Miles2go

The FLT Gallery has reached about 765 submissions and 255 of those have posted for all to enjoy.

One of these days I'll calculate how many different countries the images are from. The latest few additions added Brazil and Guinea. These new bikes are interesting, as always.

*****The Fully Loaded Touring Bike - Photo Gallery*****

LINKS PAGE NEWS:

After the holidays pass (perhaps before New Year's Eve) some changes will be made to the links page.

**** If you currently have a link on the FLT links page, you may be losing it. You'll want to contact me through the website. If you have a bike in the gallery and have a touring related website that's not on the links page, you'll want to contact me through the website. A *new page* is on the horizon! ****

Happy Holidays!

Miles2go

OH NOOOOO

You'll likely know what I mean when you have a look at image #256.

Cheers,

InTheRain

I guess you'll have to point it out to me. The only thing I spot right off the bat is that his brooks is getting soaked while everything else is staying dry. I guess he has to wait a while ride until the saddle dries out unless he wants to take the chance of stretching it too much.

AEO

ahh... brooks taking a beating in the rain...

jibi

Maybe Miles was just getting more hits for the gallery LOL

Come on Miles, what is it about 256? Seems the same to me, except its a Giant.

and there is no trailer, which we all know is the future of touring, ahead of my time am I
george

Miles2go

Hey Jibi,

Believe me (or don't), the gallery gets enough hits on its own. Incredible numbers really. One of the best bits of volunteer work I've done. And it's only going to get better.

Hmmm, trailers are the future? That's funny because they're in my past. Still have 'em but they're covered in dust. To each their own and all that. I won't say I'll never use a trailer again. Never say never! I will say that the bikes we toured on pulling the trailers didn't make it into the FLT Gallery either. Probably because the bikes weren't fully loaded, just the trailers were. Nothing less of a tour of course. Seems we covered this some time ago, yes?

I cringed when I saw the shot in question, as I've lost a B17 to the rain myself. Full fendered bike, saddle well covered with proofhide top to bottom, and I covered it each time I dismounted the bike. I was touring in the rain all day though and it did her in. By day five it was toast.

Tailwinds!

jibi

Hey Miles

My post was all in fun, I know you get lots of hits.
when we covered the ground , and a few other things I believe I supported your right to choose whatever you wanted for your gallery.

I must use more smilies next time to get the intended humour across
George

Miles2go

Hey I knew you where having fun and I'd wonder what was up if you weren't. Nothing negative at all and perhaps I should have thrown out a few more .

Well, back to surveying the bike room. I have to decide how much of our touring gear we're keeping vs how much is destined for an auction listing. I swung in here to take a break. Could be moving to the city very soon and I'll probably need to shift a few more bikes to bottom of my sig line.

Not cutting back at the FLT Gallery though... A new page to ponder hits the site with the new year.


Cheers!

jibi

Cheers mate

good luck with the continuing saga that is the FLT Gallery.

Happy New Year as well.

But it is sad to hear of the possible disposal of bikes, I hope they go to worthy recipeints

george

nun

I've always wondered at the FLT submission guidelines that demand panniers front and rear as it excludes many tourists who use modern equipment and have reduced both gear weight and volume. As a result the site is a bit one dimensional.

john bono

My question is why does he require front panniers with a trailer? Isn't the whole point of a trailer that once loaded, panniers are unnecessary?

Turd Ferguson

Good link.

Looking at those pictures I get the impression people carry to much unecessary items. Far too many.

nun

I've no idea, but it is his/her own site so the rules can be anything that they want, but I think the definition of fully loaded touring is a bit passe. Also the bikes look to be way overloaded, I've never understood what appears to be the pride some tourers have at how much they can carry

Miles2go

Heh heh heh,

Oh where do I start... Let's see.

First off, thanks for the quote in your first reply. Of nearly 800 submissions, only about 20 of those not making it are due to bikes not qualifying. So nearly all of the submissions that haven't been included in the gallery didn't qualify because of image quality or image size.

"modern equipment", that's a good one.

The FLT Gallery represents the majority of long distance self-supported tourers. I don't have the time or resources required to make FLT a "free for all" and therefore I'm not sweating it. If you have a better idea then go for it. Be ready though. I couldn't imagine how much more time and $ this would take if I loosened the FLT standards.

Before you choose to argue the fact that FLT represents the majority, go over to Crazyguy where you can sort diaries by duration. Pick the 1-3 month diaries and look at last ten that are in "completed status". That's a nice little cross section that I have no impact on (in fact I don't think any have submitted to FLT). Pull up each journal's thumbnails and scan through for their bikes. I just did this and every single one of the tourer's bikes would qualify for the FLT Gallery. Hmmm, if I may be so bold to say, they must be using dated equipment, are trying to be macho or just don't know what they're doing. Otherwise they wouldn't be carrying so much.


Back to packing.


Cheers,

foamy

miles2go, I just wanted to tell you that I really appreciate your FLT Gallery site. It's fun, inspirational and educational. And I just like going through the photos. Keep up the great work and thanks!

nun

Miles2go,
What you put on your website is of course completely up to you. I imagine that you get so few inappropriate submissions because people who don't use 4 panniers simply don't submit. I feel this makes the site less interesting than it could be.

I completely agree that most tourers use 4 panniers, but that's because they are just following the received wisdom. A better guideline would be to just say unsupported touring, ie no motel stays or sag wagons.

Re your crazyguy spot survey, I imagine you are correct, but long distance 1st world unsupported touring can be done comfortably with only a couple of rear panniers, or with a saddlebag and handlebar bag, and a couple of stuff sacks. I have no experience of expedition touring so I can't comment on that. Just because its on Crazyguy doesn't make it the only, or best way, to tour. I use a small handlebar bag, a Nelson Longflap saddlebag, strap my tent under my saddle and my sleeping pad and cooking gear to a small front rack al la Henry Kingman. My gear weight varies between 20 and 25lbs. I've never felt deprived on tour and I love being able to get out of the saddle easily every so often on hills etc. With less volume and weight I enjoy the cycling more.

Many of the folks on crazyguy are experienced tourers and I'm sure they are doing it they way they have always done it, with heavy tents (2lbs plus) bulky clothing, but I submit that it can be done better. If more people ditched a couple of panniers, used ultralight equipment and thought a little more critically about their gear choices they would be able to carry everything they needed but at considerably less volume and weight. But its all a personal choice, I just think my way is better.

DukeArcher 

I have never understood the pride some tourers have at how little they carry, but when in camp at the end of the day, use all your food and ogle your fold-out chair and book collection.

Injati

LOL - Well said...

jibi

I too have had this debate with Miles2go, on several forums, and remember it is his personal website, he is not saying it's the best or even the only way to tour. He has the right to think the same, ones own chosen way is the "best".

I choose, after over 35 years of both touring, and expeditions, to ride with the gear I have on this odessey around Australia, and I choose to use an Ibex trailer, with no panniers in sight. I have chosen MY personal preferences too

It is called the "FULLY" loaded gallery, or as some of us say the FUNNY loaded, but in the end it's Miles' gallery and he calls the shots.

also
I would never use other people's food, or ogle their fold up seat.

Nun

You always have to option to start your own lightweight, intelligent or whatever gallery

george

Miles2go

Geez George, with all the noise you're making over this, it sounds like you're the one that needs to produce a gallery for the trailer only tourers or whatever. Why don't you do that? NUN, why don't you produce a ultra-light tourer gallery? If your approaches are better and you're so vocal about it, why not give back to touring and make something of what you feel so passionate about?

Jibi, you can try jumping on NUN's bandwagon but the last time I saw your trailer, you weren't carrying as little as he'd like you to.

99.9 percent of the people tuned in here are smart enough to know that most tourers consider their gear very carefully and are also smart enough to realize where their own balance is....

....Just go on insulting them though.

Thanks for brightening my day guys!


Happy 2008 everyone!

staehpj1

Sounds like a fairy tale to me, but if it isn't it is your own fault for letting them.

My experience is that most tourists are pretty self sufficient and aren't all that inclined to mooch food or gear off of other riders. They might not turn down stuff that was offered first, but if you offer then it doesn't leave much room for you to complain IMO.

If anything the ultralight guys I have run into seem to take more pride in not accepting stuff.

staehpj1

A poor guideline for the following reasons:
1. You can't tell from the picture whether someone stayed in a motel or had sag support for some portion of the trip.
2. I can't see why a motel stay should disqualify someone. Many ride self supported and get a room once in a while as a treat or break. Getting a room once a month on tour hardly seems like grounds for disqualification as self supported.
3. Getting sag support for a minor portion of a tour doesn't mean you weren't self supported for the majority of a tour. For example during our TA we had a few days of sag in Virginia when we were near relatives homes. I hardly think that having sag for a few days negates the rest of the Summer where we didn't.

When it all comes down to it... It is the decision of the owner of the site and he can and should do as he pleases.

nun

I agree with everything you say, its all about personal preference and Miles2go is to be commended for doing the FLT site. If I was to start a touring bike picture site I'd want to include every way of unsupported touring so that people could see the variety. My main criticism of the FLT site is that its boring.

nun

Good points, when I said no Sag wagon I meant that you shouldn't be followed by one every day. Accepting a serendipitous lift wouldn't disqualify you. Also we all do the odd motel stay, just not every night.

Maybe saying that the load should include a shelter and a sleeping system would be a better criterion. But I'm really not sold on that either, in fact I would probably just want to say if you consider yourself a touring cyclist send in a picture with a gear list and a description of how you tour.

nun

Miles2go, I'm glad that we can bring so many smiles to your day, you seem like a very happy person.

I'm not trying to insult the FLTs by saying that I think they carry more weight than necessary. I'm here to lighten their loads and take some weight off their wheels. Maybe I'm a bit evangelistic about it,
but after touring with 50lbs plus of gear in the 80s I can emphatically say that touring with 25lbs of gear is more fun and just as comfortable. If tourists have investigated the lightweight gear options out there and rejected them then ok, but many times they don't know about them