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Old 02-02-07, 11:46 PM   #1
Robert_in_ca
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Best Touring Rim?

Is the Mavic A719 simply the best or is there something even better?

Is the Velocity Dyad better or worse than the A719?

Are the Dyads pinned?
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Old 02-03-07, 12:22 AM   #2
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I just built up some Salsa Delgado Cross rims, these seem very stout to me. Better than the Mavic?...who knows?
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Old 02-03-07, 03:01 AM   #3
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rims

I use older Mavic T520's with 36 spokes. I am a heavy rider (260) and so far no wheel truing needed after 2000 miles. If you ride enough, there isn't much difference between the top rims, especially since rims are kind of disposable, in a sense. Unless you are using disc brakes, your rims will wear out the sidewalls before the spoke holes wear out, unless you never ride in wet, gritty weather.
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Old 02-03-07, 03:04 AM   #4
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Comparing the two rims the Dyads are 80 grams lighter than the A719's. And they're cheaper.

What to do.
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Old 02-03-07, 09:40 AM   #5
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the A719's are NOT the toughest Mavic rim, robert. A319's are triple hollow rims, heavier, stouter and cheaper. 719s are single hollow and lighter but not as stout as a 319.

The Dyads are fine. some complain of fractures at the spoke holes (no eyelets) but other wheelbuilders feel the lack of eyelets build a more precise, stronger wheel by eliminating the eyelet.2 schools of thought.

Besides, the rims are one of the disposable elements of a bike build, a couple of years of use and you will need to replace them anyway due to rim wear. don't sweat either choice. you'll be fine.

I've toured on Dyads, Mavics, Sun Rhynos, and they are all quality choices. currently have my Phil Wood hubs laced to Dyads for heavy touring. choose my Rhynolites when I go mountain biking on the 520, and use the Mavic 719s for just tootling around town. and wouldn't hesitate to go on tour with any of them.
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Old 02-03-07, 10:55 AM   #6
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[QUOTE=Bekologist]the A719's are NOT the toughest Mavic rim, robert. A319's are triple hollow rims, heavier, stouter and cheaper. 719s are single hollow and lighter but not as stout as a 319.
QUOTE]

Are you sure of this?The 719s are more expensive, wider (24 mm or so) and have that sleeve thing going between the outside and inside rim. But they are indeed lighter, which i frankly don't understand.

Also, what do you mean by "triple hollow"?

I'm asking because i know the 719s are the choice for tandem bicycles, arguably the most rigorous test one can put a wheel to.

Seeing as i'm looking to replace the current wheels on my commuter/tourer, your input is much appreciated.
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Old 02-03-07, 12:14 PM   #7
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We have 719/40h rims on our tandem and they've held up without a hitch, and tandems are harrrrrd on rims--just imagine. The 719s great rims. But you know what, I just built up some wheels with Alex Adventurer rims and XT hubs for my new LHT. While the Alex rims are certainly no light-weights, they are damn decent rims, especially for the price. In terms of durability I think they'll rival the 719s. We'll see.
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Old 02-03-07, 12:28 PM   #8
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A-719 are the best touring rim around. They are made of Maxtal which is stronger than the aluminum used in most rims.

I have a set on my touring bike that I've ridden over 10,000km and not broken a spoke and only trued them once. I weigh 230lbs and carry a 40 to 50 lb. load.

I just built up a set of XM 719 disk for my mountain bike to tour off road. I used DT Alpine3 spokes on XT hubs. The wheel set weighs 2100gms.
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Old 02-03-07, 12:53 PM   #9
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Try to think of your wheels as a system.....tires, rims, spokes and hubs. Your wheel will break down at the weakest point in your system. The wheels on the Novara Randonee have Tiagra hubs, 36 straight gage spokes, Mavic rims (319 I think, but I can't remember right now) and nice 32mm touring tires.

A friend rode his Randonee loaded for thousands of miles and the cones in the Tiagra hubs went south first-- the weakest part of the wheel.

I've always been a big Sun rims fan-- Rynolites for touring and MTBing, CR18s for commuting and light touring. I wouldn't call this rims the best--- Mavic are stronger---- but the performance is very good for the price.

Also it's possible to for fate to destroy any rim-- a rock in the road, a pothole, ect. Some rims last a long time. some rims don't. You can't make a bulletproof wheel, so don't even bother to try.
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Old 02-03-07, 01:00 PM   #10
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Take a look at the Interloc Racing Design (IRD) Clyde Road/Cross rims.......
http://www.interlocracing.com/rims.html
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Old 02-03-07, 02:15 PM   #11
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I'm partial to the DT Swiss TK7.1 Trekking rims, as solid as they get.
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Old 02-03-07, 03:07 PM   #12
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greenstork,

DT swiss makes really good wheel parts. Pair those rims with DT Swiss hubs (340s) and DT spokes, and you're looking at a really good wheel.

The down side is that DT Swiss touring wheels cost as much a Trek 520-- not the wheels, but the whole frinkin' bike (used, say 3 years old)

Are these wheels worth it? Ah, maybe? I wouldn't buy them, but some people do.
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Old 02-03-07, 04:05 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tacomee
greenstork,

DT swiss makes really good wheel parts. Pair those rims with DT Swiss hubs (340s) and DT spokes, and you're looking at a really good wheel.

The down side is that DT Swiss touring wheels cost as much a Trek 520-- not the wheels, but the whole frinkin' bike (used, say 3 years old)

Are these wheels worth it? Ah, maybe? I wouldn't buy them, but some people do.
The TK7.1 rims are $70-80. Sure, that's maybe $10 more per rim than a Mavic A719, but let's not go overboard here, the rims are comparably priced.
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Old 02-03-07, 04:15 PM   #14
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I think the wholesale price is like...$45 at QBP. One reason it go with those TK7.1 rims is that they are supported by QBP and easy to find if you need another one. Very nice option.

Those DT Swiss hubs..... they are really good as well, but priced like Chris King. $500 a set retail. Adding the rims/spokes/hubs.... well, these would be really be $$$ wheels.

But I'd bet these would by among the strongest, best wheels made, reguardless of price.
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Old 02-03-07, 06:30 PM   #15
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"Is the Mavic A719 simply the best or is there something even better?"

I really throw my hands up when it comes to technical issues around wheels. I know the list of wheels I haven't broken... What follows is the non-technical story of woe of the touring wheel rim. If there is a point to this I guess it would be that this is a contentious issue and it helps to know the source of the heat. For technical fights and counter fights, try the guys at googles rec.bicycles.tech

719 comes from the Mavic tradition that includes some of the best rims made. The characteristics of those rims where: low weight, simple extrusions; raw aluminum surfaces so as not to incur stress cracks from thick anodizing coatings (colour coats may be OK), while retaining good braking; manufacturers had not yet added unneeded features such as welded joints, or machined walls that may degrade the product; have double eyelets; must be used in sufficient spoke numbers (36 on 700C) to properly support the thinner rim. When all these factors are met you have the best combination of lightness durability and cost without compromising any elements.

The best rim ever made, according to legend, was the MA2 (I have my NOS stock). It had all the above features. But Mavic tossed it overboard and added successors of dubious worth but far greater expense such as the A719. However, of the successors, the A719 is the only one with the "essential" double eyelets. While the boards seems more loquacious about technical issues and reviling the present options, I think the A719 is where tech group MA2 proponents would go for solace if the MA2 NOS was not available to them.

The bad bits about the A719 compared to the earlier Mavics are: Milled sidewalls; greater unnecessary weight and size; I'm not sure about the anodisation; more costly. As far as I know these problems are present to some extent with all the modern dis-improved wheels.

"Is the Velocity Dyad better or worse than the A719?"

I have these on a recumbent, but I haven't put enough miles on it to have an opinion. The lifespan issue will be sidewall wear and dings if one goes into holes etc... which neither style is immune to. Velocity makes high spoke count rims, in the smart 26" size which is a limitation in the Mavic offerings.

Are the Dyads pinned?

I don't know, but in theory it's no advantage even if they are. Once you have them built they will hold together without anything other than a butt joint.

I really like the DT stuff: the spokes are a wash since I would probably use them anyway; The hubs aren't too bad for the cassette pricing. You either want upper level hubs or you don't, but if you do these are among the more affordable for the quality and options available. I have seen the rears for as little as 240 which is pretty good. I'm not familiar with the rims but considering they lead in the other catagories...

Last edited by NoReg; 02-03-07 at 06:43 PM.
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Old 02-03-07, 07:20 PM   #16
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After much (too much) debate and research, I 'm going to get Ambrosio Reba rims for the wheels on my new touring bike the shop building my bike has had real good luck with them. Kind of cool rims with double eyeletes, and a triple channel.

I'm big and have always road Ryno and Ryno Lites, not fancy, heavy and wide but very very strong, but I felt they where too wide for a 700 wheel touring bike.

Some of my other choices, (and the reason for not using)
Mavics, the quality has slipped in the last few years (according to the frame builder),
Velocity Dyads no eyelets the wheel builder likes eyelets.
DT Treking, nice rims but expensive and very similar to the Rebas.

Did I make the right choice? Ask me again this time next year.
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Old 02-03-07, 07:47 PM   #17
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The folks at Rivendell really like Velocity Synergy rims.
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Old 02-04-07, 02:52 PM   #18
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Well, I ended up getting two sets of Mavic A719's on ebay

One pair of new A719, 36 spoke, black
One pair of new A719, 40 spoke, black. 120 shipped for all 4 rims

Now I still haven't bought hubs(except for one 36 hole front hope hub), any recommendations on a 40 hole rear hub for 9 speed cassette?

I'm going to run 36 in front, 40 in rear and build a matching set for another bike.
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