (Mountain Hardwear Phantom 45) that I have been comfy with in everything from hot weather to the mid teens F. I sleep really warm, wear a layer of or two clothes as needed, and the bivy adds warmth as well.

I am sure quilts work well for some and I'd possibly reconsider a quilt if I did trips where I didn't need as wide of a range of comfort. I'd also consider one if the budget was tight and I didn't already own an expensive bag.

A few points on that. Having lived much of my life where ticks are super plentiful, I have found that ticks tend to get on you when walking around where grass or brush touches you not. They hang out and latch on as you pass by. I have seen no reason to think that they come to you when sleeping on a pad. They may be found on you in a tent or under a tarp after they hitched a ride on your clothing or gear and found you later.

Pretty much the same weight? My tarp is 7 ounces and it isn't the lightest possible tarp. My setup is heavier than that though. I add a bit of thin cord and a few needle stakes I also take a bivy (7 ounces) or a bug bivy (5.5 ounces), so the total winds up being 13 ounces to a pound.

Also on most of my tours they may be rainy sections, but a large majority of the time it is dry. While I pitch the tarp when I have to, I like to cowboy camp when conditions are suitable. It is nice to just throw down the bivy, inflate the pad that is already inside of it, throw the sleeping bag on top, and turn it. If it unexpectedly turns worse I climb inside the bivy. If it really rains hard I pull the tarp loosely over me.

If I tour where I expect it to rain a lot of the time I do take a tent, but if a rain day here and there is all that I expect I definitely like the bivy and tarp.

nun

The stability of a large saddlebag depends on how well it is mounted. The Carraduce bags are mounted transversely and if the straps are buckled on the inside of the bag (rather than on the outside as shown in many photos) so that the bag is tight against the saddle and then the third strap pulls the bag tight against the seat post then sway is tiny. The longitudinal mounting if the bikepacking bags might amplify any sway and I have seen videos where they bounce about a lot. But I imagine correct mounting would minimize that and they they also work well when used correctly.

spectastic

so the answer is to buy a super overbuilt carbon seat post, or buy a super overbuilt aluminum seatpost. problem solved?

spectastic

are the straps very durable? I'd hazard a guess that the bag is more stable when mounted straight to the saddle loops and seat post, which has 3 connecting points, as opposed to having the support rack, which really only has one (two if you count each rail), and nothing to keep the thing from bouncing up and down on rough terrain.

BigAura

My trusted Kalloy seatpost on my touring bike weighs 10.2 ounces vs my carbon seatpost 8.6 ounces on my carbon Trek. Less than two ounces difference! No need for me to experiment.

zonatandem

We have a custom all carbon fiber tandem with a custom carbon fiber rear rack. That bike (and rack) has 45,000+ miles on it.
Haul all sorts of stuff in that expandable trunk bag!

nun

The leather straps are very durable. Mine are 10 years old and still going strong. You can also buy replacements easily.

Using the Bagman does lead to more movement; but the third bag strap is usually attached to the Bagman and bounce isn't a big issue.

Rowan

The Bagman support does add extra stability, in my experience. I don't like a Carradice swinging around behind me, and the Bagman support has the added advantage of keeping the bag away from the backs of my legs as I pedal.

We have the Bagman on several bikes, but they used primarily for randonneuring. On other bikes when we fit up a Carradice, we rest the bottom of it on the rear rack and wrap the strap around the front part of the rack.

As nun says, the leather straps are surprisingly durable, although I use a cut down strap from an old toe clip for the third attachment point.

spectastic

what?

Rowan

Go with whatever interpretation you want. I find the Bagman to work for me. But it probably doesn't for nun. Shrug.

Look, if you really want to know the answer to all these questions, do what we have done and invest your hard-earneds and try it yourself. There is a ready market for Carradice and its add-ons out there, so you won't be much out of pocket, if all, and if you order direct from the factory in the UK.

By doing that, you will come up with your own worthwhile opinion...

nun

I think the different comments by myself and Rowan might come down to weight, and maybe mounting style (although I'm not sure about that).
My Camper is big and quite heavy so when I cantilever it out from the saddle with a Bagman I become more aware of it than when it is tight under the saddle.
The Bagman works perfectly well on my other bikes, but it puts the bag farther from the saddle and so it has a larger moment. With lighter bags that isn't as big
an issue. Also, if the bag is not mounted tightly to the saddle (which often happens because people close the buckles on the outside of the bag) the bag sway is larger than with the Bagman.

The feeling of the bag at the back of your legs is also one that many people find initially disconcerting, but some don't feel it at all and for those that do it soon goes away and it becomes natural.

nun

Awesome!

nun

No, just buy a regular Al seat post if you have any worries about using a CF one.

staehpj1

That and support more weight with your legs and "un-weight" especially on bumps and rough stretches.

chasm54

Maybe I'm being dense here, nun, but I'm not following this. How do you fasten the buckles on the inside of a carradice bag? N your pictures they seem to be on the outside as usual.

nun

There's no need for non-Euclidean geometry or Time Lord space warping, simply thread the straps so the buckles are inside the bag. This means you have to open the bag to put it on and take it off the bike, which can be a pain, but it's worth it for the better riding experience. Here is a good explanation, scroll down to "Mounting a Saddlebag" section.

Carradice

chasm54

Thanks. I was indeed being dense.

nun

No! The truly dense don't think to ask the question....
This thread has gone a little off track as it's onto a track about saddlebags because they offer a way to get around the lack of eyelets on most carbon bikes. maybe people could add comments about bikepacking bags and CF bikes they might like for touring. I like Carradice saddlebags, but there are other luggage options to pair with a CF bike

chasm54

I'm a Carradice fan too, I've done a fair bit of cc touring with a Nelson longflap (even a Pendle for a weekend trip) on a sub-20lb roadbike. Not carbon, but really that's immaterial, and ironically it has a cf seatpost. But I've never been a huge fan of the bagman, and for some reason the trick with the buckles has never occured to me.

If I were the OP I wouldn't be messing about with racks on a cf frame. I'd either be going ultralight with a saddlebag and/or frame bag, or I'd be getting light steel tourer for going fully loaded. There comes a point when compromise becomes a pain.

nun

Yes either commit to a saddlebag or bikepacking bags or get a light steel bike with some eyelets and use a couple of Arkel Dry-lites and a handlebar bag.