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  1. #1
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    another wheel question. spoke count...

    I was/am wanting a 36spoke wheelset for my first touring bike. in my budget i was looking at xt hubs laced to a ma3 in 36spokes. i've been told in another thread to stay away from the ma3. the LBS have some mavic a719 in stock and XTR hubs that he's willing to build within my budget (hubs a closeouts from last yr) but he only has 32 hole in both. which is a better option? btw i weigh 220lbs and am planning on pavement only touring, hostel/b&b hopping. so limited gear. any thoughts?

  2. #2
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    anyone?

  3. #3
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    IMHO you'll be fine with 32 hole and 14 guage spokes, brass nipples. Pavement and light loading are key even though you are at 220. Most mountain bikes come with 32 spoke wheels and would be routinely subject to more abuse than you plan. Also key is a good deal for the wheels. How much are you paying?

  4. #4
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    All that is true, however the 36 spoke wheel has 12 percent more spokes which is good both in providing more spokes to carry loads and shorter spans between spokes, a structural toofer. I would go with the MA3 or some other brand of rim. I am running Alex dh22 and in 36, weigh about the same as you and do loaded touring. There are a variety of other options like SUn Rhino, or Velocity. If there wasn't some deal, in the background, most would not recomend going 36 spoke in your situation on 700C.

    I would really wonder whether the MA3 with the more spokes and lessor spans is the weaker choice, You may be giving up as much a 20% wheel strength.

    Are XTR hubs actually stronger than LX hubs? The nicer Shimano stuff is more race oriented and not necesarilly any tougher than the LX level stuff. There is possibly a reason why he still has stock in this stuff.

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    You're going to here a lot of different advice on this subject-- more spokes/ stronger hoops/better hubs/ect.....

    Don't loose any sleep over it.

    Listen to your LBS guy, because he's going to have to face you if the wheels go bad. His choice of XTR hubs/Mavic A917 rims is pretty good-- I'd tour loaded on them, even at 32 holes.

    Order your new wheels and don't look back.

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    "he's going to have to face you if the wheels go bad"

    Not necesarilly unless he is running the sag wagon. When my Schwalbe blew out, I didn't feel like carrying the tire another 1000 miles just to slap it on the LBS's counter.

    Tac do you run 32 spoke 700s at 250-280ish rider bike and light gear. I agree one could. What if he loves the credit card stuff and decides to go more loaded. New wheels.
    Last edited by NoReg; 09-24-06 at 01:31 AM.

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    the XTR stuff is not "stronger" per se, but machined to higher tolerances and apparantly have better races,pawls whatnot... i get your point though peterpan1. One thing i was told when talking to another shop about doing 32h (asking advice on this wheelset) is that this rim is built for a tandem, and he'd seen a few tandems running the 32h, and the weight of the bike and 2 average riders is still 350+lbs. So far so good with the advice. keep it coming, like to hear both sides of things!

  8. #8
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    cyclesafe, to answer your question, the price is 350 canadian built with DT or Wheelsmith spokes 14g (i choose which brand). i built a similiar set with xt hubs and dyad rims on universalcycles.com, and it was 260ish US then shipping to vancouver, then duties/customs(7% i think). the LBS can do the same wheelset i was saying above with XT hubs for 290 canadian... oh and peterpan1, he has all these hubs as a closeout. shimano changed their standard XTR grey to pewter. the only real change. so he loaded up on them at a large disc. this particular shop "specializes" in deep discounted discontinued items.

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    Well for hostel hopping if that is your intention I think you will be hard put to break a 32. I have never broken a 32 on 26 with high pressure slicks.

    Conversation have a tendency to kinda go in one direction or another on the net. We have had a few threads recently about guys going for 40 spokes. We have guys building 48 wheels though that is pretty rare, and certainly Hugli, Shimano, Phil have these high spoke hubs for tandems. It's got to be for some reason. If 32 is the new normal for tandems on 700C, I should be touring on 20 spokes.

    Here is an interesting thread of MA3 posts with Sheldon jumping in in their defense, I think?

    http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-134404.html

    http://archive.roadbikereview.com/03/0EFCEFC9.php

    There is some stuff in this thread from Jobst. He obviously hates the MA3. And a lot of people are probably equally unhappy the MA3 is here and the MA2 has been dropped, so they are extra angry at the MA3. But the kicker is Jobst really doesn't like any new rims, so whatcha gonna do. He does like 36 spokes.

    http://www.talkaboutsportsnetwork.co...es/603731.html

    Now I'm worrying I won't be able to run my wide touring tires on these...

  10. #10
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    Ah, I think the MA3 isn't being made anymore, (although there are still some around for sale) Mavic now has a new improved rim--- the Open Sport.

    The Mavic A719 is likely the strongest 700c rim ever made. It's welded, machined sidewalls and has that Mavic magic. It's also about the most pricey rim ever, twice what MA3s cost. Between the A719 and the Open Pro, Mavic pretty much has the 700c rim market cornered. And this is from a long time Sun rims fan-- I'm running Sun Assult and CR18 currently, but I'd have to rate the Mavics as better.

    As far as the 32 vs 36 spokes-- I'm pretty sure the A719 is so tough it isn't going to matter. I wouldn't try that with the MA3 or Sun CR18 becuase the're pinned rims and are much weaker and need the 36 spoke support. Mavic rims are designed to use less spokes and still be strong.

  11. #11
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    Carry some extra spokes and something to break the freewheel/cassette loose and quit worrying about it. Better yet, get a Kevlar replacement spoke (or two) and leave the cassette tools at home.
    Most economic fallacies derive from the tendency to assume that there is a fixed pie, that one party can gain only at the expense of another.....Milton Friedman

  12. #12
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    thanks for the links peterpan1. some good reading in there.

  13. #13
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    I think you nailed it Tac, the 719 is the only rim Harris has with proper eyelets, and on top of everything else it's pretty heavy weight. I've just been reading the lattest stuff on internal gear hubs, and the Rohloff is only available in 32 spoke, ofcourse. Between the no dish, and the comon application on 26 wheels, it's a special case too. Still it's 32 spokes.

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